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Mike Schmidt - Cheater ?

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  • FrenchyLefebvre
    replied
    Guys,
    I think getting lost in this are the key words in Schmidt's statement: "bit on a couple of times" ... as a twenty-something. That would put him back in the '70s. And it was no secret that the Phillies' clubhouse had them in abundance in that era. But any diehard Phillies fan could, most likely, could guess the players who were on them.

    If videos were available for review for games throughout his career, people who watched him every game could put big money on picking those couple of games out (he'd be more "peppy" in those, actually very un-Schmidt-like).

    Philly probably gave him the biggest cheers those couple of games he was "pepped up". He made everything he did look so cool & easy that that's why he got booed so bad ("too laid back").

    Just for laughs, I would pay good money to watch those couple of games with Schmidt on greenies
    Now I can better imagine Bob Newhart on crack for a couple of shows! LOL.

    Not to defend the habitual users of the drugs mentioned. But in Schmidt's case -- Heck, who hasn't tried pot when they were at that age & everyone was shoving it in your face? (His greenies, equivalent to our pot, as far as the respective situations/peer pressure).
    Last edited by FrenchyLefebvre; 03-11-2006, 07:11 PM.

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  • SideWalks Of Ny
    replied
    [QUOTE=hiddengem]
    Originally posted by SideWalks Of Ny
    Some of what I'm saying is an opinion, a lot is from what I've read and heard.

    Exactly my point.


    I know Tom, have worked out with him, and he will tell you flat out, that he had no clue what he was doing.


    Interesting.



    Like he said, "he took things cold turkey" he no idea what he was taking or what any of them were used for. No wonder he had so many problems.
    I agree with all of this, As I said before It's a pale comparison to bonds stacking because bonds most likely knew more about it, and what to do, still from what the book states, and from what i've read, if he took all of those steroids at the sametime, I cant see how he would of avoided injuries or even death.

    BTW, Interesting that you knew house, is his original statement about steroids being rampant in the 60's and 70's true ?

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  • SideWalks Of Ny
    replied
    Originally posted by Sultan_1895-1948
    You're right. I probably worded that wrong when I said they were taken to decrease side effects of the others. They do all serve their own purpose, you're right, usually those purposes compliment eachother very nicely. Such with the HGH and the Clomid. Why the cattle roid though HG, what do you know about that. All I've heard is that it improves the quality of muscle in cattle. Does it have something to do with the fibers in the muscle? Or do you know?
    HGH is used for the ligament benefits that most players use it in combination with steroids because it will prevent the ligament and connective tissue injuries as well as failure thats associated with Anabolic Steroid use.

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  • hiddengem
    replied
    [QUOTE=SideWalks Of Ny] Some of what I'm saying is an opinion, a lot is from what I've read and heard.

    Exactly my point.
    Tom house had stacked multiple steroids at the sametime during his pitching career, and said it only caused him problems. Granted, He wasnt working with the best guy's like bonds was, but he also ( according to him atleast) wasnt using as many steroids as the book states bonds did
    I know Tom, have worked out with him, and he will tell you flat out, that he had no clue what he was doing.
    The good thing is, we know now. There's a lot more research and understanding."
    Interesting.

    " House said he gained almost 30 pounds while using steroids, blaming the extra weight for contributing to knee problems. He said the drugs helped improve recovery time and conditioning but did not add velocity to his fastball.
    Like he said, "he took things cold turkey" he no idea what he was taking or what any of them were used for. No wonder he had so many problems.

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  • SideWalks Of Ny
    replied
    Originally posted by hiddengem
    Oh wait, you said that a baseball player that stacked steroids would hinder their performance.



    Could you explain to me the beniftes of using Winstrol alone? What properties does Winstrol have?



    And what might these be? Just trying to get an understanding of your level of knowledge on the subject.


    Oh, you mean Clomid, the drug that is used by males to combat estrogen?


    And your point? I take 20 pills a day,most at the same time. Been doing it for years. I'm doing just fine.



    Great, lets just leave it that way.
    I'm sure how to quote eachstatement one by one, So I'll respond to them all one by one.

    1.) Yes, that's exactly what I said, see tom house.

    2.) I believe winstrol is used to lose fat while retaining lean body mass. It's very potent and strong.

    3.) Beats me, I dont even know what horse steroids are, which is what house used.

    4.) Guess so.

    5.) 20 tablets of Stanozolol ?

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  • Sultan_1895-1948
    replied
    Originally posted by hiddengem
    This is true, but the main reason a player stacks steroids, is because they all have different properities and do different things. And yes at the end of a cycle, clomid is taken to fight estrogen build up until the body starts producing test on its own again. This also, helps the athelte to keep more of the gains he's made.
    You're right. I probably worded that wrong when I said they were taken to decrease side effects of the others. They do all serve their own purpose, you're right, usually those purposes compliment eachother very nicely. Such with the HGH and the Clomid. Why the cattle roid though HG, what do you know about that. All I've heard is that it improves the quality of muscle in cattle. Does it have something to do with the fibers in the muscle? Or do you know?

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  • hiddengem
    replied
    Originally posted by Sultan_1895-1948
    The point of stacking isn't necessarily to keep adding more and more and more muscle. The point of stacking is to decrease the side effects of one steroid with another. When you give yourself high doses of testosterone, your body gets fooled into thinking that it doesn't have to produce as much as it naturally does. For some reason, estrogen levels increase and guys can grow boobs and crap, so then Clomid is taken. They all serve a specific purpose, and Bonds' guys understood this. They had the knowledge. He wasn't blindly taking stuff just to take it. The whole mix ends up being a well oiled machine in the end.
    This is true, but the main reason a player stacks steroids, is because they all have different properities and do different things. And yes at the end of a cycle, clomid is taken to fight estrogen build up until the body starts producing test on its own again. This also, helps the athelte to keep more of the gains he's made.

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  • Sultan_1895-1948
    replied
    The point of stacking isn't necessarily to keep adding more and more and more muscle. The point of stacking is to decrease the side effects of one steroid with another. When you give yourself high doses of testosterone, your body gets fooled into thinking that it doesn't have to produce as much as it naturally does. For some reason, estrogen levels increase and guys can grow boobs and crap, so then Clomid is taken. HGH increases bone mass, which helps your body deal with the added weight being put on. Bonds' frame wasn't meant to be 240 plain and simple. All the drugs serve a specific purpose. He wasn't blindly taking stuff just to take it. The whole mix ends up being a well oiled machine in the end.

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  • hiddengem
    replied
    Originally posted by SideWalks Of Ny
    I know what the term stacking is, I've known people who've stacked steroids before.
    Oh wait, you said that a baseball player that stacked steroids would hinder their performance.

    The book claims bonds stacked winstrol ( a very strong steroid itself, could easily be used alone)
    Could you explain to me the beniftes of using Winstrol alone? What properties does Winstrol have?

    with cow steroids
    And what might these be? Just trying to get an understanding of your level of knowledge on the subject.

    steroids for females
    Oh, you mean Clomid, the drug that is used by males to combat estrogen?

    and he was popping TWENTY pills at the sametime
    And your point? I take 20 pills a day,most at the same time. Been doing it for years. I'm doing just fine.


    I just dont believe it
    Great, lets just leave it that way.

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  • Sultan_1895-1948
    replied
    Originally posted by SideWalks Of Ny
    I know what the term stacking is, I've known people who've stacked steroids before. I've even talked to them about what the book states bonds was taking, and how much, ALL of them said it was completly ridiculous, and that if it were true, he had no idea what he was doing. The book claims bonds stacked winstrol ( a very strong steroid itself, could easily be used alone), with cow steroids, steroids for females, HGH, and he was popping TWENTY pills at the sametime, good god, if this were true, how he's not dead yet is beyond me. The book specifically points out that bonds became such an " expert " at it, that he would control his own regimens and dosages, So if he was taking 20 pills under anderson's care, imagine on his own....

    I just dont believe it, it could possibly be true, and if it is, he's a complete idiot and a drug addict, but given his recent performance and his health, I dont believe he was stacking up on various steroids at the sametime as the book states. I believe he used them, lots of them, but in moderation to achieve the best results. This guy is a health nut for crying out loud, I highly doubt he would endanger himself by taking multiple steroids in huge dosages at the sametime.
    How addictive are steroids. How psychologically dependent do you become on them, when you see the type of results he was seeing. When you become superhuman, the thought of not being that way anymore, has to drive you to either continue to do it, or to do even more. Maybe I'm wrong, you tell me.

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  • SideWalks Of Ny
    replied
    Originally posted by hiddengem
    Oh, is this so? And you have experience stacking steroids while playing baseball?

    Well, I play baseball, but I dont take steroids, though I know athletes who take book steroids and greenies, and benefit from them both when properly used.


    Please stop. You are spewing garbage from your mouth that you have no clue about. You only know what the media has told you about theses guy's lives.
    The media doesnt say anything remotely close to what I'm saying, Infact the complete opposite. Some of what I'm saying is an opinion, a lot is from what I've read and heard.

    Tom house had stacked multiple steroids at the sametime during his pitching career, and said it only caused him problems. Granted, He wasnt working with the best guy's like bonds was, but he also ( according to him atleast) wasnt using as many steroids as the book states bonds did.

    From the article - " I pretty much popped everything cold turkey," House said. "We were doing steroids they wouldn't give to horses. That was the '60s, when nobody knew. The good thing is, we know now. There's a lot more research and understanding."

    " House said he gained almost 30 pounds while using steroids, blaming the extra weight for contributing to knee problems. He said the drugs helped improve recovery time and conditioning but did not add velocity to his fastball.

    "I tried everything known to man to improve my fastball, and it still didn't go faster than 82 miles per hour," House said. "I was a failed experiment."
    http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2052364

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  • SideWalks Of Ny
    replied
    Originally posted by Sultan_1895-1948
    Steroids are indeed dangerous and nobody is denying that.

    The term "stacking" came about because people do it, and it is effective. Sure, if you just blindly stack various forms without the proper advice on how much to take and how long to take it, then it's VERY dangerous. Bonds was getting the proper advice. He had some of the most knowledgable people around regarding the use of that stuff. When it's done properly, "stacking" is very beneficial. Not sure how you can say it isn't.
    I know what the term stacking is, I've known people who've stacked steroids before. I've even talked to them about what the book states bonds was taking, and how much, ALL of them said it was completly ridiculous, and that if it were true, he had no idea what he was doing. The book claims bonds stacked winstrol ( a very strong steroid itself, could easily be used alone), with cow steroids, steroids for females, HGH, and he was popping TWENTY pills at the sametime, good god, if this were true, how he's not dead yet is beyond me. The book specifically points out that bonds became such an " expert " at it, that he would control his own regimens and dosages, So if he was taking 20 pills under anderson's care, imagine on his own....

    I just dont believe it, it could possibly be true, and if it is, he's a complete idiot and a drug addict, but given his recent performance and his health, I dont believe he was stacking up on various steroids at the sametime as the book states. I believe he used them, lots of them, but in moderation to achieve the best results. This guy is a health nut for crying out loud, I highly doubt he would endanger himself by taking multiple steroids in huge dosages at the sametime.

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  • hiddengem
    replied
    Originally posted by SideWalks Of Ny
    And the thing is, I dont think giambi was using anywhere near the amount of steroids at the sametime as book states bonds did.
    This is the key word that should be noted to all your posts.

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  • hiddengem
    replied
    Originally posted by SideWalks Of Ny
    Taking multiple types of steroids at the same time wouldnt benefit a baseball player at all. It would cause them serious injury problems, and it would hinder their performance.
    Oh, is this so? And you have experience stacking steroids while playing baseball?

    When using the drug you use it in moderation, if bonds was taking steroids in stacks at the sametime as the book says, he would of been out of baseball years ago and Either in the sameboat caminiti or azado were in.
    Please stop. You are spewing garbage from your mouth that you have no clue about. You only know what the media has told you about theses guy's lives.

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  • hiddengem
    replied
    Originally posted by ESPNFan
    Well if you think the only comment that has any truth to it was about the dependance factors of the drug then your pretty ignorant.

    In your own statement you say it makes you "feel" more amped, more alert. Thats right you FEEL that way because its stimulating your nervous system. Its raising your heartrate your temperature and your blood pressure. Its all initiated psychologically and all those raised levels of activity in your body might make you "feel" more energized but their putting your body into a very dangerous territory. Amphetamines provide no caloric value so they themselves do not give the player energy, infact they suppress the urge to eat robbing him of future energy resources. So to gain this "energy" your body is stimulated form the central nervous system and begins to burn the body's stored energy. This results in the raised levels of resperatory fuction.
    At rest the higher your heart rate the less work and endurance your going to have. If you have a lower heart rate at rest the more capasity
    for endurance your going to have.
    Have you ever taken a real "greenie" from Mexico?
    This is why it killed steve Bechler it rasied his heart rate blood preasue and body temperature to a level that was already very elevated. Couple that with trying to work out at a high level in a very warm environment and it produced the fatal heatstoke that killed him and Corey Stringer. But your probably right, I bet they felt very "peppy" and "energised" till their organs were starting to shut down.
    So why is it that MILLIONS of people used ephedra the right way and had ZERO problems. But the 2 guys you mention here, that had no clue how to take it, are the ones that died? You tell me?

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