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Ryan Braun busted for PED use; faces 50 day ban

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  • @ Shoeless.

    Guilty until proven innocent?

    Comment


    • The tester took the sample home and put it in his fridge??? Really, really??? That is just so so absurd. How does anyone vote for the validity of the test. That is mindbogglingly amateurish. Not that I'm a scientist but aren't those supposed to be in some controlled environment not next to the mayo in a fridge opend 86 times over the weekend.

      Also it's unfortunate for Braun that libel and other laws are the way they are. The reporters that broke the original story, in a fair world, would take out full page billboards or something apologizing and admitting they went with half a story before all the facts were out. IMO they are equally ans hamfisted as the foolish tester (and me for ranting on without probably knowing all the facts either).

      Comment


      • Originally posted by NJYankeeFan View Post
        @ Shoeless.

        Guilty until proven innocent?
        I never judged him guilty even with all that appeared in print. I was waiting for the hearing to take place.
        Since it was tossed out before that, he has to be judged innocent legally but anyone in the public could still have their doubt because of how it all ended.

        Comment


        • Here is something people need to look at; rather than defend his innocence, his attorneys looked for loopholes in the case. He wasn't really interested in clearing his name or establishing his innocence, he was interested in winning this case. Which he did. He didn't attack the charges head on, he looked for a backdoor and found one. Why did he go that route? Because it was easier than actually defending his innocence against the facts.

          This whole thing makes me vomit!

          The fact that he tested positive, the fact that the system allows chain of custody to be broken, the fact that he was given the MVP despite the pending allegations, the fact that the man's HIPPA rights were violated by ESPN, maybe the testing source, maybe MLB, and the fact that he is being released from responsibility because of a technicality.


          Nice going, Selig! The "integrity of the game" is just bully with you in charge!!! <<--- Sarcasm

          I can say that my respect for Braun diminished greatly and my admiration for Selig went below what I thought was possible. I can't wait for his era to end.
          Sickening!
          Last edited by doctor_gogol; 02-24-2012, 04:47 AM.
          Vintage Photos of Detroit Ballparks:
          http://www.flickr.com/photos/doctor_gogol/sets/

          http://www.flickr.com/photos/46267068@N04/sets/

          Comment


          • Originally posted by doctor_gogol View Post
            Here is something people need to look at; rather than defend his innocence, his attorneys looked for loopholes in the case. He wasn't really interested in clearing his name or establishing his innocence, he was interested in winning this case. Which he did. He didn't attack the charges head on, he looked for a backdoor and found one. Why did he go that route? Because it was easier than actually defending his innocence against the facts.

            This whole thing makes me vomit!

            The fact that he tested positive, the fact that the system allows chain of custody to be broken, the fact that he was given the MVP despite the pending allegations, the fact that the man's HIPPA rights were violated by ESPN, maybe the testing source, maybe MLB, and the fact that he is being released from responsibility because of a technicality.


            Nice going, Selig! The "integrity of the game" is just bully with you in charge!!! <<--- Sarcasm

            I can say that my respect for Braun diminished greatly and my admiration for Selig went below what I thought was possible. I can't wait for his era to end.
            Sickening!
            So let me ask you this.........How does his lawyer battle a false positive? The tests said his levels of test were insanely high. Higher than they have ever seen. Isn't that a red flag? Doesn't that deserve a re-test? Especially from a player that already pases 3 tests in 2011.

            Did Braun take Roids? I don't know either way neither do you. The problem is a story was leaked to the politically correct, holier than thou public before it should have been. That's the real crime here.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Paulypal View Post
              So let me ask you this.........How does his lawyer battle a false positive? The tests said his levels of test were insanely high. Higher than they have ever seen. Isn't that a red flag? Doesn't that deserve a re-test? Especially from a player that already pases 3 tests in 2011.

              Did Braun take Roids? I don't know either way neither do you. The problem is a story was leaked to the politically correct, holier than thou public before it should have been. That's the real crime here.
              How do you battle a false positive? 1) by battling the "false positive". They did not! 2) by establishing scientific flaws in the testing procedure. They did not.

              They went for a loophole in the rules instead.

              Retesting would be entirely pointless after the substance has worked though his system.

              There are several crimes here. But Braun wasn't found innocent, he was released from the charges due to chain of custody. And past innocence doesn't establish current guilt.

              So you can wag your finger all you want at people who are disappointed by Braun, MLB and the testers, but the fact remains; he tested positive and his reputation is tarnished. Rightfully so.

              The day Ryan Braun dies, this will be the lead story in his obit. Guaranteed.
              Last edited by doctor_gogol; 02-24-2012, 05:47 AM.
              Vintage Photos of Detroit Ballparks:
              http://www.flickr.com/photos/doctor_gogol/sets/

              http://www.flickr.com/photos/46267068@N04/sets/

              Comment


              • Originally posted by doctor_gogol View Post
                There are several crimes here. But Braun wasn't found innocent, he was released from the charges due to chain of custody. And past innocence doesn't establish current guilt.

                So you can wag your finger all you want at people who are disappointed by Braun, MLB and the testers, but the fact remains; he tested positive and his reputation is tarnished. Rightfully so.

                The day Ryan Braun dies, this will be the lead story in his obit. Guaranteed.
                How do you know it didn't test positive because of the way the sample was (mis)handled. Recently here there was some police officer that got into trouble for manufacturing evidence.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by PVNICK View Post
                  How do you know it didn't test positive because of the way the sample was (mis)handled. Recently here there was some police officer that got into trouble for manufacturing evidence.
                  That would be a crime. Do you have evidence of this?
                  Vintage Photos of Detroit Ballparks:
                  http://www.flickr.com/photos/doctor_gogol/sets/

                  http://www.flickr.com/photos/46267068@N04/sets/

                  Comment


                  • Ryan Braun is innocent and rightfully won his appeal. Deal with it and move on with your life.
                    My top 10 players:

                    1. Babe Ruth
                    2. Barry Bonds
                    3. Ty Cobb
                    4. Ted Williams
                    5. Willie Mays
                    6. Alex Rodriguez
                    7. Hank Aaron
                    8. Honus Wagner
                    9. Lou Gehrig
                    10. Mickey Mantle

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by doctor_gogol View Post
                      Here is something people need to look at; rather than defend his innocence, his attorneys looked for loopholes in the case. He wasn't really interested in clearing his name or establishing his innocence, he was interested in winning this case. Which he did. He didn't attack the charges head on, he looked for a backdoor and found one. Why did he go that route? Because it was easier than actually defending his innocence against the facts.

                      This whole thing makes me vomit!
                      Yet this sort of thing happens all the time. Any lawyer worth his money is going to first ensure proper procedure was followed. If it was not followed, that's the easiest way to defend your client. His lawyers had to have known that simply retesting would not accomplish anything to instill doubt in the validity of the test.

                      The fact that he tested positive, the fact that the system allows chain of custody to be broken, the fact that he was given the MVP despite the pending allegations, the fact that the man's HIPPA rights were violated by ESPN, maybe the testing source, maybe MLB, and the fact that he is being released from responsibility because of a technicality.
                      He tested positive. That was the end result. It's always possible for the chain of custody to be broken. It happens in more serious matters like rape and murder cases as well. Many people call this a technicality, but it's the responsibility of those who are paid to handle the evidence to follow proper procedures. If you're sloppy, you're going to lose cases.


                      I can say that my respect for Braun diminished greatly and my admiration for Selig went below what I thought was possible. I can't wait for his era to end.
                      Sickening!
                      You're certainly free to not respect him. Guilty or innocent, every case should be handled using proper procedures. It's not worth compromising that just to get someone.
                      RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by PVNICK View Post
                        How do you know it didn't test positive because of the way the sample was (mis)handled. Recently here there was some police officer that got into trouble for manufacturing evidence.
                        I'm not a scientist, but I don't see how urine sitting in a cup could start spawning huge amounts of testosterone. Of course the courier screwed up protocol so badly that any chance of anybody knowing anything for sure is completely gone. Braun is one of my favorite NL players so I really want to give him the benefit of the doubt. But when I look at the facts, along with the last 10-15 years of big stars being exposed, I have a hard time believing him. I hope he clears it up today at his press conference, but I don't see what he can say will convince doubters of his innocence. Of all the ways this had to end, this is one of the worst. It's just going to sit as a lingering question for years to come.

                        Originally posted by GiambiJuice View Post
                        Ryan Braun is innocent and rightfully won his appeal. Deal with it and move on with your life.
                        Finally a convincing argument for his innocence. Why didn't I think of that?

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by GiambiJuice View Post
                          Ryan Braun is innocent and rightfully won his appeal. Deal with it and move on with your life.
                          Braun won his case on a technicality. That doesn't support his innocence (or Guilt). I doubt if the outcome of this case is going to change many peoples minds.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by doctor_gogol View Post

                            They went for a loophole in the rules instead.
                            We don't really know that.

                            Let me say that again: WE DO NOT KNOW ANY FACTS

                            Here's a good article on this:
                            http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...SPJD1NBHS2.DTL


                            We know what's being reported is 100% back channel stuff because the agreement that MLB has handcuffs them (and the labor union) from making any of the details public. It may have been done with the right intentions of shielding a player's privacy, the in cases like this the uncertainty makes it look bad for Braun.
                            For all we know, the panel cynically used this loophole for political reasons. We are not allowed to know the facts, only the result.

                            Which was innocent.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by EdTarbusz View Post
                              Braun won his case on a technicality. That doesn't support his innocence (or Guilt). I doubt if the outcome of this case is going to change many peoples minds.
                              I guess I fail to see how this is merely a technicality. The sample was mishandled and is therefore worthless. How can you suspend someone for 50 games and make him lose millions of dollars when the urine sample was compromised so blatantly?

                              Whoever gave the example of the bloody murder weapon that gets taken home by an officer, washed, and used to bake a cake with, that was a good example. This sample should be worth as much as that knife in a murder case.
                              My top 10 players:

                              1. Babe Ruth
                              2. Barry Bonds
                              3. Ty Cobb
                              4. Ted Williams
                              5. Willie Mays
                              6. Alex Rodriguez
                              7. Hank Aaron
                              8. Honus Wagner
                              9. Lou Gehrig
                              10. Mickey Mantle

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by GiambiJuice View Post
                                I guess I fail to see how this is merely a technicality. The sample was mishandled and is therefore worthless. .
                                That's why this was a technicality. Because of the mishandling of the speciman case.

                                Comment

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