Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Brett Lawrie is the best player in baseball according to WAR

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Brett Lawrie is the best player in baseball according to WAR

    Apparently his defense is so good, that according to WAR he is having a better season than Joey Votto, who currently has a 201 OPS+.
    Last edited by fenrir; 06-25-2012, 04:39 PM.

  • #2
    Originally posted by fenrir View Post
    Apparently his defense is so good, that according to WAR he is having a better season than Joey Votto, who currently has a 201 OP+.
    I hear he has such a high war too because they sometimes shift him to short left field which raises his defensive war alot. I guess it gives him more range maybe.
    "(Shoeless Joe Jackson's fall from grace is one of the real tragedies of baseball. I always thought he was more sinned against than sinning." -- Connie Mack

    "I have the ultimate respect for Whitesox fans. They were as miserable as the Cubs and Redsox fans ever were but always had the good decency to keep it to themselves. And when they finally won the World Series, they celebrated without annoying every other fan in the country."--Jim Caple, ESPN (Jan. 12, 2011)

    Comment


    • #3
      Lawrie has 3.3 defensive WAR in just 68 games! That is just nuts!
      Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

      Comment


      • #4
        Well his UZR is a respectable 8.4, or 19.9 per 150 games, but his +/- is an outstanding +36, giving him approximately 29 defensive runs saved. He must be one hell of a defender. I've never seen him play, but boy he must be able to pick it.

        But best player in the game? Boy if there's ever been a better argument against WAR, I've never come across it.
        San Francisco Giants, World Series Champions in 2010, 2012, and 2014!!!

        "Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts" ~ Albert Einstein

        "Royals wear crowns, but Champions Kiss the Ring" ~ Jeremy Affeldt

        Comment


        • #5
          Doesn't look too good to me!
          Lawrie-Run.gif

          Comment


          • #6
            Lawrie is a perfect example of B-R's dWAR being out of wack. Esco and Kelly Johnson from the Jays as well.

            Comment


            • #7
              WAR. What is it good for? Absolutely NOTHING.
              My top 10 players:

              1. Babe Ruth
              2. Barry Bonds
              3. Ty Cobb
              4. Ted Williams
              5. Willie Mays
              6. Alex Rodriguez
              7. Hank Aaron
              8. Honus Wagner
              9. Lou Gehrig
              10. Mickey Mantle

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by GiambiJuice View Post
                WAR. What is it good for? Absolutely NOTHING.
                First time i have heard someone say the WAR stat is useless lol
                All it takes for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing. -Unknown

                A good head and a good heart are always a formidable combination. -Nelson Mandela

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by RaysFan_98 View Post
                  First time i have heard someone say the WAR stat is useless lol
                  I guess you've never heard the song.

                  Last edited by GiambiJuice; 06-25-2012, 05:51 PM.
                  My top 10 players:

                  1. Babe Ruth
                  2. Barry Bonds
                  3. Ty Cobb
                  4. Ted Williams
                  5. Willie Mays
                  6. Alex Rodriguez
                  7. Hank Aaron
                  8. Honus Wagner
                  9. Lou Gehrig
                  10. Mickey Mantle

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by GiambiJuice View Post
                    I guess you've never heard the song.
                    I have lol
                    All it takes for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing. -Unknown

                    A good head and a good heart are always a formidable combination. -Nelson Mandela

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by RaysFan_98 View Post
                      I have lol
                      lol. ........
                      My top 10 players:

                      1. Babe Ruth
                      2. Barry Bonds
                      3. Ty Cobb
                      4. Ted Williams
                      5. Willie Mays
                      6. Alex Rodriguez
                      7. Hank Aaron
                      8. Honus Wagner
                      9. Lou Gehrig
                      10. Mickey Mantle

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I think it's just a quirk with James +/- stat. WAR stats for samples this small are meaningless because of the defensive sample being meaningless. I don't think +/- is affected by things like defensive shifts, though I know UZR can be.

                        Either way, Lawrie is a good / great player that I think everyone would agree with as being A: not the best defensive player of all time, and B: A worse player than Joey Votto

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by GiambiJuice View Post
                          WAR. What is it good for? Absolutely NOTHING.
                          That is about the 20th time I have heard someone say this. I think somebody should make up something new.
                          Last edited by Bothrops Atrox; 06-25-2012, 06:00 PM.
                          1885 1886 1926 1931 1934 1942 1944 1946 1964 1967 1982 2006 2011

                          1887 1888 1928 1930 1943 1968 1985 1987 2004 2013

                          1996 2000 2001 2002 2005 2009 2012 2014 2015


                          The Top 100 Pitchers In MLB History
                          The Top 100 Position Players In MLB History

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Instead of saying that WAR is "wrong" or "useless" because a result does not match up with preconceived notions (never an acceptable reason why data is wrong), I would love to see a skeptic explain why +/- is overrating his defense (which it may very well be doing), and give a solid estimate of how many runs he really has saved, in their opinions. At least Rich compared +/- with other defensive metrics. That was actually helpful.
                            Last edited by Bothrops Atrox; 06-25-2012, 06:27 PM.
                            1885 1886 1926 1931 1934 1942 1944 1946 1964 1967 1982 2006 2011

                            1887 1888 1928 1930 1943 1968 1985 1987 2004 2013

                            1996 2000 2001 2002 2005 2009 2012 2014 2015


                            The Top 100 Pitchers In MLB History
                            The Top 100 Position Players In MLB History

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              So.... I don't know how WAR Runs Fielding are calculated, but Lawrie is on pace to DEMOLISH the 3B WAR Runs Fielding record. He's on pace to have 60 WAR Runs Fielding this year....
                              Code:
                                                                                   
                              Rk              Player Rfield Year Age  Tm Lg   G  PA
                              1      Brooks Robinson     33 1968  31 BAL AL 162 667
                              2        Robin Ventura     32 1998  30 CHW AL 161 674
                              3      Brooks Robinson     32 1967  30 BAL AL 158 681
                              4          Scott Rolen     30 2004  29 STL NL 142 593
                              5           Buddy Bell     30 1979  27 TEX AL 162 720
                              6        Graig Nettles     30 1971  26 CLE AL 158 690
                              7    Aurelio Rodriguez     30 1970  22 TOT AL 159 663
                              8          Clete Boyer     30 1961  24 NYY AL 148 579
                              9         Brett Lawrie     29 2012  22 TOR AL  68 293
                              10       Chone Figgins     29 2009  31 LAA AL 158 729
                              11         Clete Boyer     28 1962  25 NYY AL 158 633
                              12       Robin Ventura     27 1999  31 NYM NL 161 671
                              13          Buddy Bell     27 1981  29 TEX AL  97 415
                              14       Graig Nettles     27 1976  31 NYY AL 158 657
                              15      Charlie Reilly     27 1890  23 COL AA 137 571
                              I mean, what gives? 29 in just 68 games???

                              Now that I'm looking at this chart, Buddy Bell 1981 looks pretty damn good.
                              Last edited by dgarza; 06-25-2012, 06:06 PM.

                              Comment

                              Ad Widget

                              Collapse
                              Working...
                              X