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What happened during the 9/6 Cubs/Nats game?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by ipitch View Post
    Tell that to the 25 guys that hit grand slams on 3-0 pitches this year.


    Compared to how many who flailed at ball 4 and eventually made an out? If you do something that goes against the odds and it happens to work a small majority of the time, that doesn't make it a smart or correct choice. Betting the farm on bad odds is still a poor choice even if you win.

    Anyway, I said it is stupid to swing at ball 4 on 3-0. I never said that it is always stupid to swing at a 3-0 strike. those 25 weren't on balls, were they?
    Last edited by Bothrops Atrox; 09-07-2012, 12:34 PM.
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    • #17


      excelent 3 piece article on
      1) Cubs-Nats brawl
      2) O's starting pitching
      3) prevalence of strikeouts
      1. The more I learn, the more convinced I am that many players are over-rated due to inflated stats from offensive home parks (and eras)
      2. Strat-O-Matic Baseball Player, Collector and Hobbyist since 1969, visit my strat site: http://forums.delphiforums.com/GamersParadise
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      • #18
        Originally posted by metfan13 View Post
        5 run lead in the 5th is a little early to be begging for the mercy rule.

        If it was 13-2, I could see the Cubs maybe getting pissed. I don't know exactly what the cut-off is on these things, but I kind of recognize it when I see it. 7-2 in 5th isn't it.
        Normally and i say normally a 5 run lead is safe but thats me. Also its the cubs for Christ sake they suck they deserve the mercy rule.
        All it takes for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing. -Unknown

        A good head and a good heart are always a formidable combination. -Nelson Mandela

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        • #19
          I am also not excusing the cubs but stealing 5 bases is kind of rubbing it in.
          All it takes for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing. -Unknown

          A good head and a good heart are always a formidable combination. -Nelson Mandela

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          • #20
            Originally posted by ipitch View Post
            Tell that to the 25 guys that hit grand slams on 3-0 pitches this year.
            I think he meant he swung at a pitch out of the strike zone, ball 4.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Matthew C. View Post
              Compared to how many who swang at ball 4 and eventually made an out? If you do something that goes against the odds and it happens to work a small majority of the time, that doesn't make it a smart or correct choice. Betting the farm on bad odds is still a poor choice even if you win.
              So, what are good counts to swing? Usually you hear that 2-0 and 3-1 are good hitting counts, right? In 2011, batters hit .355 on 2-0, .349 on 3-1, and .361 on 3-0. So, no matter when you swing and put the ball in play, you're more likely to make an out than get a hit.

              I don't think that batters should just freely swing at 3-0 pitches, but I don't think it's a terrible idea to swing 3-0 when you get a fastball right down the middle (or wherever the batter likes it).

              In 2011, 288 players put the ball in play on 3-0, and perhaps another 400(?) swung and missed or fouled the ball off. That means that on average 3 or 4 players swing at a 3-0 pitch each day of the season. If it was so dumb, I doubt it would be so common.

              BTW, I didn't mean "grand slams" in my first post. I meant to say "home runs."

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              • #22
                Originally posted by ipitch View Post
                So, what are good counts to swing? Usually you hear that 2-0 and 3-1 are good hitting counts, right? In 2011, batters hit .355 on 2-0, .349 on 3-1, and .361 on 3-0. So, no matter when you swing and put the ball in play, you're more likely to make an out than get a hit.

                I don't think that batters should just freely swing at 3-0 pitches, but I don't think it's a terrible idea to swing 3-0 when you get a fastball right down the middle (or wherever the batter likes it).

                In 2011, 288 players put the ball in play on 3-0, and perhaps another 400(?) swung and missed or fouled the ball off. That means that on average 3 or 4 players swing at a 3-0 pitch each day of the season. If it was so dumb, I doubt it would be so common.

                BTW, I didn't mean "grand slams" in my first post. I meant to say "home runs."
                Again, I said it was stupid to swing at ball 4 with a 3-0 count. I never said it was wrong to swing at a strike with a 3-0 count.
                1885 1886 1926 1931 1934 1942 1944 1946 1964 1967 1982 2006 2011

                1887 1888 1928 1930 1943 1968 1985 1987 2004 2013

                1996 2000 2001 2002 2005 2009 2012 2014 2015


                The Top 100 Pitchers In MLB History
                The Top 100 Position Players In MLB History

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Matthew C. View Post
                  Again, I said it was stupid to swing at ball 4 with a 3-0 count. I never said it was wrong to swing at a strike with a 3-0 count.
                  Sorry, I misunderstood what you meant. You said "if he swang at a ball on a 3-0 count, he is just stupid". I thought you meant swung at the ball. You can't really swing at a ball because it can't be a ball if you swing.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by ipitch View Post
                    Sorry, I misunderstood what you meant. You said "if he swang at a ball on a 3-0 count, he is just stupid". I thought you meant swung at the ball. You can't really swing at a ball because it can't be a ball if you swing.
                    Well, that is true, technically.
                    1885 1886 1926 1931 1934 1942 1944 1946 1964 1967 1982 2006 2011

                    1887 1888 1928 1930 1943 1968 1985 1987 2004 2013

                    1996 2000 2001 2002 2005 2009 2012 2014 2015


                    The Top 100 Pitchers In MLB History
                    The Top 100 Position Players In MLB History

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                    • #25
                      I have a latter-day clown question. Why would Harper be worried about an inside pitch? Wouldn't his underwear protect him?
                      smoker

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                      • #26
                        Why is it ever a bad idea to score? That's the whole point of the game. I don't care how far ahead the Nats were, all teams should try as hard as possible to score, at all times. Logically, there is no such thing as "running up the score." No lead is ever insurmountable.
                        Last edited by Mr. Laser Beam; 09-07-2012, 01:53 PM.
                        It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion. It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed, the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning. It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion.

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                        • #27
                          Maybe the Cubs think they are in Little League. They have certainly been playing like it.

                          My favourite quote on this from another forum...

                          "Maybe it’s wrong for 12 year-olds to run up the score on one another, but this is the big leagues. Guys are going to steal bases and swing on 3-0. They won’t stop trying just because you’re getting your asses kicked all over the park. Don’t like your asses getting kicked all over the park? Play better."

                          Pretty much sums it up right there.
                          "I can see how he won twenty-five games. What I don't understand is how he lost five." - Yogi Berra on Sandy Koufax's 1963 season.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by riverfrontier View Post
                            I have a latter-day clown question. Why would Harper be worried about an inside pitch? Wouldn't his underwear protect him?
                            I had no idea he was a mormon. I figured it would have come up more during that whole clown question fiasco since it was regarding a question about booze.
                            "Batting stats and pitching stats do not indicate the quality of play, merely which part of that struggle is dominant at the moment."

                            -Bill James

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                            • #29
                              unwritten rules seem to exist for the sole purpose of allowing a team to blow off steam when they are going through a tough stretch.

                              I remember playing in HS and getting beaten by a team badly and you basically invent a reason why you are better sports than they are.
                              "Batting stats and pitching stats do not indicate the quality of play, merely which part of that struggle is dominant at the moment."

                              -Bill James

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by J W View Post
                                It started when Jayson Werth took a hack at a 3-0 pitch in the fifth inning, when the bases were loaded and Washington was up 7-2. That prompted an argument between Bo Porter and manager Jamie Quirk, who thought it was dishonorable or something. Quirk was ejected.

                                Then came the call to throw at Harper. And regardless of what they say, you can see by the catcher's reaction to the pitch that it was called for. Harold Reynolds pointed it out on MLB Tonight.

                                http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/[email protected]
                                Ridiculous. He's not allowed to swing at a 3-0 pitch if he liked it? The things that piss off some hotheads...
                                Lou Gehrig is the Truest Yankee of them all!

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