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Playoff Hall of Fame project, 21st groups in winners and loser's brackets

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  • Playoff Hall of Fame project, 21st groups in winners and loser's brackets


    Playoff HOF rules

    1. This project will start with 512 major leaguers selected by me. I started with the top 500 in BBref WAR, sorted out the guys who hadn’t retired, and added in major leaguers who made the actual Hall or who made it in some of our shadow hall projects. I added a few other suggestions and changes, and went with those 512

    2. Those 512 were organized randomly into 64 groups of eight. I’d prefer voters to rank them 1 through 8, with each player getting 8 points minus his ranking. I will accept votes that only name the four they think are the best HOF candidates out of the group. In that instance, the four named will be counted as being in fourth place, the other four as being in fifth place. This last provision is meant to help increase participation. I envision each election taking only one week, though in cases of holidays or other issues, I reserve the right to extend that time.

    3. I will go through the entire first round before proceeding to the second, the entire second before proceeding to the third and so forth. In the first round, four from each group will go on into the 1-0 bracket, and four will go on to the 0-1 bracket. That will yield 256 in each half.

    4. For the second round, we will start with the winners bracket. Half, or 128 will go to the group of 2-0 players. The other half will drop into the group of 1-1 players. Then we’ll get to the losers bracket. The winners will also go into the 1-1 bracket, yielding 256 players in that group. The guys in the first group who are 1-0 and then lose in the second round will fill in in four spots in the 32nd group of 1-1 players, then the second group of 1-0 guys to lose to go into the 1-1 pool will go into the 31st group and so forth to avoid as much as possible facing the same guys multiple times. The winners of the first 0-1 group will fill in the remaining four spots in the first 1-1 group, the winners of the second 0-1 group will fill in the remaining four spots of the second 1-1 group and so forth. The losers of the 0-1 group will fall to the 0-2 group.

    5. For the third round, the winners of the 2-0 group are inducted, and the losers of the 0-2 group are eliminated. That’s 64 in each of the inducted and eliminated groups. The losers of the 2-0 group go to the 2-1 group, which will provide 64 of the 192 players in the 2-1 group. The other 128 will come from the winners of the 1-1 group. I will assign the losers from the 2-0 group starting in the 12th group of 2-1 players and then filling in every third slot until they’re filled, again to try and minimize facing too many of the same players faced in earlier rounds. I will do the same thing for the winners of the 0-2 among the 1-2 players

    6. For the fourth round, the winners of the 2-1 group (96 of them) will be inducted, driving the total up to 160 inductees. Similarly, the losers of the 1-2 group are eliminated, meaning 160 of the original 512 are now out. The remaining 192 will be in the 2-2 group. For the 2-2 group, the first 2-1 losers will be in the first 2-2 group, the second 2-1 losers in the second 2-2 group, and so on. For the 1-2 winners, the first group goes to the 24th 2-2 group, the second to the 23rd, and so on.

    7. The 96 losers of the fifth round will be saved as reserves in case we need to replenish the pool of players when we go annual. The 96 winners of the 2-2 round will compete in the sixth round. The 48 winners of that round are inducted to bring us to 208 inductees. The 48 losers of the 3-2 round will compete in the seventh round. The 24 winners of the seventh round are inducted, which will get us 232 MLB inductees.. The 24 losers will be the first players to populate the pool to use against retired players.

    8. I will keep a list of the 12 players who went in as third or fourth place candidates in the seventh round as a reference for my two VCs, one for Japanese players, the other for players in a wide definition of Negro Leagues including any league with large numbers of Negro Leaguers, such as Mexico in the 1940’s, Cuba into the integration years, the Puerto Rican Winter League, the 1937 Dominican League, and so forth

    9. The point of this reference is that the middle of those 12 names should be used as one point of reference for what the floor should be considered to be for the VC selections. I will keep a list of the sixth third place candidates from the sixth fourth placers to aid people in determining where that middle point is. I will mandate that a minimum of five Japanese players must be inducted, and twelve Negro Leaguers. However, I will allow the VC voters to determine how many of the players in each group presented to them are over the floor level represented by the middle of the last 12 inductees list. I will add up the average number of candidates the VC members believe are over that floor for all groups in the category (Negro Leagues or Japan), and if it is higher than my mandated floor, that is how many candidates from that category will be inducted. If not, the mandated floor will be use,

    10. The VCs will have a playoff ranking within the category much like was used for the major leaguers. I will have to adjust the numbers to fit the number of inductees we determine and the number of candidates I offer to the VC.

    11. I won’t worry about ties except where they straddle the line between winners and losers in a group. In that case, the tie goes to the candidate rated higher by the most voters. After that, the next tie breaker is getting the most first place votes, then the most second place, and so on to the last place in the group. If that does not break the tie, there will be a runoff election. If that remains tied, random selection methods such as coin flips or high card will be used to break the tie

    12. A quorum for the major leaguers will be six votes. I suspect I would accept a quorum of four for the VC groups

    13. People may vote on only the major leaguers if they wish. People may choose to only participate in one or both VCs. They may participate in the MLB players and only one VC or they may be part of all three.

    14. The VCs will follow the selection of the first 232 MLB players. I will probably select some players who are not selected by the VCs to be put in the pool, and maybe some others to be placed among the reserves. Until the number of inductees are determined for the VC groups, this decision will have to be put on hold.

    15. One issue is player/managers. It will be up to the individual voter on players to determine how much credit for managing the voter wishes to give the person for managing at the same time he played, with the instruction that if he was a part time player the credit given should be smaller than if he was full time. If he wasn't playing or just getting a few ABs, the managing credit should be minimal that year in the player vote. However, this project is exclusively about players, so if a man managed after his playing days, that managing should not be considered. The essential standrad is how the player (emphasis on the word player, but a player/manager's contributions may be considered as noted above) helps his team win on the field.

    16. I will put the lists I intend to use for the VCs out in advance of the deliberations of those groups to permit discussion of possible additions or omissions on my part. My reason for not doing so now is I expect additional research to take place between now and the time we’re close to getting to the VCs, and I’d prefer to come up with the final list only once, and in this environment, it should come closer to the end of the MLB group than now to allow for the insights from that research to be included. I will note I will expect at least as many inductees as in the actual HOF or the Single Ballot HOF. For the 19th century, I think I should split them into pre 60' 6" distance pitchers and pre-1900 position players. That will be 7 pitchers and 18 position players at a minimum. For the Negro Leagues, I will have at least 31 players, and that minimum may rise if Doby, Irvin, Minoso and Campanella fail to make it among the major leaguers. For NPB players, I will count eight and allow a ninth if Ichiro is not elected with the MLB guys.

    17. It seems certain there will be retirements and/or deaths of players between now and the end of the VC deliberations. Once the VCs are done, we will put those players in the pool and select two for each season to have passed since the beginning of this project. Once that is done, we will go annual, electing two per year from the pool.

    18. If we get over 40 players in the pool, we will have a playoff to cut the number to 30. One way we will use to avoid playoffs is to cut players from the pool is to drop players from the pool to the reserves if they fail to make the final election for inductees three times. Once that happens, they will be ineligible to return to the pool for three years. If the pool drops below 12 names, we will have a playoff for the candidates in the reserves to bring the list back up to at least 24 names in the pool. If there is a playoff among the reserves, I will probably cut the number of reserves to no more than 48.

    19. I will maintain lists of the inductees, those in the pool, and those in the reserves, I will also have available a post of the current round and the round to come for the information of participants

    20. This project is open to everyone member of Fever in good standing who has not been barred from similar projects.

    21. You have to rank all the players in the group. One omission from the group would be plugged in at 8th if I cannot get the voter to correct it on his or her own. If there are two or more open spaces, the ballot cannot be counted. If a voter sees fit to put PED guys or gambling-tainted players at the bottom of the list, that's within his or her prerogative.

    22. I will promise to count changes to your ballot if you 1) make the change less than five minutes before I close the balloting (I won't do it before 7 am Saturday without notice of an intent to do otherwise)., and 2) either PM me or post in the thread to notify me of the change. If you do not do the second, I'll try to keep up with changes, but I will not guarantee it. The first condition has no exceptions.











    Last edited by jalbright; 07-11-2020, 05:21 PM.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

  • #2
    Here are the second and third rounds of the brackets:
    ....
    Code:
     
    1-0/01 …... 2-0/01
    Lou Gehrig …... Lou Gehrig
    Billy Williams …... Lefty Grove
    Lefty Grove …... Derek Jeter
    Mickey Mantle …... Mickey Mantle
    George Davis …... Kevin Brown
    Derek Jeter …... Jim Bunning
    Kirby Puckett …... Gary Carter
    Hughie Jennings …... Bob Feller
    …...
    1-0/02 …... 2-0/02
    Kevin Brown …... Johnny Bench
    Jim Bunning …... Willie Stargell
    Bob Feller …... Arky Vaughan
    Joe Start …... Bobby Wallace
    Bobby Bonds …... Pete Alexander
    Pete Browning …... Wade Boggs
    Gary Carter …... Chipper Jones
    Dolf Luque …... Eddie Mathews
    …...
    1-0/03 …... 2-0/03
    Bucky Walters …... Joe DiMaggio
    Pie Traynor …... Gaylord Perry
    Kevin Appier …... Babe Ruth
    Hardy Richardson …... Ted Williams
    Johnny Bench …... Roger Connor
    Arky Vaughan …... Carl Hubbell
    Willie Stargell …... Randy Johnson
    Bobby Wallace …... Duke Snider
    …...
    1-0/04 …... 2-0/04
    Pete Alexander …... Hank Aaron
    Wade Boggs …... George Brett
    Hoyt Wilhelm …... Tim Raines
    George Wright …... Jackie Robinson
    Eddie Mathews …... Barry Bonds
    Chipper Jones …... Carlton Fisk
    Rod Carew …... Walter Johnson
    Barry Larkin …... Phil Niekro
    …...
    1-0/05 …... 2-0/05
    Babe Ruth …... Eddie Murray
    Ted Williams …... Nolan Ryan
    Andre Dawson …... Lou Whitaker
    Don Sutton …... Cy Young
    Joe DiMaggio …... Ty Cobb
    Gaylord Perry …... Eddie Collins
    Luke Appling …... Sandy Koufax
    Dwight Gooden …... Rube Waddell
    …...
    1-0/06 …... 2-0/06
    Roger Connor …... Dick Allen
    Harry Heilmann …... King Kelly
    Vada Pinson …... Paul Molitor
    Nomar Garciaparra …... Cal Ripken, Jr.
    Randy Johnson …... Roger Clemens
    Duke Snider …... Sam Crawford
    Carl Hubbell …... Greg Maddux
    Enos Slaughter …... Juan Marichal
    …...
    1-0/07 …... 2-0/07
    George Brett …... Joe Cronin
    Joe Gordon …... Joe McGinnity
    Ted Lyons …... Alex Rodriguez
    Tim Raines …... Luis Tiant Jr.
    Hank Aaron …... Jimmie Foxx
    Jackie Robinson …... Rickey Henderson
    David Ortiz …... Reggie Jackson
    John Montgomery Ward …... Curt Schilling
    …...
    1-0/08 …... 2-0/08
    Barry Bonds …... Craig Biggio
    Carlton Fisk …... Roberto Clemente
    Phil Niekro …... Charlie Gehringer
    Reggie Smith …... Mark McGwire
    Bob Johnson …... Roberto Alomar
    Walter Johnson …... Joe Morgan
    Jeff Kent …... Al Simmons
    Vic Willis …... Robin Yount
    …...
    1-0/09 …... 2-0/09
    Lou Brock …... Lou Boudreau
    Monte Irvin …... Bob Gibson
    Eddie Murray …... Fergie Jenkins
    Al Spalding …... Nap LaJoie
    Nolan Ryan …... Dan Brouthers
    Chase Utley …... Manny Ramirez
    Lou Whitaker …... Frank Thomas
    Cy Young …... Paul Waner
    …...
    1-0/10 …... 2-0/10
    Ken Boyer …... Whitey Ford
    Cesar Cedeno …... Pedro Martinez
    Eddie Collins …... Honus Wagner
    Rube Waddell …... Ed Walsh
    Ty Cobb …... Roy Campanella
    Sandy Koufax …... Larry Doby
    Rafael Palmiero …... Willie Keeler
    Red Ruffing …... Edgar Martinez
    …...
    1-0/11 …... 2-0/11
    Dick Allen …... w1-0/21
    Lance Berkman …...
    Paul Molitor …...
    Jim O'Rourke …...
    King Kelly …... w1-0/22
    Chuck Klein …...
    Cal Ripken Jr …...
    Jimmy Wynn …...
    …...
    1-0/12 …... 2-0/12
    Sam Crawford …... w1-0/23
    Roger Clemens …...
    Dave Stieb …...
    Wally Schang …...
    Burleigh Grimes …... w1-0/24
    Greg Maddux …...
    Juan Marichal …...
    Sam Rice …...
    …...
    1-0/13 …... 2-0/13
    Joe Cronin …... w1-0/25
    Joe McGinnity …...
    Luis Tiant Jr …...
    Miguel Tejada …...
    Dizzy Dean …... w1-0/26
    Elmer Flick …...
    Ralph Kiner …...
    Alex Rodriguez …...
    …...
    1-0/14 …... 2-0/14
    Jesse Burkett …... w1-0/27
    Bob Lemon …...
    Jim Palmer …...
    Curt Schilling …...
    Ross Barnes …... w1-0/28
    Jimmie Foxx …...
    Rickey Henderson …...
    Reggie Jackson …...
    …...
    1-0/15 …... 2-0/15
    Babe Adams …... w1-0/29
    Albert Belle …...
    Heinie Groh …...
    Mark McGwire …...
    Craig Biggio …... w1-0/30
    Roberto Clemente …...
    Charlie Gehringer …...
    Joe Torre …...
    …...
    1-0/16 …... 2-0/16
    Roberto Alomar …... w1-0/31
    Frank Baker …...
    Joe Morgan …...
    Al Simmons …...
    David Cone …... w1-0/32
    Johnny Pesky …...
    Old Hoss Radbourn …...
    Robin Yount …...
    …...
    1-0/17 …... 1.1/01
    Lou Boudreau …... Charlie Bennett
    Don Drysdale …... Dolph Camili
    Tim Hudson …... Addie Joss
    Sherry Magee …... Ernie Lombardi
    Jim Edmonds …... l1-0/32
    Bob Gibson …...
    Fergie Jenkins …...
    Nap LaJoie …...
    …...
    1-0/18 …... 1.1/02
    Kenny Lofton …... Chuck Finley
    Carl Mays …... Harry Hooper
    Al Rosen …... Jim Kaat
    Dazzy Vance …... Roger Maris
    Dan Brouthers …... l1-0/31
    Manny Ramirez …...
    Frank Thomas …...
    Paul Waner …...
    …...
    1-0/19 …... 1.1/03
    John Clarkson …... Max Carey
    Harmon Killebrew …... Cupid Childs
    Pedro Martinez …... Nap Rucker
    Honus Wagner …... Sammy Sosa
    Wally Berger …... l1-0/30
    Whitey Ford …...
    Edd Roush …...
    Ed Walsh …...
    …...
    1-0/20 …... 1.1/04
    Edgar Martinez …... Babe Herman
    Don Mattingly …... Jorge Posada
    Frank Viola …... Sam Thompson
    Hack Wilson …... Roy White
    Roy Campanella …... l1-0/29
    Larry Doby …...
    Willie Keeler …...
    Rick Reuschel …...
    …...
    1-0/21 …... 1.1/05
    Mordecai Brown …... Rocky Colavito
    Frank Robinson …... George Foster
    Ivan Rodriguez …... Clark Griffith
    Jim Sundberg …... Bret Saberhagen
    Bill Dickey …... l1-0/28
    Frankie Frisch …...
    Ron Santo …...
    Deacon White …...
    …...
    1-0/22 …... 1.1/06
    Orlando Cepeda …... Buddy Bell
    Wes Ferrell …... Bert Campaneris
    Amos Otis …... John McGraw
    Carlos Zambrano …... Tony Oliva
    Andruw Jones …... l1-0/27
    Tony Mullane …...
    Amos Rusie …...
    Alan Trammell …...
    …...
    1-0/23 …... 1.1/07
    Earl Averill …... Brian Giles
    Jose Cruz …... Tony Lazzeri
    Dwight Evans …... Vern Stephens
    Mel Ott …... Darryl Strawberry
    Richie Ashburn …... l1-0/26
    Ed Delahanty …...
    Bid McPhee …...
    Andy Pettite …...
    …...
    1-0/24 …... 1.1/08
    Tony Gwynn …... Roger Bresnahan
    Pee Wee Reese …... Norm Cash
    Ted Simmons …... Will Clark
    George Sisler …... Eppa Rixey
    Steve Carlton …... l1-0/25
    Joe Medwick …...
    Kid Nichols …...
    Ozzie Smith …...
    …...
    1-0/25 …... 1.1/09
    Bert Blyleven …... Tommy Bond
    Jim Fregosi …... Ned Garver
    Charlie Keller …... Luis Gonzalez
    Dave Winfield …... Ken Singleton
    Jeff Bagwell …... l1-0/24
    Rogers Hornsby …...
    Thurman Munson …...
    Hal Newhouser …...
    …...
    1-0/26 …... 1.1/10
    Mickey Cochrane …... Carlos Delgado
    Tim Keefe …... Larry Jackson
    Eddie Plank …... Joe Kelley
    Carl Yastrzemski …... Rusty Staub
    Fred Clarke …... l1-0/23
    Stan Coveleski …...
    John Smoltz …...
    Jim Thome …...
    …...
    1-0/27 …... 1.1/11
    Billy Hamilton …... Luis Aparicio
    Paul Hines …... Ron Guidry
    Tony Phillips …... Harry Stovey
    Jim Rice …... Joe Tinker
    Yogi Berra …... l1-0/22
    Willie Davis …...
    Minnie Minoso …...
    Hippo Vaughn …...
    …...
    1-0/28 …... 1.1/12
    Tom Glavine …... Eddie Ciccotte
    Willie Mays …... Mark Grace
    Stan Musial …... Catfish Hunter
    Ryne Sandberg …... Jimmy Sheckard
    Bill Dahlen …... l1-0/21
    Todd Helton …...
    Joe Jackson …...
    Mike Piazza …...
    …...
    1-0/29 …... 1.1/13
    Mariano Rivera …... Art Fletcher
    Robin Roberts …... Chuck Knoblauch
    Tom Seaver …... Ed Konetchy
    Tris Speaker …... Graig Nettles
    Dennis Eckersley …... Don Mattingly
    Bobby Grich …... Rick Reuschel
    Gary Sheffield …... Frank Viola
    Bill Terry …... Hack Wilson
    …...
    1-0/30 …... 1.1/14
    Ernie Banks …... Bob Caruthers
    Buck Ewing …... Bobby Doerr
    Ken Griffey Jr …... Mickey Welch
    Warren Spahn …... Jack Quinn
    Cap Anson …... Wally Berger
    Al Kaline …... John Clarkson
    Scott Rolen …... Harmon Killebrew
    Joe Sewell …... Edd Roush
    …...
    1-0/31 …... 1.1/15
    Gabby Hartnett …... Kiki Cuyler
    Keith Hernandez …... Trevor Hoffman
    Willie McCovey …... Dave Parker
    Johnny Mize …... Bobby Veach
    Carlos Beltran …... Kenny Lofton
    Adrian Beltre …... Carl Mays
    Red Faber …... Al Rosen
    Bernie Williams …... Dazzy Vance
    …...
    1-0/32 …... 1.1/16
    Joe Mauer …... Gil Hodges
    Brooks Robinson …... Heinie Manush
    Pete Rose …... Billy Pierce
    Mike Schmidt …... Willie Randolph
    Hank Greenberg …... Don Drysdale
    Roy Halladay …... Jim Edmonds
    Christy Mathewson …... Tim Hudson
    Mike Mussina …... Sherry Magee
    …...
    0-1/01 …... 1.1/17
    Addie Joss …... Johnny Evers
    Ernie Lombardi …... George Uhle
    Fred Tenney …... Matt Williams
    Charlie Bennett …... Wilbur Wood
    Charlie Buffinton …... Frank Baker
    Dolph Camilli …... David Cone
    Silver King …... Johnny Pesky
    Mark Belanger …... Old Hoss Radbourn
    …...
    0-1/02 …... 1.1/18
    Jim Kaat …... Jake Beckley
    Chuck Finley …... Rollie Fingers
    Doug DeCinces …... John Olerud
    Charley Jones …... Al Oliver
    Harry Hooper …... Babe Adams
    Roger Maris …... Albert Belle
    Bill Nicholson …... Heinie Groh
    Gene Tenace …... Joe Torre
    …...
    0-1/03 …... 1.1/19
    Jack Chesbro …... Nellie Fox
    Jason Kendall …... Steve Garvey
    Dutch (E) Leonard …... Jack Glasscock
    Nap Rucker …... Johan Santana
    Sammy Sosa …... Ross Barnes
    Max Carey …... Jesse Burkett
    Cupid Childs …... Bob Lemon
    Tony Fernandez …... Jim Palmer
    …...
    0-1/04 …... 1.1/20
    Chief Bender …... Dave Concepcion
    Jack Morris …... Dennis Martinez
    Jorge Posada …... Phil Rizzuto
    Sam Thompson …... Eddie Rommel
    Billy Herman …... Dizzy Dean
    Harold Baines …... Elmer Flick
    Gil McDougald …... Ralph Kiner
    Roy White …... Miguel Tejada
    …...
    0-1/05 …... 1.1/21
    Bret Saberhagen …... w0-1/21
    Clark Griffith …...
    Lave Cross …...
    Cliff Lee …...
    Rocky Colavito …... Burleigh Grimes
    Noodles Hahn …... Sam Rice
    George Foster …... Wally Shang
    Doc White …... Dave Stieb
    …...
    0-1/06 …... 1.1/22
    Bert Campaneris …... w0-1/22
    Mark Buehrle …...
    Torii Hunter …...
    Larry Gardner …...
    Tony Oliva …... Lance Berkman
    Buddy Bell …... Chuck Klein
    John McGraw …... Jim O'Rourke
    Dizzy Trout …... Jimmy Wynn
    …...
    0-1/07 …... 1.1/23
    John Candelaria …... w0-1/23
    Tony Lazzeri …...
    Allie Reynolds …...
    Vern Stephens …...
    Curt Flood …... Ken Boyer
    Brian Giles …... Cesar Cedeno
    Darryl Strawberry …... Rafael Palmiero
    Bob Welch …... Red Ruffing
    …...
    0-1/08 …... 1.1/24
    Roger Bresnahan …... w0-1/24
    Norm Cash …...
    Travis Jackson …...
    Ezra Sutton …...
    Brett Butler …... Lou Brock
    Will Clark …... Monte Irvin
    Eppa Rixey …... Al Spalding
    Mike Smith …... Chase Utley
    …...
    0-1/09 …... 1.1/25
    Rick Ferrell …... w0-1/25
    Ned Garver …...
    Luis Gonzalez …...
    Schoolgoy Rowe …...
    Tommy Bond …... Bob Johnson
    Gary Gaetti …... Jeff Kent
    Sad Sam Jones …... Reggie Smith
    Ken Singleton …... Vic Willis
    …...
    0-1/10 …... 1.1/26
    Larry Jackson …... w0-1/26
    George Kell …...
    Davey Lopes …...
    Del Pratt …...
    Carlos Delgado …... Joe Gordon
    Joe Kelley …... Ted Lyons
    Buddy Myer …... David Ortiz
    Rusty Staub …... John M Ward
    …...
    0-1/11 …... 1.1/27
    Luis Aparicio …... w0-1/27
    Jerry Koosman …...
    Harry Stovey …...
    Joe Tinker …...
    Hugh Duffy …... Nomar Garciaparra
    Ron Guidry …... Harry Heilmann
    Jimmy Rollins …... Vada Pinson
    Dixie Walker …... Enos Slaughter
    …...
    0-1/12 …... 1.1/28
    Ben Chapman …... w0-1/28
    Eddie Ciccotte …...
    Catfish Hunter …...
    Rabbit Maranville …...
    Mark Grace …... Luke Appling
    Jamie Moyer …... Andre Dawson
    Jimmy Sheckard …... Dwight Gooden
    Curt Simmons …... Don Sutton
    …...
    0-1/13 …... 1.1/29
    Gavvy Cravath …... w0-1/29
    Ed Konetchy …...
    George Mullin …...
    Cy Seymour …...
    Art Fletcher …... Rod Carew
    Chuck Knoblauch …... Barry Larkin
    Graig Nettles …... Hoyt Wilhelm
    Ross Youngs …... George Wright
    …...
    0-1/14 …... 1.1/30
    Jose Canseco …... w0-1/30
    Larry French …...
    Sam Leever …...
    Mickey Welch …...
    Bob Caruthers …... Kevin Appier
    Bobby Doerr …... Hardy Richardson
    Jack Quinn …... Pie Traynor
    Jack Stivetts …... Bucky Walters
    …...
    0-1/15 …... 1.1/31
    Kiki Cuyler …... w0-1/31
    Tommy Leach …...
    Claude Osteen …...
    Bobby Veach …...
    Mel Harder …... Bobby Bonds
    Trevor Hoffman …... Pete Browning
    Dave Parker …... Dolf Luque
    Lip Pike …... Joe Start
    …...
    0-1/16 …... 1.1/32
    Gil Hodges …... w0-1/32
    Rube Marquard …...
    Billy Pierce …...
    Willie Randolph …...
    Brian Downing …... George Davis
    Fred Dunlap …... Hughie Jennings
    Toby Harrah …... Kirby Puckett
    Heinie Manush …... Billy Williams
    …...
    0-1/17 …... 0-2/01
    Johnny Evers …... Mark Belanger
    Waite Hoyt …... Charlie Buffinton
    Matt Williams …... Silver King
    Wilbur Wood …... Fred Tenney
    Chet Lemon …... Doug DeCinces
    Tommy McCarthy …... Charley Jones
    George Uhle …... Bill Nicholson
    Ken Williams …... Gene Tenace
    …...
    0-1/18 …... 0-2/02
    Rollie Fingers …... Jack Chesbro
    Cal McVey …... Tony Fernandez
    Al Orth …... Jason Kendall
    Kenny Rogers …... Dutch (E) Leonard
    Jake Beckley …... Harold Baines
    John Olerud …... Chief Bender
    Al Oliver …... Gil Mcougald
    Javier Valsquez …... Jack Morris
    …...
    0-1/19 …... 0-2/03
    Nellie Fox …... Lave Cross
    Steve Garvey …... Noodles Hahn
    Jack Glasscock …... Cliff Lee
    Johan Santana …... Doc White
    Bill Donovan …... Mark Buehrle
    Jesse Haines …... Larry Gardner
    Fernando Valenzuela …... Torii Hunter
    Jim Whitney …... Dizzy Trout
    …...
    0-1/20 …... 0-2/04
    Mike Cameron …... John Candelaria
    Dave Concepcion …... Curt Flood
    John Hiller …... Allie Reynolds
    Eddie Rommel …... Bob Welch
    Dennis Martinez …... Brett Butler
    Claude Passeau …... Travis Jackson
    Roger Peckinpaugh …... Mike Smith
    Phil Rizzuto …... Ezra Sutton
    …...
    0-1/21 …... 0-2/05
    Jack Fournier …... Rick Ferrell
    Brad Radke …... Gary Gaetti
    Steve Rogers …... Sad Sam Jones
    Devon White …... Schoolboy Rowe
    Al Dark …... George Kell
    Bob Elliott …... Davey Lopes
    Orlando Hernandez …... Buddy Myer
    Jim McCormick …... Del Pratt
    …...
    0-1/22 …... 0-2/06
    Murry Dickson …... Hugh Duffy
    George Kelly …... Jerry Koosman
    Ray Schalk …... Jimmy Rollins
    Bob Shawkey …... Dixie Walker
    Mike Griffin …... Ben Chapman
    Herb Pennock …... Rabbit Maranville
    George Van Haltren …... Jamie Moyer
    Omar Vizquel …... Curt Simmons
    …...
    0-1/23 …... 0-2/07
    Felipe Alou …... Gavvy Cravath
    Red Lucas …... George Mullin
    Dan Quisenberry …... Cy Seymour
    Lee Smith …... Ross Youngs
    Jack Clark …... Jose Canseco
    Earle Combs …... Larry French
    Fred Lindstrom …... Sam Leever
    Red Schoendienst …... Jack Stivetts
    …...
    0-1/24 …... 0-2/08
    Sal Bando …... Mel Harder
    John Franco …... Tommy Leach
    Goose Gossage …... Claude Osteen
    Stan Hack …... Lip Pike
    Ted Breitenstein …... Brian Downing
    Darrell Evans …... Fred Dunlap
    Tony Perez …... Toby Harrah
    Andy Van Slyke …... Rube Marquard
    …...
    0-1/25 …... 0-2/09
    Chick Hafey …... Waite Hoyt
    Bobo Newsom …... Chet Lemon
    Darrell Porter …... Tommy McCarthy
    Maury Wills …... Ken Williams
    Julio Franco …... Cal McVey
    Roy Oswalt …... Al Orth
    Bruce Sutter …... Kenny Rogers
    Willie Wilson …... Javier Vazquez
    …...
    0-1/26 …... 0-2/10
    Ellis Burks …... Bill Donovan
    Jimmy Collins …... Jesse Haines
    Larry Walker …... Fernando Valenzuela
    David Wells …... Jim Whitney
    Frank Chance …... Mike Cameron
    Bobby Mathews …... John Hiller
    Fred McGriff …... Claude Passeau
    Ned Williamson …... Roger Peckinpaugh
    …...
    0-1/27 …... 0-2/11
    Harry Brecheen …... l0-1/21
    Mark Langston …...
    Bill Mazeroski …...
    Roy Thomas …...
    Jimmy Ryan …... l0-1/22
    Mel Stottlemyre …...
    Jesse Tannehill …...
    Billy Wagner …...
    …...
    0-1/28 …... 0-2/12
    Johnny Damon …... l0-1/23
    Dom DiMaggio …...
    Vladimir Guerrero …...
    Robin Ventura …...
    Bobby Abreu …... l0-1/24
    Tommy Bridges …...
    Pud Galvin …...
    Don Newcombe …...
    …...
    0-1/29 …... 0-2/13
    Vida Blue …... l0-1/25
    Goose Goslin …...
    Jack Powell …...
    Mike Tiernan …...
    Bill Frehan …... l0-1/26
    Orel Hershiser …...
    Freddy Lynn …...
    Frank Tanana …...
    …...
    0-1/30 …... 0-2/14
    Dave Bancroft …... l0-1/27
    George Gore …...
    Dale Murphy …...
    Jim Perry …...
    Jim Bottomley …... l0-1/28
    Joe Carter …...
    Mickey Lolich …...
    Sam McDowell …...
    …...
    0-1/31 …... 0-2/15
    Joe Judge …... l0-1/29
    Urban Shocker …...
    Lloyd Waner …...
    Early Wynn …...
    Larry Doyle …... l0-1/30
    Jason Giambi …...
    Babe Herman …...
    Tommy John …...
    …...
    0-1/32 …... 0-2/16
    Tom Candiotti …... l0-1/31
    Wilbur Cooper …...
    Lenny Dykstra …...
    Juan Gonzalez …...
    Ron Cey …... l0-1/32
    Milt Pappas …...
    Lon Warneke …...
    Zack Wheat …...
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

    Comment


    • #3
      First is the winner's bracket ballot:
      ....
      Code:
       
      Mordecai Brown
      Frank Robinson
      Ivan Rodriguez
      Jim Sundberg
      Bill Dickey
      Frankie Frisch
      Ron Santo
      Deacon White
      .....
      And now the loser's bracket ballot:
      ........
      Code:
       
      Jack Fournier
      Brad Radke
      Steve Rogers
      Devon White
      Al Dark
      Bob Elliott
      Orlando Hernandez
      Jim McCormick
      Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
      Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
      A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

      Comment


      • #4
        My Ballot:

        Winner's Bracket-

        1. Frank Robinson
        2. Bill Dickey
        3. Ivan Rodriguez
        4. Frankie Frisch
        5. Ron Santo
        6. Mordecai "Three Finger" Brown
        7. Jim Sundberg
        8. Deacon White

        Loser's Bracket-

        1. Jim McCormick
        2. Devon White
        3. Steve Rogers
        4. Brad Radke
        5. Bob Elliott
        6. Jack Fournier
        7. Al Dark
        8. Orlando Hernandez

        Comment


        • #5
          Winner's Bracket

          1. Frank Robinson
          2. Frankie Frisch
          3. Bill Dickey
          4. Mordecai Brown
          5. Ron Santo
          6. Ivan Rodriguez
          7. Deacon White - I could see him as high as 4
          8. Jim Sundberg

          Loser's Bracket

          1. Bob Elliott
          2. Jim McCormick
          3. Jack Fournier
          4. Steve Rogers
          5. Al Dark
          6. Brad Radke
          7. Devon White
          8. Orlando Hernandez

          Comment


          • #6
            My Ballot
            ......
            Winner's Bracket
            ......
            1.
            F Robinson
            2. Santo
            3 I, Rodriguez
            4. Frisch
            5. Deacon White
            6 Dickey
            7. M. Brown
            8. Sundberg
            ......
            Loser's Bracket
            ...

            1. McCormick
            2 Elliott
            3. Devon White
            4. Radke
            5. .Fournier
            6. S. Rogers
            7. Dark
            8. O. Hernandez
            Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
            Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
            A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

            Comment


            • #7
              Winners
              1. Frank Robinson
              2. Ron Santo
              3. Ivan Rodriguez
              4. Frankie Frisch
              5. Bill Dickey
              6. Deacon White
              7. Mordecai Brown
              8. Jim Sundberg

              Losers
              1. Jim McCormick
              2. Bob Elliott
              3. Devon White
              4. Steve Rogers
              5. Al Dark
              6. Jack Fournier
              7. Brad Radke
              8. Orlando Hernandez
              "It is a simple matter to erect a Hall of Fame, but difficult to select the tenants." -- Ken Smith
              "I am led to suspect that some of the electorate is very dumb." -- Henry P. Edwards
              "You have a Hall of Fame to put people in, not keep people out." -- Brian Kenny
              "There's no such thing as a perfect ballot." -- Jay Jaffe

              Comment


              • #8
                Winner's Bracket

                1. Frank Robinson
                2. Frankie Frisch
                3. Mordecai Brown
                4. Ivan Rodriguez
                5. Bill Dickey
                6. Ron Santo
                7. Deacon White
                8. Jim Sundberg

                Loser's Bracket

                1. Jim McCormick
                2. Devon White
                3. Bob Elliot
                4. Steve Rogers
                5. Al Dark
                6. Jack Fournier
                7. Orlando Hernandez
                8. Brad Radke

                Comment


                • #9
                  1. Frank Robinson
                  2. Frankie Frisch
                  3. Ivan Rodriguez
                  4. Bill Dickey
                  5. Mordecai Brown
                  6. Ron Santo
                  7. Deacon White - Packed round.... White is a solid HOF who normally would rank between 4-6 in most other rounds.
                  ----- HOF -----
                  8. Jim Sundberg



                  1. Jim McCormick - He would rank #5-6 in the "winner's" bracket. Would make for a solid HOFer.
                  2. Bob Elliott
                  ----- HOF -----
                  3. Jack Fournier
                  4. Al Dark
                  5. Steve Rogers
                  6. Brad Radke
                  7. Devon White
                  8. Orlando Hernandez
                  Players 6-8 are ones I would place in a whole other bracket below the "losers". They just can't compete for me here.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Winners
                    1. Frank Robinson
                    2. Bill Dickey
                    3. Frankie Frisch
                    4. Ivan Rodriguez
                    5. Deacon White
                    6. Ron Santo
                    7. Mordecai Brown
                    8. Jim Sundberg

                    Losers
                    1. Jim McCormick
                    2. Orlando Hernandez - credit for Cuban play, was a fine late career hurler for MLB play and clutch in the post-season.
                    3. Bob Elliott
                    4. Steve Rogers
                    5. Jack Fournier
                    6. Al Dark
                    7. Brad Radke
                    8. Devon White

                    Jacquelyn Eva Marchand (1983-2017)
                    http://www.tezakfuneralhome.com/noti...uelyn-Marchand

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Winner's Bracket:

                      1. Frank Robinson
                      2. Ivan Rodriguez
                      3. Ron Santo
                      4. Frankie Frisch
                      5. Three Finger Brown
                      6. Bill Dickey
                      7. Deacon White
                      --------HOF Line--------
                      8. Jim Sundberg

                      Loser's Bracket:

                      1. Bob Elliott
                      2. Jim McCormick
                      -------HOF Line--------
                      3. Orlando Hernandez
                      4. Devon White
                      5. Steve Rogers
                      6. Jack Fournier
                      7. Al Dark
                      8. Brad Radke

                      4-8 are pretty much interchangeable in the loser's bracket.

                      Comment


                      • #12

                        Winner's Bracket:

                        1. Frank Robinson
                        2. Three Finger Brown
                        3. Bill Dickey - barely over
                        4. Frankie Frisch - tough to put him here, but them's is the breaks
                        5. Deacon White
                        6. Ron Santo

                        --------HOF Line--------
                        --------Big HOF Line--------

                        7. Jim Sundberg
                        8. Ivan Rodriguez


                        Loser's Bracket:

                        --------HOF Line--------
                        --------Big HOF Line--------

                        1. Bob Elliott
                        2. Jim McCormick
                        3. Jack Fournier - at least he had a good relative peak...
                        4. Steve Rogers
                        5. Devon White
                        6. Al Dark
                        7. Brad Radke
                        8. Orlando Hernandez - Thanks for the legendary 6th inning of the 2005 ALDS (came in with bases loaded, no outs, and got out of it with no runs scored) but besides that, you are an easy 8th for me.

                        Numbers 3-7 of the losers all have some valid discussion points why they could be moved around in order.
                        I don't think either one of them can win it.-one sportswriter's assessment of the 1945 world series between the tigers and cubs.
                        Play the Who am I? game in trivia and you can make this signature line yours for 3 days (baseball signatures only!)

                        Go here for a link to all player links! http://www.baseball-fever.com/forum/...player-threads

                        Go here for all your 1920's/1930's OF info

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          A little over a day and a half left in this election, and only one voter from last election yet to vote. Not likely he'll change the four going to 2-0, but he could change one of the four going to 0-2. I'll PM him.
                          Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                          Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                          A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Winners

                            1. FRobinson
                            2. Frisch, barely ahead of
                            3. MBrown, barely ahead of
                            4. Dickey, barely ahead of
                            5. IRodriguez- ugghh
                            6. Santo- a fine player, but I've dropped him down- he had huge home field advantages
                            7. White
                            8. Sundberg

                            Lots of good players here- not a lot of space between 2 and 6.

                            Losers

                            1. Elliott
                            2. McCormick
                            3. Fournier
                            4. Dark
                            5. Rogers
                            6. White
                            7. Radke
                            8. Hernandez
                            Last edited by BigRon; 07-09-2020, 02:35 PM.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              In the winner's bracket, the guys moving on to 2-0 are Dickey, Frisch, F. Robinson and I. Rodriguez while M. Brown, Santo, Sundberg, and Deacon White move into the 1-1 bracket. The official result:
                              .
                              Code:
                               
                              70 Frank Robinson
                              49 Frankie Frisch
                              40 Bill Dickey
                              39 Ivan Rodriguez
                              33 Ron Santo
                              31 Mordecai Brown
                              16 Deacon White
                              2 Jim Sundberg
                              ...
                              In the loser's bracket, the guys moving to the 1-1 bracket are Elliott, Fournier, McCormick and S Rogerswhile the rest fall to the 0-2:
                              ...
                              Code:
                               
                              66 Jim McCormick
                              59 Bob Elliott
                              36 Steve Rogers
                              34 Jack Fournier
                              33 Devon White
                              24 Al Dark
                              16 Brad Radke
                              12 Orlando Hernandez
                              Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                              Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                              A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                              Comment

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