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3 MVP titles is automatic ticket to HOF?

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Yuri89 View Post

    Is 150 % steroids. He would be slam dunk otherwise.
    Yup. 1,000%
    My top 10 players:

    1. Babe Ruth
    2. Barry Bonds
    3. Ty Cobb
    4. Ted Williams
    5. Willie Mays
    6. Alex Rodriguez
    7. Hank Aaron
    8. Honus Wagner
    9. Lou Gehrig
    10. Mickey Mantle

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    • #32
      Originally posted by Yuri89 View Post

      Is 150 % steroids. He would be slam dunk otherwise.
      Are you sure about that? Other than his relationship to Barry and BALCO, what proof is there against Sheffield regarding PEDs? I have seen several articles saying that he doesn't belong in the HOF due to his defense, WAR totals, attitude etc.

      https://www.si.com/mlb/2016/12/21/ja...gary-sheffield

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      • #33
        Originally posted by willshad View Post

        Are you sure about that? Other than his relationship to Barry and BALCO, what proof is there against Sheffield regarding PEDs? I have seen several articles saying that he doesn't belong in the HOF due to his defense, WAR totals, attitude etc.

        https://www.si.com/mlb/2016/12/21/ja...gary-sheffield
        Hes got over 500 homers 140 OPS + for life and 60 WAR is more than enough to go HOF. Guerrero, Ortiz etc. He would have been 1st ballot. He appears in mitxhel report and as you said connected to BALCO. It is 3000% steroids.

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        • #34
          Sheffield was a slam-dunk Hall of Famer if not for the PED allegations. Likely 2nd or 3rd ballot at the latest.
          My top 10 players:

          1. Babe Ruth
          2. Barry Bonds
          3. Ty Cobb
          4. Ted Williams
          5. Willie Mays
          6. Alex Rodriguez
          7. Hank Aaron
          8. Honus Wagner
          9. Lou Gehrig
          10. Mickey Mantle

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by GiambiJuice View Post
            Sheffield was a slam-dunk Hall of Famer if not for the PED allegations. Likely 2nd or 3rd ballot at the latest.
            I agree, but I don't know if the voters would have seen it that way. He might have gotten the Carlos Delgado treatment.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by willshad View Post

              I agree, but I don't know if the voters would have seen it that way. He might have gotten the Carlos Delgado treatment.
              Nah, there are some glaring differences in terms of what people look for in a Hall Of Fame candidate.

              For starters...
              - Sheffield hit 500 home runs. Delgado didn't.
              - Sheffield had nearly 2,700 hits. Delgado barely reached 2,000.
              - Sheffield won a batting title. Delgado didn't.
              - Sheffield was a 9-time All Star, Delgado was a 2-time All Star.
              - Sheffield won a World Series (and played a key role). Delgado never played in a World Series.

              While I would support Delgado for the Hall, their respective candidacies aren't particularly close.
              Last edited by GiambiJuice; 05-19-2022, 10:24 AM.
              My top 10 players:

              1. Babe Ruth
              2. Barry Bonds
              3. Ty Cobb
              4. Ted Williams
              5. Willie Mays
              6. Alex Rodriguez
              7. Hank Aaron
              8. Honus Wagner
              9. Lou Gehrig
              10. Mickey Mantle

              Comment


              • #37
                Not with 500+ HR. That number doesn't have the magic it once did thank to PEDs, but it's still a major milestone.
                3 6 10 21 29 31 35 41 42 44 47

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                • #38
                  Just since his name has come up with PEDs -

                  I'm not going to argue that Juan González didn't use PEDs. The circumstantial evidence is piled a mile high, not to mention just the eye test.

                  But...just for what it's worth to the civil libertarian/due process angel on my shoulder shouting in my ear, is there definitive proof Juan Gone used?

                  I don't think he failed a test. He was named in Canseco's book, and I think the Mitchell Report, but the former is unreliable and I'm unsure if they really had the goods in the latter.

                  Just asking. Maybe my memory is just failing me.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Cougar View Post
                    Just since his name has come up with PEDs -

                    I'm not going to argue that Juan González didn't use PEDs. The circumstantial evidence is piled a mile high, not to mention just the eye test.

                    But...just for what it's worth to the civil libertarian/due process angel on my shoulder shouting in my ear, is there definitive proof Juan Gone used?

                    I don't think he failed a test. He was named in Canseco's book, and I think the Mitchell Report, but the former is unreliable and I'm unsure if they really had the goods in the latter.

                    Just asking. Maybe my memory is just failing me.
                    Yea, Juan Gone had a pretty rough youth too. Makes it hard to dislike him for using. I think Sosa did too. Sosa also makes Gonzalez look like Bob Elliot.

                    "No matter how great you were once upon a time — the years go by, and men forget,” - W. A. Phelon in Baseball Magazine in 1915. “Ross Barnes, forty years ago, was as great as Cobb or Wagner ever dared to be. Had scores been kept then as now, he would have seemed incomparably marvelous.”

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by bluesky5 View Post

                      Yea, Juan Gone had a pretty rough youth too. Makes it hard to dislike him for using. I think Sosa did too. Sosa also makes Gonzalez look like Bob Elliot.
                      Do you mean stat-wise?

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by scottmitchell74 View Post

                        Do you mean stat-wise?
                        No, "Mr. Team"-wise.
                        "No matter how great you were once upon a time — the years go by, and men forget,” - W. A. Phelon in Baseball Magazine in 1915. “Ross Barnes, forty years ago, was as great as Cobb or Wagner ever dared to be. Had scores been kept then as now, he would have seemed incomparably marvelous.”

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          I honestly know hardly anything about González's or Sosa's pre-baseball lives, outside of them growing up in PR/DR, respectively.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            It depends on how you define "definitive." People (here and elsewhere) have argued (generally in bad faith) that there is no definitive proof against Bonds and Clemens, for example.
                            3 6 10 21 29 31 35 41 42 44 47

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