Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Frank Thomas for HOF?! HA!

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by Fuzzy Bear View Post
    There is a legit question of valuation when it comes to the DH. Was a guy's DH time a product of maximizing team offense? This often happens when you have guys at the left end of the defensive spectrum sharing DH time, using the DH for giving guys rest, playing a guy who's recent injury hurt his defense but not his bat so much, or, in a case like David Ortiz, where a guy could play the field physically (however poorly), and would have been the regular if there had been no DH. Then, there are cases of guys who were so bad that their defense would never have allowed them to be regulars. Most importantly, we are talking about guys who, through injury, wearing down, or just being injury prone, would never have had the kind of longevity and/or durability at their defensive position to have racked up the kind of offensive numbers to merit HOF induction from the left end of the defensive spectrum (RF, LF, 1B).

    It's the latter category that merits the examination. In this category, we have Paul Molitor (a HOFer), Harold Baines, Edgar Martinez, David Ortiz, and Frank Thomas. Molitor and Thomas have racked up HOF "automatics" (3,000 hits for Molitor, 500 HRs with a .300 BA for Thomas). We have Edgar Martinez, who would have been an instant HOFer if he had played the field his entire career, but who doesn't have an "automatic" and Harold Baines, who was a DH full-time from 1987 onward until 2001, when he was 42 and ran out of gas. Baines had knee injuries young, and this not only ended his fielding career, it diminished his speed. It is not likely that Baines would have played much past 1990 had he not had the DH; he may have been converted to 1B, but eventually, someone would have been upset with Baines's lack of real HR power.

    Thomas is a guy whose career was somewhat lengthened by the DH, but not by a lot. He could have played 1B longer than he did; the Sox saw it wiser to install Konerko, but his career would not have slowed if there were no DH in the manner that Baines's would have. He may have fallen short of 500 HRs if there were no DH, but he would have kept his BA over .300, and the peak of his career in the 1990s, when he still played 1B, would still be a part of it. The "What if there were no DH?" would have been relevant for guys like Baines, but not for the Big Hurt.
    Well said.
    "No matter how great you were once upon a time — the years go by, and men forget,” - W. A. Phelon in Baseball Magazine in 1915. “Ross Barnes, forty years ago, was as great as Cobb or Wagner ever dared to be. Had scores been kept then as now, he would have seemed incomparably marvelous.”

    Comment


    • Originally posted by 1905 Giants View Post
      I would love to see anyone try to, after it all, prove Thomas doesn't deserve the Hall.
      Frank Thomas was a fairly good ball player for a number of years. Certainly he would have been overshadowed by contemporaries who were clear Hall of Famers like Mantle, Mays, Snider, Kaline, Aaron, etc. Still, I can't see myself ever pulling the trigger on a position player with only 18.5 career WAR. Wait. We are talking about Frank Joseph Thomas, right?
      RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

      Comment


      • For a while, Frank Thomas looked like the best right-handed hitter since I don't know; Rogers Hornsby? He was a butcher in the field, God knows, but anybody who watched him play in his prime knows he's a Hall Of Fame hitter.
        They call me Mr. Baseball. Not because of my love for the game; because of all the stitches in my head.

        Comment


        • Gotta love these old threads, and it makes me wonder who, if anyone, will get voted in come January. Maddux, Thomas, Glavine, Mussina, and Kent will all be on the ballot for the first time, and the list drops off dramatically after that for first year guys. Biggio, Piazza, & Schilling will get a chance to climb in their second year, but the tainted lot like Bonds, Clemens, Sosa, McGwire and Palmeiro are very likely to drop like a bag of dirt. Since this thread is about Thomas, I'll reserve comment on the other's chances, but I see the Big Hurt going in on his first ballot with a comfortable margin. Hope everyone remembers that the players' records are only one aspect of the qualifications; the voters also are required to examine the ability, integrity, sportsmanship, character, and contributions to the team(s) they played for. With that in mind, Thomas should be enshrined in Cooperstown.
          Baseball is a ballet without music. Drama without words ~Ernie Harwell

          Comment


          • Maddux for sure. I think Biggio, Thomas, and Glavine will all get between 65 and 80% of the vote. I bet 2 get in, but wouldn't bet as to which of the three make it. Hard to say how things will break down.
            1885 1886 1926 1931 1934 1942 1944 1946 1964 1967 1982 2006 2011

            1887 1888 1928 1930 1943 1968 1985 1987 2004 2013

            1996 2000 2001 2002 2005 2009 2012 2014 2015


            The Top 100 Pitchers In MLB History
            The Top 100 Position Players In MLB History

            Comment


            • In all seriousness, what really helps Big Hurt's Hall of Fame chances is that he's advocated for banning steroid users from the Hall of Fame. Plus he also allowed himself to be interviewed by the Mitchell Report. He's essentially what the writers want in a clean home run hitter in an era of dirty players. He gets in. Maybe not in his first year with this crowded ballot, but definitely his second year.
              RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Ace Venom View Post
                In all seriousness, what really helps Big Hurt's Hall of Fame chances is that he's advocated for banning steroid users from the Hall of Fame. Plus he also allowed himself to be interviewed by the Mitchell Report. He's essentially what the writers want in a clean home run hitter in an era of dirty players. He gets in. Maybe not in his first year with this crowded ballot, but definitely his second year.
                Thomas, Maddux, and Glavine go in. Biggio has to wait a bit more.
                "I do not care if half the league strikes. Those who do it will encounter quick retribution. All will be suspended and I don't care if it wrecks the National League for five years. This is the United States of America and one citizen has as much right to play as another. The National League will go down the line with Robinson whatever the consequences. You will find if you go through with your intention that you have been guilty of complete madness."

                NL President Ford Frick, 1947

                Comment

                Ad Widget

                Collapse
                Working...
                X