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Frank Thomas for HOF?! HA!

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  • #76
    --Rose obviously. Jackson probably. He had a short career, but if it had ended due to injury and not corruption I'd be likely to support him. His career value is similar to that of Ralph Kiner, although they achieved it it different ways.

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    • #77
      Originally posted by Dontworry
      Why do so many people support shoeless joe and pete rose ?

      Good God, they were Seeking to destroy the game and turn baseball into a soap opera, rather than a sport.

      Both should never sniff the HOF.
      I agree. I think Bill James said it best about Joe Jackson:

      "My own opinion is that the people who want to put Joe Jackson in the Hall of Fame are baseball's answer to those women who show up at murder trials wanting to marry the cute murderer."

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      • #78
        Originally posted by Edgartohof
        Are you sure they weren't just human, and made a mistake (ones which they wish they hadn't made)? Hey, maybe I'm wrong.

        I do have a question, all "politics" aside, on the numbers, would you put them in the Hall? If they were not involved in those situations, did they do enough to be in the Hall?
        If They both didnt try to destroy the game of baseball, then I would put Only rose in the HOF. Joe isnt a HOF based on stats, rose is.

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        • #79
          Let's not forget that Frank Thomas was one of those huge, bulging guys in the early '90s, IIRC. He'll go in, and probably first ballot, simply as an answer ti those who want to make a statement against the steroid marred era of the last 8-10years. After all, he's never been connected with them.

          Should he? Well, in the Old Comiskey I'd say definitely, not sure what the park factors have been like for the new Comiskey, but I'm sure it hasn't been Fenway of the late '70s, and yet nobody has brought park factor into the argument.

          Then again, I can see why, I'm a bit too busy to check it, too.
          If Baseball Integrated Early - baseball integrated from the beginning - and "Brotherhood and baseball," the U.S. history companion, at http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/Baseballifsandmore - IBIE updated for 2011.

          "Full House Chronology" at yahoo group fullhousefreaks & fullhouse4life with help of many fans, thanks for the input

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          • #80
            Originally posted by DTF955
            Let's not forget that Frank Thomas was one of those huge, bulging guys in the early '90s, IIRC. He'll go in, and probably first ballot, simply as an answer ti those who want to make a statement against the steroid marred era of the last 8-10years. After all, he's never been connected with them.
            I think that's a good point. I believe in the next few years, we're going to hear more and more about various players having done various things related to steroids. If Thomas can completely escape these rumors, it should immensely help his candidacy.

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            • #81
              Originally posted by 538280
              I agree. I think Bill James said it best about Joe Jackson:

              "My own opinion is that the people who want to put Joe Jackson in the Hall of Fame are baseball's answer to those women who show up at murder trials wanting to marry the cute murderer."
              Bill James is a moron.

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              • #82
                Originally posted by Pine Tar
                Bill James is a moron.
                Wow, what a well-reasoned, insightful, deep "skeptical" argument you gave us. :o
                Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

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                • #83
                  Originally posted by 538280
                  And Frank Thomas was twice the hitter McGwire, Sosa, or Palmeiro were.
                  You used Equivalent Average for Thomas vs. Gehrig, so what is your problem with Thomas vs. McGwire?

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                  • #84
                    Originally posted by 538280
                    I agree. I think Bill James said it best about Joe Jackson:

                    "My own opinion is that the people who want to put Joe Jackson in the Hall of Fame are baseball's answer to those women who show up at murder trials wanting to marry the cute murderer."
                    Well, this analogy only "works" if people are wanting all of the fixers to be in the Hall. Or maybe if the murder was actually outstandingly hot.

                    All I know is that I'm glad I didn't come up with that quote.

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                    • #85
                      Pete Rose is not the least bit contrite. He can die for all I care.

                      I digress. How does .307BA,.427OBP,& .568 SLG over 16 years NOT get you into the HOF? Even with his injuries, and playing only 60 games his rookie year, he's still AVERAGING 28 HRs per year. The guy has been amazing. He may be an idiot, but he's one hell of a hitting idiot.:grouchy
                      I'm a Ramblin' Wreck from Georgia Tech and a Hell of an Engineer!

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                      • #86
                        Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules
                        Wow, what a well-reasoned, insightful, deep "skeptical" argument you gave us. :o
                        I'm certinaly skeptical of Bill James' ability to provide meaningful commentary on why people would support Joe Jackson's hall candidacy. The fact that he would hold such an opinion doens't make him a moron. Its that he thinks that people care what he has to say about why people like Joe Jackson that makes him a moron. James' statement is also condescending and sexist. Hence, he is a moron. Is that well-reasoned enough for you????

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                        • #87
                          I really am surprised that there actually is someone out there who scoffs at Thomas being a deserving HOF.

                          Futurehalloffamer, you really haven't put up much of an argument, based on Thomas' numbers, as to why he shouldn't be in - other than a HR total. You've basically cherry-picked less compelling reasons such as World Series participation, his being hurt in the last few years, etc - and have completely ignored what he did in the 90's. If you're going to start a thread like this, at least approach it from a more analytical perspective and take his WHOLE career into account.

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                          • #88
                            Originally posted by RuthMayBond
                            Those sabermetricians confusing him with the facts

                            Exactly. We know how they love to cherry-pick their stats.

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                            • #89
                              Originally posted by Pine Tar
                              I'm certinaly skeptical of Bill James' ability to provide meaningful commentary on why people would support Joe Jackson's hall candidacy. The fact that he would hold such an opinion doens't make him a moron. Its that he thinks that people care what he has to say about why people like Joe Jackson that makes him a moron. James' statement is also condescending and sexist. Hence, he is a moron. Is that well-reasoned enough for you????
                              No, not at all. All you have provided is a silly rant with no substance.
                              Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

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                              • #90
                                Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules
                                No, not at all. All you have provided is a silly rant with no substance.
                                Actually, that is what Bill James was doing by comparing Joe Jackson supporters to a bunch of starstruck women who are in love with a murderer.

                                I was calling him out for that.

                                I'm confused, what exactly are you providing?

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