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  • Originally posted by Chadwick View Post
    How would you rank the following Hall of Fame candidates?

    Mark Buehrle
    Tim Hudson
    Andy Pettitte
    CC Sabathia
    CC
    Pettitte
    Hudson
    Buehrle

    But I have the bottom 3 all between 81-88 and I could be convinced they belong in any order.
    1885 1886 1926 1931 1934 1942 1944 1946 1964 1967 1982 2006 2011

    1887 1888 1928 1930 1943 1968 1985 1987 2004 2013

    1996 2000 2001 2002 2005 2009 2012 2014 2015


    The Top 100 Pitchers In MLB History
    The Top 100 Position Players In MLB History

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Bothrops Atrox View Post

      CC
      Pettitte
      Hudson
      Buehrle

      But I have the bottom 3 all between 81-88 and I could be convinced they belong in any order.
      That's the order I have them in, too. I don't know exactly what rank each is, but it's that order. I can say that I see each of them as a top 100 pitcher all-time and that I think anyone in the top 100 pitchers after 149 seasons belongs in Cooperstown.
      "It is a simple matter to erect a Hall of Fame, but difficult to select the tenants." -- Ken Smith
      "I am led to suspect that some of the electorate is very dumb." -- Henry P. Edwards
      "You have a Hall of Fame to put people in, not keep people out." -- Brian Kenny
      "There's no such thing as a perfect ballot." -- Jay Jaffe

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Bothrops Atrox View Post

        CC
        Pettitte
        Hudson
        Buehrle

        But I have the bottom 3 all between 81-88 and I could be convinced they belong in any order.
        I have:

        CC
        Hudson
        Pettitte
        Buehrle

        Pettitte consistently trails Hudson in most rate/value stats. By rate/value/win probability, Hudson and CC are very similar, while Pettitte is a notch below and Buehrle another notch down.

        Comment


        • My heart tells me Hudson > Sabathia from the '3 Aces' A's days but I think C.C. is certainly ahead. I'd have Buehrle ahead of Pettitte.
          "No matter how great you were once upon a time — the years go by, and men forget,” - W. A. Phelon in Baseball Magazine in 1915. “Ross Barnes, forty years ago, was as great as Cobb or Wagner ever dared to be. Had scores been kept then as now, he would have seemed incomparably marvelous.”

          Comment


          • The problem is what in his career stands out. He does have 3 top 5 CY finishes and that looks good until you realize that is 3 in 17 years. He won 20 games one year but his ERA was 4.14 and the year he won 18 games his ERA was 3.37. So he has some good things going for him but when you look closer they are not as great as they seem.

            Comment


            • Sabathia
              Hudson
              Pettite
              Beuhrle

              Sabathia was the best of the group due to not only having longevity, but a nice peak as well. From 2007-2011 he was95-40 with a 142 ERA+ and 240 IP per season. He also had several more good years outside his peak, though his 2013-2015 stretch is very problematic. He comes across as an underachiever: a guy who should have breezed past 300 wins and should have gotten more strikeouts due to his immense size.

              Hudson also seems like somewhat of an underachiever, an ace in his early days but never really put it all together. He was over .500 every season until his very last two seasons. Reminds me of Mike Mussina with a shorter career.

              Pettite has overall numbers similar to Sabathia, but never really came across as an 'ace'. A ton of pretty good seasons, but only two or three standout ones. The PED issue further muddies his waters.

              Buehrle is another guy who never came across as an ace, and never had a 'peak' to speak of.. He was a reliable 200 IP guy who never missed time. He amazingly was only under .500 one time (12-13 in 2006) but he was usually AROUND .500.

              None of these guys are HOFers to me.
              Last edited by willshad; 08-17-2019, 03:24 AM.

              Comment


              • From Jay Jaffes 2021 HOF ballot series:

                https://blogs.fangraphs.com/jaws-and...ot-tim-hudson/

                Even if we don't agree with his methodologies, he writes a fine recap of a players career.

                If he doesn't make it, I hope Huddy last 10 years on the ballot and has a chance to be elected by the VC in his lifetime, grey area but good enough for me HOF type guy.
                Jacquelyn Eva Marchand (1983-2017)
                http://www.tezakfuneralhome.com/noti...uelyn-Marchand

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Jar of Flies View Post
                  From Jay Jaffes 2021 HOF ballot series:

                  https://blogs.fangraphs.com/jaws-and...ot-tim-hudson/

                  Even if we don't agree with his methodologies, he writes a fine recap of a players career.

                  If he doesn't make it, I hope Huddy last 10 years on the ballot and has a chance to be elected by the VC in his lifetime, grey area but good enough for me HOF type guy.
                  My sentiments pretty much exactly.

                  Comment

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