Jack Quinn

[Cowtipper]

Over 23 years in the big leagues, Jack Quinn went 247-218 with a 3.29 ERA. A six-time 15 game winner and one-time 20 game winner, Quinn's career ERA was nearly half a point lower than the overall league ERA. He also had great control, as he led the league in BB/9IP in 1920 and 1927, and he was in the top 10 list 13 times. His career 1.97 BB/9IP in 82nd all-time. In 1931 and 1932, he led the league in saves, in 1920, he led the league in K/BB ratio, and in 1911, 1931 and 1932, he led the league in games finished.

Quinn was the oldest player in the league five times. and he owns a few "old guy" records. For example, he holds the record for oldest player to hit a homer in the AL, and he is also the oldest player to collect more than one hit in a season. From Baseball Library: "Quinn set records as the LN x x oldest player to win a ML game (49), start a WS game (46), finish a WS game (47), and lead in a major pitching category (49) with six saves in 1932. He is also the oldest player to hit a home run (47) [that has since been broken by Julio Franco]."

In 1948, 1956, 1958 and 1960 he received votes for the Hall of Fame.

One of the last legal spitballers, Quinn has respectable grey ink of 141. He is statistically similar to a few Hall of Famers: Red Faber, Waite Hoyt, Ted Lyons, Eppa Rixey, Herb Pennock and Burleigh Grimes.

So, should Jack Quinn be in the Hall of Fame?

[jjpm74]

The HOF doesn't have anyone with a last name beginning with a Q, so...

[dgarza]

The HOF doesn't have anyone with a last name beginning with a Q, so...

Then let Quisenberry in!

[jjpm74]

Then let Quisenberry in!

He's my first choice for a Q candidate.

He's one of my top choices period!

[Bothrops Atrox]

Quinn is one of the better options you have provied, Cowtipper, but he still falls below the first section of guys who are just short (Saberhagen, Pierce, Cooper, Vaughn, Reuschel, etc.) The second teir of near-misses, if you will. The same ilk as Hershiser, Koosman, Reulbach, Leever, etc.

[KCGHOST]

I honestly don't think he is one, but amongst the 60 HoF pitchers he would rank 40th in WARP3 score, 35th in career win shares, and 35th in RCAA. His OPS+ is a very good 114 and he has six HoF comparables. That is not a bad resume. But it did take him 23 seasons to accumulate all this and I suspect he was really just a good pitcher who lasted an incredibly long time.

His neutral support W-L record is 265-200 which indicates he didn't hurl in front of the best of offenses.

[Freakshow]

In Quinn's time, pre farm system, movement between MLB and the minors was much more restricted. Minor league teams had some control over letting their players leave and would usually hang on to their top talent until they got the asking price.

So, Quinn deserves an addition to his already large career value. He played well in the International League in 1912-13 (age 28-29) and in the PCL in 1916-17-18. Some analysis of Quinn at the Hall of Merit can be found at this link.

[BlueBlood]

I guess this is the week where Cowtipper goes after those average to slightly better players that amassed some meritable counting stats.

[Sockeye]

Jack Quinn

What are your thoughts on Jack Quinn? Does he belong in the HOF?

247 wins
218 loses
.531 winning %
3.29 ERA
756 games
443 games started
217 games finished
243 complete games
28 shutouts
57 saves
3920.3 innings pitched
4238 hits
1837 runs
1433 earned runs
102 home runs
860 walks
85 IBB
1329 strikeouts
91 HBP
5 balks
62 wild pitches
16356 batters faced
114 ERA+
1.30 WHIP
9.7 H/9
0.2 HR/9
2.0 BB/9
3.1 SO/9
1.55 SO/BB
287 win shares (32, 22, 19, 19, 19)
61.1 WARP (7.4, 5.5, 5.0, 4.8, 4.4)
49.7 WAR (6.9, 4.5, 4.3, 3.9, 3.7)
10 black ink
138 gray ink
63 HOF Monitor
30 HOF Standards

[jjpm74]

There is already a thread about him:

http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?77530-Jack-Quinn&highlight=quinn

[PVNICK]

I never really got the support, such as it was for him. Not that he was bad, but he was good here and there over a long long career. If you remove the two federal league seasons with were his only 20 win and 20 loss seasons and his record is 212-182 which, even though we aren't supposed to look at such things anymore b/c they are team reliant, is still very un HOFish.

[Sockeye]

I never really got the support, such as it was for him. Not that he was bad, but he was good here and there over a long long career. If you remove the two federal league seasons with were his only 20 win and 20 loss seasons and his record is 212-182 which, even though we aren't supposed to look at such things anymore b/c they are team reliant, is still very un HOFish.

I'm not really a Jack Quinn supporter either although I do think he is VERY close. One thing that is worth mentioning is his minor league performance. Quinn didn't appear in the majors until age 25. In 1908 at age 24 pitching in Richmond he went 14-0 with a 1.10 ERA, 0.83 WHIP. Given that level of performance he likely deserved to be pitching in the majors that season. From 1912-13 he pitched in the independant league and from 1916-18 he pitched primarily in the PCL where he won a total of 53 games. During that time the PCL was roughly equal to the negro league in terms of talent. Altogether Quinn was 101-65 in the minors. If credit is given for negro league performance (which I don't) or time lost to military service (which I don't) then credit would deserve to be given for the time he spent in the minors where he should have been in the majors. It's a safe bet that had he pitched in the majors during that time he would have won at least another 53 games making him a 300 game winner.

[Freakshow]

I put up a lot of data on Quinn a couple years ago during The Collaboration Game.

Post #3342

Post #3414

Good discussion on this page beginning with post #3465.

[Beady]

i don't think this got into the other thread, though I may have missed it. Robert Peyton Wiggins' book on the Federal League confirms that the Baltimore club canceled its contracts and released its players when it became obvious the Terrapins would not be fielding a franchise in 1916. Quinn is one of the men named, but Wiggins doesn't specify how he got to Vernon.

No clear indication of when the release occurred, except that it was after early February, and that would mean the released players were probably at some disadvantage in signing because teams had filled already filled most of their vacancies.

[Jar of Flies]

Happy 136th birthday to Jack, for the career voter giving credit for minor league play, Quinn is an intriguing HOF type of candidate.

Regardless, excellent and long productive career.