Which of these 3 has the stronger Hall case? Shocker, Blyleven or C.Mays?

[Bill Burgess]

I have a question, that involves 3 pitchers.

Whose Hall case is the stronger of the 3, Urban Shocker, Bert Blyleven, or Carl Mays?

[Chadwick]

1. Blyleven
2. Mays
--------------> Hall of Fame line
3. Shocker

[leecemark]

--Blyleven is head and shoulders above the other two.

[jalbright]

Blyleven
-------------------->a gap of some distance
Mays
---------------------> HOF in/out line. Mays and Shocker are close to this line IMO.
Shocker

[Paul Wendt]

Roughly I agree with jim albright

Bert Blyleven
g
a
p
-- their contemporary Wilbur Cooper is a little stronger candidate
-----------------
Shocker and Mays are both in the margin. I can' t make it a border line, and it isn't that I need glasses.
-----------------

[Bothrops Atrox]

Blyleven is a no-brainer of course....

Based on raw stats, Mays has a slight edge over Shocker, but it is important to remember that Shocker played with mostly poor defenses, whereas Mays had tons of help behind him. If you looked at how many runs each would have allowed on nuetral defenses, Shocker would be noticeably better. Mays' hitting and postseason play is an equalizer, but after recent analysis, I would say Shocker might be more deserving. Both guys are right on that borderline, in my opinion.

[BenHertz]

Blyleven - 60 shutouts
Mays & Shocker - 57 shutouts

I voted for Bert Blyleven.

[jjpm74]

I voted Blyleven, but also voted that all three are deserving. I don't think Shocker is a HOFer, but I do think both Blyleven and Mays are HOFers.

[Colorado Express]

Blyleven should be in. Mays is borderline for me and because of that, he should stay out (I reserve the right to change my mind tomorrow).

[Fuzzy Bear]

Blyleven and Mays should be in.

Shocker has a good case. He would have gone into the HOF had he not taken ill; his death caused him to fall short of 200 wins.

Shocker pitched in a heavy hitting era, where wins were harder to come by, due to the conditions of the game. His ERA vs. league is what you'd expect a HOFer's to be. He's the guy the voters SHOULD have put in for his era, rather than Waite Hoyt, Herb Pennock, Jesse Haines, and Rube Marquard, even falling short of 200.

[Bill Burgess]

I really think some members are shorting Shocker on his deserved credit, based on his era. The 20's were unforgiving to the pitching guild. But his ERA+ was the highest of the 3. And his total wins were similarly lowered due to pitching for the Browns, who only had a good team in 1922. Plus he died early.

Tough house.

[Chadwick]

To me Mays is a borderline case who gets in on the basis of some pretty neat peripherals, something Shocker (who is only just behind Mays statistically speaking) doesn't have. Mays was, in many ways, a historically great pitcher. I can't say the same for Shocker.

[KCGHOST]

Blyleven is the clear choice here and an HoFer in my mind. The other two are more problematic, but if I had to pick one I'd pick Shocker.

[Bill Burgess]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Shocker known as the Yankee killer? And didn't they buy him from the Browns so he wouldn't keep beating them?

I might very easily be wrong on that, as the faltering memory of an old man can sometimes stagger along on dying fumes.

[Freakshow]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Shocker known as the Yankee killer? And didn't they buy him from the Browns so he wouldn't keep beating them?

I might very easily be wrong on that, as the faltering memory of an old man can sometimes stagger along on dying fumes.

His obituary calls him a "Yankee nemesis".

Frank Lary was "The Yankee Killer".