BBF Pantheon Round 2

[Tyrus4189Cobb]

(Please see very bottom of post)

Well, congratulations to the first four inductees to the BBF Pantheon. There were votes all over the place, but There was a great sweep for Ruth and Johsnon. The winners being:

Batters: Pitchers:
1) Babe Ruth- 32 votes (91.43%) 1) Walter Johnson- 33 votes (94.29%)
2) Willie Mays- 13 votes (37.14%) 2) Greg Maddux- 12 votes (34.29%)

The rest:
Ty Cobb- 12 votes
Honus Wagner- 4 votes
Ted Williams- 5 votes
Barry Bonds- 4 votes
Lou Gehrig- 1 vote
Stan Musial- 1 vote
Hank Aaron, Mickey Mantle, Josh Gibson, and Oscar Charleston- 0 votes

Pete Alexander- 3 votes
Christy Mathewson- 3 votes
Cy Young- 8 Votes
Roger Clemens- 2 votes
Lefty Grove- 5 votes
Tom Seaver- 2 votes
Warren Spahn- 0 votes

I'm sure this next round will have much more diversified votes. With that said, have fun and vote and one more thing:

Starting on from this round, vote only for one batter and one pitcher

Round 2 will close on June eighth

[jjpm74]

I'm having trouble understanding how this works. If we keep voting for 1 pitcher and 1 position player, aren't we going to end up with a lot more pitchers than are deserving?

[Paul Wendt]

It's like some of those modern baseball teams: 12 pitchers, 12 fielders, and a DH

[jjpm74]

It's like some of those modern baseball teams: 12 pitchers, 12 fielders, and a DH

In that situation, wouldn't it me more prudent to specify position for each player so you don't end up with 12 pitchers and 12 1B/OF?

[AstrosFan]

When putting together an all-time team, I usually end up with 15 position players and 10 pitchers. That's a 3:2 ratio. Now, I don't think Tyrus is looking to build a team, so it shouldn't be a big deal to have some positions producing more pantheon players than others. But in light of the concerns of some voters over having an excess of pitchers, I propose we redo this with a couple of easy changes.

Instead of voting for an equal number of position players and pitchers, we vote for three of the former and two of the latter each round. That's five players every round, which is about the number we think of when we use the word pantheon. Then we can progress with the 30% to make the Pantheon idea, only this time, we'll have a more proper distribution of position players and pitchers. Could we start this over with that idea? Makes a little more sense to me than voting for the same number of pitchers and position players.

Finally, I just want to say great job to Tyrus for getting the right players on these polls. His choices have been, near as I can tell, a good representation of the BBF consensus of the greatest players in baseball history.

[leecemark]

--I don't think of any particular number when I think pantheon. Actually I don't suppose I ever think pantheon at all. I do agree that an equal number of pitchers and position players is going to be unrepresenative and poted the same in the first poll. 15/10 is alot more like it, although 17/8 or 16/9 would be even better IMO. That would be 2/1 per poll.

[Skin & Bones]

I voted for two players & pitchers, my mistake. Ignore my votes for Grove and Mantle, and keep my votes for Young & Bonds.

[Chadwick]

Bonds
-------
Clemens

[Colorado Express]

Williams
Mathewson

[Colorado Express]

Williams
Mathewson

[Paul Wendt]

Wagner & Clemens
unless there was a database problem, leecemark and I cast the second and third ballots just before 9:00 EDT yesterday morning. The great Wagner does not have a vote since then.

"Other (please specify in a post)"
Tyrus, do you plan to use write-in votes as the nominations and only nominations? That is one way to do it, maybe an interesting experiment.

For me the list of pitchers is good for a while. I might take my personal top ten from your 11 original nominees.

In the top half of the ballot the question may be put how many outfielders should go in off the top, or off the top with Wagner alone? For me there may be many opportunities to repeat voting for Wagner.

For what it's worth here are the other infielders who would probably get my vote before Rogers Hornsby in this context (underline) and some who might.

Berra, Bench, Rodriguez, ?
(Gehrig -nominated), Anson, Foxx, Bagwell, ?
Lajoie, Collins, Robinson, Morgan
(Wagner -nominated), Rodriguez, George Wright, ?
Schmidt, Mathews, Brett, ?

and maybe Mike Kelly, Ed Delahanty, Joe DiMaggio, and Frank Robinson in the outfield.

So I won't be casting a vote for Rogers Hornsby. I suppose the ones most likely to get votes now are Jackie Robinson and Alex Rodriguez.

[Tyrus4189Cobb]

I voted for two players & pitchers, my mistake. Ignore my votes for Grove and Mantle, and keep my votes for Young & Bonds.

understood

[Tyrus4189Cobb]

Wagner & Clemens
unless there was a database problem, leecemark and I cast the second and third ballots just before 9:00 EDT yesterday morning. The great Wagner does not have a vote since then.

"Other (please specify in a post)"
Tyrus, do you plan to use write-in votes as the nominations and only nominations? That is one way to do it, maybe an interesting experiment.

The "other" category is not going to be used as one for nominations to next rounds. It's an interesting idea, but I only put that there because I'm not going to list every player. It is used so voters who wish to vote for another player to the Pantheon which is not already listed as a choice.

Also, as for your votes, they are there. I see that you and leecemark have voted for them.


I would also like to clear some other confusions. The Pantheon is NOT for an all-time team. It is for the immortals of baseball; the HoF for the HoF. Anyone can be inducted regardless of position. By the end, there shall be 12 positioners and pitchers each.

[Tyrus4189Cobb]

I'm having trouble understanding how this works. If we keep voting for 1 pitcher and 1 position player, aren't we going to end up with a lot more pitchers than are deserving?

Not that I should think. If everyone wants, then we can go up to 10 pitchers. I just thought that 12 for each is a good Pantheon number. I think there are about 12 pitchers deserving.

If you would like to less than 12 pitchers, please post so.

[KCGHOST]

The Peach & Lefty.