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  • The case for George Weiss as a contributor can use some development, and I'll do it here:

    Sources: BaseballLibrary.com, Cooperstown's website, and ESPN.com

    By the yardsticks of pennants won . . ., George Weiss was an extremely successful baseball executive. His 29 seasons with the New York Yankees (1932-60) brought 19 pennants, and 15 World Championships. . . . Upon joining the Yankees in 1932, Weiss built a fertile farm system which at one point boasted more than 20 teams. At Newark of the International League, such standouts as Joe Gordon, Phil Rizzuto, Spud Chandler and Charlie Keller among others were developed. Weiss sold off surplus talent, those players not quite up to Yankee standards. [In 1947 Weiss was] named GM [of the Yankees] with absolute authority. As a baseball man rather than a MacPhail-type showman, Weiss ran the club, like Barrow, along conservative lines. When the Yankees finished third in 1948, Weiss fired manager Bucky Harris and hired Casey Stengel. Many felt that Weiss had blundered, that he had hired a clown to manage the Yankees. But Weiss knew the real Stengel, who would reward his faith with 10 pennants in 12 seasons. As the Yankees' general manager from 1947 to 1960, [Weiss'] teams won 10 pennants and seven World Series, including five in a row

    Weiss surrounded himself with exceptional people, including a brigade of crack scouts. In 1934, when his scouts told him an injured minor leaguer named Joe DiMaggio would recover and be a star, Weiss convinced owner Jacob Ruppert that the Yankees had to have him. In 1959, he pried Roger Maris from the Kansas City Athletics, offering a package (which included Hank Bauer and Don Larsen) that the second-division club could not refuse.

    Weiss was named TSN Major League Executive of the Year in 1950, 1951, and 1952 (when the Yankees won three of five consecutive World Championships) and again in 1960.

    He and Stengel were forced to retire after the Yankees lost to the Pirates in the 1960 World Series. . . . Weiss moped around before coming out of exile in 1961 as president of the expansion New York Mets. . . . When Weiss retired in 1966 - voluntarily - he left the Mets in better shape than were the last-place Yankees; keys to the 1969 World Champion Mets, such as Tom Seaver and Jerry Koosman, were in the farm system.

    Jim Albright
    Last edited by jalbright; 08-27-2006, 10:08 AM.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by jalbright
      I would ask everyone who votes to pay special attention to the group of candidates I am about to discuss--they're the ones who got 50% or more of the vote last month. As such, they're the prime candidates to be elected this month. I for one would regard two months in a row without electing any players a serious development--and I hope you would too.

      On my ballot this month

      Ted Lyons

      Isao Harimoto

      Max Carey

      George Wright

      Hugh Duffy

      Dave Parker

      Bill Freehan

      Don Drysdale

      Don Sutton

      Bobby Doerr


      Probably will support in the near future

      Bruce Sutter


      Players I'm not supporting and why

      Albert Belle

      Mickey Welch

      Jim Albright
      Jim, there's a problem with the links in this post. They don't work, at least for me.

      Comment


      • For some reason, the : between the http and the // didn't come through, and thus it's resupplying the http:// all of which leads to a mess. Someone else told me about it, and I'd figured it out, but then my 5 year old took me away from fixing it for a while. I'm in the process of fixing a bunch of links with this problem.

        Jim Albright
        Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
        Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
        A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

        Comment


        • The posts in this thread should be fixed now.

          Jim Albright
          Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
          Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
          A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

          Comment


          • I would like to remind those supporting (or considering supporting) Bruce Sutter of another fine relief pitcher who played concurrently with Sutter, one Dan Quisenberry. IMHO (and my ballot reflects this), Quis should be elected before Sutter. The stats:
            .......................Sutter......Quisenberry
            Games:...............661...........674
            Innings:..............1042.1......1043.1
            Won:..................68.............56
            Lost:..................71..............46
            Saves:...............300............244
            ERA+:..................136..........146
            WS - 3 Consec....27,23,22....28,24,23
            WS - Top 5...........94...........107
            WS/Season...........33.41.......34.12
            Black Ink:.............15.............18
            Grey Ink:..............30.............24
            HOF Standards:......17............19
            HOF Monitor:.........91.............77

            Sutter was the better power pitcher, and would be your choice if you needed a strikeout. But Quis was the best at coming in and inducing the DP groundball. Very close, and Sutter is in my queue, but I'll keep voting for Quisenberry. If a spot opens on the ballot, Sutter might make it, or he may have to wait for someone else on the queue. I guess my main point is that if Sutter deserves election, so does Quisenberry.
            You see, you spend a good deal of your life gripping a baseball and in the end it turns out that it was the other way around all the time. J. Bouton

            Comment


            • Just trying to highlight selections made on my ranks list...and a glaring ommission...I don't see Shigeo Nagashima listed as being elected....but he is getting no support. Did I miss his name among the honored? Or, are you all stark-raving mad? OK...the last is a little extreme....

              Comment


              • Nevermind...it seems that the post I was referencing is not up to date....I have to find the missing 12 guys now ...sigh.

                Comment


                • baseballPAP,

                  Welcome to the discussion, and I look forward to your participation. Don't worry, you'll get in the swing soon enough. We can use a little passion here. Our discussions have been lacking that lately.

                  Jim Albright
                  Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                  Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                  A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                  Comment


                  • BaseballPAP,

                    I noticed that you had the San Diego Chicken on your ballot.

                    I also used to have him on my ballot for a long time, but I just recently found out that he is not eligible yet.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by dgarza
                      BaseballPAP,

                      I noticed that you had the San Diego Chicken on your ballot.

                      I also used to have him on my ballot for a long time, but I just recently found out that he is not eligible yet.
                      Correct. The Chicken's alter ego, Ted Giannoulas (sp?) is not dead nor retired, and won't be sixty until 2013. Until one or more of those conditions is met, he's ineligible.

                      Jim Albright
                      Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                      Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                      A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                      Comment


                      • I've seen some movement toward electing our top candidates, and I appreciate those who have done what they can to help. Some have been helping all along by being supportive of most if not all the top candidates, and others have added some of these candidates in place of some other favorite. Each is helping in their own way, and I thank them for that.

                        Jim Albright
                        Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                        Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                        A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                        Comment


                        • Voting status as of Eastvanmungo's ballot

                          Player votes counted: 14
                          Projected total votes for players: 22
                          Projected votes needed for election of player: 17

                          Only presenting players with at least 10 votes. Anybody else needs vote changes, new voters, and/or to run the table to get elected.

                          Code:
                          Player	votes	%	prjctd	chance
                          Carey	12	85.7	15	62
                          Doerr	11	78.6	13	37
                          Wright	11	78.6	16	73
                          Lyons	10	71.4	12	22
                          Contributor votes counted: 12
                          projected total votes for contributors: 21
                          projected votes for election of contributor: 16

                          Only presenting candidates with at least 8 votes. Anybody else needs vote changes, new voters, and/or to run the table to get elected.

                          Code:
                          Contributor	votes	%	prjctd	chance
                          Jennings	10	83.3	15	77
                          Taylor	        10	83.3	13	52
                          Scully	         9	75.0	13	44
                          Weiss	         8	66.7	10	19


                          The "votes" category in each table is the official vote count as of the time cited above, and the % is the percentage of votes counted as of that same time. The "prjctd" is the sum of votes already gotten plus the number of votes received from last month's voters whose votes have not yet been counted this month. The chance is a percentage estimate of the individual's chance of being elected this month.


                          Jim Albright
                          Last edited by jalbright; 09-04-2006, 05:27 AM.
                          Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                          Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                          A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                          Comment


                          • Here's the ballot of CardinalsForever (a new voter?)

                            September Ballot

                            --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                            Players:

                            Albert Belle
                            Jim Bunning
                            Orlando Cepeda
                            Will Clark
                            Don Drysdale
                            Darrel Evans
                            Tony Fernandez
                            Rollie Fingers
                            Bill Freehan
                            Tommy John
                            Edgar Martinez
                            Don Mattingly
                            Bill Mazeroski
                            Fred McGriff
                            Jack Morris
                            Dave Parker
                            Dan Quisenberry
                            Jim Rice
                            Lee Smith
                            Dave Stieb
                            Bruce Sutter
                            Don Sutton
                            Luis Tiant
                            Lou Whitaker
                            Hack Wilson


                            It contains exactly one(!) guy who played a game before 1955. No Negro leauers or Japan league guys either. This seems quite contrary to what we're aiming for, don't you think? Or is it just me?
                            Si quaeris peninsulam amoenam, circumspice.

                            Comprehensive Reform for the Veterans Committee -- Fixing the Hall continued.

                            Comment


                            • No, Freakshow, it's not just you. I tried making that point to this voter in a PM welcoming him to the project, apparently to little effect. However, this ballot is a step up from his first one (last month), which not only had the flaw you noted, but also was heavily tilted toward Cardinal players, including such luminaries as Tommy Herr and Willie McGee. What can I say other than the rules of the project allow such votes, wrongheaded as some of us may think they are.

                              Jim Albright
                              Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                              Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                              A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Freakshow
                                It contains exactly one(!) guy who played a game before 1955. No Negro leauers or Japan league guys either. This seems quite contrary to what we're aiming for, don't you think? Or is it just me?
                                I don't see any guys on there who are very unreasonable candidates, though some who are tough sells.

                                Comment

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