Ranking the HoF Players - #1

[DoubleX]

Sorry for the delay, but this first election is now over and the results are below. I've also decided to add a new rule in tallying votes. As we go on, I'm concerned about results being skewed by outliers - that is when one or two voters for whatever reason rank a player inordinately high compared to the rest of the electorate, prompting that player to be elected based on the support of a very small minority. So to stem against that, each player will receive an extra point for each ballot they are listed on (thus helping players with widespread support catch up to players listed high on just a couple of ballots), and players must be on at least three ballots to be included among the five players elected. I'll post all these new rules at the top of the next election.

Here are the results, the top five were elected, everyone else is back into the pool:

1) Babe Ruth: 286 (259 + 27 ballots; 23 first place votes)
2) Willie Mays: 227 (200 + 27 ballots; 1 first place vote)
3) Ty Cobb: 205 (178 + 27 ballots)
4) Ted Williams: 172 (147 + 25 ballots)
5) Hank Aaron: 152 (129 + 23 ballots)

6) Honus Wagner: 131 (111 + 20 ballots; 2 first place votes)
7) Walter Johnson: 126 (102 + 24 ballots; 1 first place vote)
8) Jackie Robinson: 101 (87 + 14 ballots)
9) Lou Gehrig: 75 (58 + 17 ballots)
10) Cy Young: 54 (41 + 13 ballots)
11) Stan Musial: 45 (34 + 11 ballots)
12) Josh Gibson: 39 (31 + 8 ballots)
13) Mickey Mantle: 28 (22 + 6 ballots)
14) Rogers Hornsby: 22 (16 + 6 ballots)
15) Cap Anson: 16 (14 + 2 ballots)
16) Roberto Clemente: 14 (11 + 3 ballots)
17) Satchel Paige: 10 (7 + 3 ballots)
18) Oscar Charleston: 9 (7 + 2 ballots)
19) Pete Alexander: 6 (4 + 2 ballots)
t20) Joe DiMaggio: 6 (5 + 1 ballot)
t20) John Ward: 6 (5 + 1 ballot)
22) King Kelly: 5 (4 + 1 ballot)
23) Cal Ripken Jr: 4 (2 + 2 ballots)
t24) Christy Mathewson: 4 (3 + 1 ballot)
t24) Tris Speaker: 4 (3 + 1 ballot)
26) Lefty Grove: 3 (2 + 1 ballot)
t27) Nolan Ryan: 2 (1 + 1 ballot)
t27) Tom Seaver: 2 (1 + 1 ballot)

[Sockeye]

1. Walter Johnson - 10
2. Honus Wagner - 9
3. Hank Aaron - 8
4. Ted Williams - 7
5. Ty Cobb - 6
6. Willie Mays - 5
7. Babe Ruth - 4
8. Lou Gehrig - 3
9. Cy Young - 2
10. Stan Musial - 1

[brett]

1) Babe Ruth-10
2) Willie Mays-9
3) Ty Cobb-8
4) Walter Johnson-7
5) Honus Wagner-6
6) Hank Aaron-5
7) Ted Williams-4
8) Lou Gehring-3
9) Stan Musial-2
10) Cy Young-1

[Jsquared83]

1. Babe Ruth
2. Ty Cobb
3. Ted Williams
4. Lou Gehrig
5. Honus Wagner
6. Stan Musial
7. Mickey Mantle
8. Willie Mays
9. Hank Aaron
10. Rogers Hornsby

[hairmetalfreek]

1. Babe Ruth
2. Hank Aaron
3. Willie Mays
4. Honus Wagner
5. Ty Cobb
6. Cy Young
7. Josh Gibson
8. Walter Johnson
9. Satchel Paige
10. Jackie Robinson

[DoubleX]

Al Spalding's impact on the game was immense. Harry Wright was as well, but are we going to include people like these when ranking? Out of the early players who are in as pioneers, which ones are we including as players?

Only individuals who have been designated as players as listed on the Hall of Fame's website, will be considered here. Thus no Al Spalding and Harry Wright.

[Yankwood]

I don't know if you're counting him as a 70s player or not, but...
How we often forget that two of Aaron's he-man years came in the 70s. Aaron could still tear it up at the plate in 71 and 73. In fact, 1971 could possibly have been Aaron best offensive year. He lead the majors in OBP and OPS+, and he hit his career high seasonal HR total in 1971. If he would have played more in 71, it would almost be a no-doubter.

Exactly. And it's he and Mays who show up and that's about it. Personally I slipped Seaver in there but never really considered anyone else. They may be worthy but my mind won't let them.

[dgarza]

Isn't it funny (odd) that almost everybody's list contains not more than 1 player, maybe 2 at the most, who has played within the last 35 to 40 years? 30 years from now I wonder what these lists would look like?

I don't know if you're counting him as a 70s player or not, but...
How we often forget that two of Aaron's he-man years came in the 70s. Aaron could still tear it up at the plate in 71 and 73. In fact, 1971 could possibly have been Aaron best offensive year. He lead the majors in OBP and OPS+, and he hit his career high seasonal HR total in 1971. If he would have played more in 71, it would almost be a no-doubter.

[jjpm74]

Schmidt, Seaver, Brett and Henderson are all in my top 20.

[The Dude]

I don't know but I think this shows how traditional most baseball lovers are and how we cling to our history. Actually, I think it's fine. Those more recent names you mention may show up on our grandchildren's lists.

Eh, I'm not a traditionalist at all. I would love to make a list saying Schmidt, Yount, Carlton, Seaver, Brett, Ripken, etc. were the most famous and some of the worthiest hall of fame players, but it'd be a lie right now. Like you said, 30+ years from now who knows, but right now the most famous guys who are eligible played 40 years ago or more.

[Yankwood]

I thought about this, too. But, the biggest name of this era (Bonds) isn't yet in the HOF and his name is tarred. Same with Clemens. Maddux, like Clemens, isn't eligible yet. The greatest stars of the 70s-80s-90s, other than these guys, probably are Schmidt, Seaver, then guys like Henderson, Yastrzemski, Brett, Carlton, Morgan, etc. As great as they were, do any of them resonate as top 10 guys (by DoubleX's criteria)?

I don't know but I think this shows how traditional most baseball lovers are and how we cling to our history. Actually, I think it's fine. Those more recent names you mention may show up on our grandchildren's lists.

[jjpm74]

I think these are very good points, and I'll probably end up ranking the players you mentioned higher than I normally would because of how important they were to the game's development. I anticipate voting for Anson in particular pretty early in this project as he was the game's first real superstar. That being said, Anson, Kelly, and Ward don't quite resonate today in the same way that Gehrig, Musial, and Clemente do. We can relate much better to the more modern players as they played a game that looks much more like the game we know, and because they've benefited by 20th Century media.

Al Spalding's impact on the game was immense. Harry Wright was as well, but are we going to include people like these when ranking? Out of the early players who are in as pioneers, which ones are we including as players?

[BigRon]

Isn't it funny (odd) that almost everybody's list contains not more than 1 player, maybe 2 at the most, who has played within the last 35 to 40 years? 30 years from now I wonder what these lists would look like?

I thought about this, too. But, the biggest name of this era (Bonds) isn't yet eligible for the HOF and his name is tarred. Same with Clemens. Maddux, like Clemens and Bonds, isn't eligible yet. The greatest stars of the 70s-80s-90s, other than these guys, probably are Schmidt, Seaver, then guys like Henderson, Yastrzemski, Brett, Carlton, Morgan, etc. As great as they were, do any of them resonate as top 10 guys (by DoubleX's criteria)?

[Yankwood]

Isn't it funny (odd) that almost everybody's list contains not more than 1 player, maybe 2 at the most, who has played within the last 35 to 40 years? 30 years from now I wonder what these lists would look like?

[Los Bravos]

This is very, VERY difficult

1. Ruth
2. Aaron
3. Mays
4. T. Samuel Williams
5. Jackie Robinson
6. Musial
7. Cobb
8. Gehrig
9. Josh Gibson
10. Walter Johnson