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Ranking the HoF Players: 42-45

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  • Ranking the HoF Players: 42-45

    Project Summary: To rank the worthiness of the players inducted into the National Baseball Hall of Fame from most worthy to least worthy.

    Election Format: Voters will submit ballots ranking their 10 most worthy remaining Hall of Fame players in order of worthiness. Each first place vote will be worth 10 points, with each successive rank being worth one point less than the previous rank, ending in a tenth place vote being worth 1 point. Players will also receive one additional point for each ballot they are listed on and players must be listed on at least three ballots in order to be elected. The five players with the highest support at the end of each election will be elected in the order of their support. Elections will last approximately seven days.
    - Tiebreakers: In the event of a tie among players at the end of an election, the first tiebreaker will be the total number of ballot appearance in that election. The second tiebreaker will be total number of points irrespective of number of ballots. The third tiebreaker will be the number first place votes in that election. In the event that there remains a tie for the fifth and final spot in an election, there will be a three day run-off by poll. Players that lose in a run-off will slot into the next ranking spot.

    Factors to Consider: As this project focuses on players inducted into the National Baseball Hall of Fame, subjective qualities beyond just statistics should be taken into consideration in determining a player's relative worthiness. In that vein, the voting guidelines that the BBWAA is to follow in actual National Baseball Hall of Fame elections, may be instructive (though not necessarily determinative in this project): "Voting shall be based upon the player's record, playing ability, integrity, sportsmanship, character, and contributions to the team(s) on which the player played."

    Player Eligibility: Only players that have been elected to the National Baseball Hall of Fame as players are eligible, including Negro League players and 19th Century players. A complete list of individuals that have been inducted as players is available at the National Baseball Hall of Fame's website, and is recreated below along with each player's corresponding BBF Rank as determined by this project:

    Results
    1) Babe Ruth
    2) Willie Mays
    3) Ty Cobb
    4) Ted Williams
    5) Hank Aaron
    6) Honus Wagner
    7) Walter Johnson
    8) Lou Gehrig
    9) Cy Young
    10) Stan Musial
    11) Mickey Mantle
    12) Rogers Hornsby
    13) Jackie Robinson
    14) Tris Speaker
    15) Josh Gibson
    16) Eddie Collins
    17) Satchel Paige
    18) Grover Alexander
    19) Frank Robinson
    20) Joe DiMaggio
    21) Oscar Charleston
    22) Mike Schmidt
    23) Lefty Grove
    24) Tom Seaver
    25) Cap Anson
    26) Christy Mathewson
    27) Rickey Henderson
    28) Jimmie Foxx
    29) Nap Lajoie
    30) Joe Morgan
    31) Johnny Bench
    32) Mel Ott
    33) Warren Spahn
    34) Yogi Berra
    35) Cal Ripken
    36) George Brett
    37) Pop Lloyd
    38) Kid Nichols
    39) Eddie Mathews
    40) Bob Feller
    41) Roberto Clemente

    Master List
    Code:
    Player				BBF Rank
    Hank Aaron			5
    Grover Alexander		18
    Roberto Alomar
    Cap Anson			25
    Luis Aparicio
    Luke Appling
    Richie Ashburn
    Earl Averill
    Frank Baker
    Dave Bancroft
    Ernie Banks
    Jake Beckley
    Cool Papa Bell
    Johnny Bench			31
    Chief Bender
    Yogi Berra			34
    Bert Blyleven
    Wade Boggs
    Jim Bottomley
    Lou Boudreau
    Roger Bresnahan
    George Brett			36
    Lou Brock
    Dan Brouthers
    Mordecai Brown
    Ray Brown
    Willard Brown
    Jim Bunning
    Jesse Burkett
    Roy Campanella
    Rod Carew
    Max Carey
    Steve Carlton
    Gary Carter
    Orlando Cepeda
    Frank Chance
    Oscar Charleston		21
    Jack Chesbro
    Fred Clarke
    John Clarkson
    Roberto Clemente		41
    Ty Cobb				3
    Mickey Cochrane
    Eddie Collins			16
    Jimmy Collins
    Earle Combs
    Roger Connor
    Andy Cooper
    Stan Coveleski
    Sam Crawford
    Jo Cronin
    Kiki Cuyler
    Ray Dandridge
    George Davis
    Andre Dawson
    Leon Day
    Dizzy Dean
    Ed Delahanty
    Bill Dickey
    Martin Dihigo	
    Joe DiMaggio			20
    Larry Doby
    Bobby Doerr
    Don Drysdale
    Hugh Duffy
    Dennis Eckersley
    Johnny Evers
    Buck Ewing
    Red Faber
    Bob Feller			40
    Rick Ferrell
    Rollie Fingers
    Carlton Fisk
    Elmer Flick
    Whitey Ford
    Bill Foster
    Nellie Fox
    Jimmie Foxx			28
    Frankie Frisch
    Pud Galvin
    Lou Gehrig			8
    Charlie Gehringer
    Bob Gibson
    Josh Gibson			15
    Lefty Gomez
    Joe Gordon
    Goose Goslin
    Rich Gossage
    Frank Grant
    Hank Greenberg
    Burleigh Grimes
    Lefty Grove			23
    Tony Gwynn
    Chick Hafey
    Jesse Haines
    Billy Hamilton
    Gabby Hartnett
    Harry Heilmann
    Rickey Henderson		27
    Billy Herman
    Pete Hill
    Harry Hooper
    Rogers Hornsby			12
    Waite Hoyt
    Carl Hubbell
    Catfish Hunter
    Monte Irvin
    Reggie Jackson
    Travis Jackson
    Ferguson Jenkins
    Hugh Jennings
    Judy Johnson
    Walter Johnson			7
    Addie Joss
    Al Kaline
    Tim Keefe
    Willie Keeler
    George Kell
    Joe Kelley
    George Kelly
    King Kelly
    Harmon Killebrew
    Ralph Kiner
    Chuck Klein
    Sandy Koufax
    Nap Lajoie			29
    Tony Lazzeri
    Bob Lemon
    Buck Leonard
    Freddie Lindstrom
    Pop Lloyd			37
    Ernie Lombard
    Ted Lyons
    Biz Mackey
    Mickey Mantle			11
    Heinie Manush
    Rabbit Maranville
    Juan Marichal
    Rube Marquard
    Eddie Mathews			39
    Christy Mathewson		26
    Willie Mays			2
    Bill Mazeroski
    Tommy McCarthy
    Willie McCovey
    Joe McGinnity
    Bid McPhee
    Joe Medwick
    Jose Mendez
    Johnny Mize
    Paul Molitor
    Joe Morgan			30
    Eddie Murray
    Stan Musial			10
    Hal Newhouser
    Kid Nichols			38
    Phil Niekro
    Jim O’Rourke
    Mel Ott				32
    Satchel Paige			17
    Jim Palmer
    Herb Pennock
    Tony Perez
    Gaylord Perry
    Eddie Plank
    Kirby Puckett
    Charles Radbourn
    Pee Wee Reese
    Jim Rice
    Sam Rice
    Cal Ripken			35
    Eppa Rixey
    Phil Rizzuto
    Robin Roberts
    Brooks Robinson
    Frank Robinson			19
    Jackie Robinson			13
    Bullet Rogan
    Edd Roush
    Red Ruffing
    Amos Rusie
    Babe Ruth			1
    Nolan Ryan
    Ryne Sandberg
    Louis Santop
    Ray Schalk
    Mike Schmidt			22
    Red Schoendienst
    Tom Seaver			24
    Joe Sewell
    Al Simmons
    George Sisler
    Enos Slaughter
    Hilton Smith
    Ozzie Smith
    Duke Snider
    Warren Spahn			33
    Tris Speaker			14
    Willie Stargell
    Turkey Stearnes
    Bruce Sutter
    Mule Suttles
    Don Sutton
    Ben Taylor
    Bill Terry
    Sam Thompson
    Joe Tinker
    Cristobal Torriente
    Pie Traynor
    Dazzy Vance
    Arky Vaughan
    Rube Waddell
    Honus Wagner			6
    Bobby Wallace
    Ed Walsh
    Lloyd Waner
    Paul Waner
    John Ward
    Mickey Welch
    Willie Wells
    Zack Wheat
    Hoyt Wilhelm
    Billy Williams
    Joe Williams
    Ted Williams			4
    Vic Willis
    Hack Wilson
    Jud Wilson
    Dave Winfield
    Early Wynn
    Carl Yastrzemski
    Cy Young			9
    Ross Youngs
    Robin Yount
    Links to Previous Elections
    Election 1-5
    Election 6-10
    Election 11-15
    Election 16-20
    Election 21- 25
    Election 26-30
    Election 31-35
    Election 36-40 (41)

  • #2
    1) Bob Gibson - 10
    2) Dan Brouthers - 9
    3) Sandy Koufax - 8
    4) Hank Greenberg - 7
    5) Carl Yastrzemski - 6
    6) Steve Carlton - 5
    7) Joe Williams - 4
    8) Ed Delahanty - 3
    9) Roger Connor - 2
    10) Johnny Mize - 1

    Just missed: Al Kaline

    Comment


    • #3
      1. Hank Greenberg - 10
      2. Monte Ward - 9
      3. Al Kaline - 8
      4. Steve Carlton - 7
      5. Mickey Cochrane - 6
      6. Carl Yastrzemski - 5
      7. King Kelly - 4
      8. Joe Williams - 3
      9. Dan Brouthers - 2
      10. Sandy Koufax - 1

      Comment


      • #4
        1) John Clarkson (10)
        2) Jesse Burkett (9)
        3) Tony Gwynn (8)
        4) Ed Delahanty (7)
        5) Steve Carlton (6)
        6) Eddie Murray (5)
        7) Joe Williams (4)
        8) Bob Gibson (3)
        9) Dan Brouthers (2)
        10) Carl Yastrzemski (1)

        Comment


        • #5
          1. Charlie Gehringer
          2. Carl Yastrzemski
          3. Wade Boggs
          4. Dan Brouthers
          5. Ed Delahanty
          6. Bullet Rogan
          7. Martin Dihigo
          8. Tony Gwynn
          9. Sam Crawford
          10. Paul Waner

          Comment


          • #6
            1. Sandy Koufax
            2. Johnny Mize
            3. Smokey Joe Williams
            4. Bob Gibson
            5. Carl Yastrzemski
            6. Al Kaline
            7. Dan Brouthers
            8. Ed Delahanty
            9. Steve Carlton
            10. Charlie Gehringer

            Comment


            • #7
              Ballot:

              1. Joe Williams
              2. Turkey Stearns
              3. Bob Gibson
              4. Al Kaline
              5. Hank Greenberg
              6. Carl Yastrzemski
              7. Steve Carlton
              8. Sandy Koufax
              9. Tony Gwynn
              10. Mickey Cochrane

              Comment


              • #8
                1. Joe Williams
                2. Turkey Stearnes
                3. Bob Gibson
                4. Roger Connor
                5. Dan Brouthers
                6. Wade Boggs
                7. Carl Yastrzemski
                8. Ed Delahanty
                9. Charlie Gehringer
                10. Al Kaline
                Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                Comment


                • #9
                  1 - Monte Ward
                  2 - Bob Gibson
                  3 - Hank Greenberg
                  4 - Ed Delahanty
                  5 - Nolan Ryan
                  6 - Carl Yastrzemski
                  7 - Reggie Jackson
                  8 - Johnnie Mize
                  9 - Robin Yount
                  10 -Willie McCovey

                  Ranking the "most deserving" hall of famers, to me, is something different than just ranking who were the best players. Nolan Ryan was not as good as several other pitchers that I'm not voting for yet, but because of other factors about his career, he is more of an essential hall of famer than those other pitchers IMO. Same with others on this list.
                  Last edited by SavoyBG; 10-05-2011, 01:51 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by SavoyBG View Post
                    Ranking the "most deserving" hall of famers, to me, is something different than just ranking who were the best players. Nolan Ryan was not as good as several other pitchers that I'm not voting for yet, but because of other factors about his career, he is more of an essential hall of famer than those other pitchers IMO. Same with others on this list.
                    You're right and you actually got me thinking about Ryan in the last election when he just made your ballot. My issue with Ryan is that I tend to regard him as one of the most overhyped players in history, but he's popularly regarded as one of the most dominant and imposing pitchers in history, and the reputation and "fame" count for something. All those no hitters and strikeouts certainly help the notoriety factor as well.

                    I'm still not sure what to do with him, but he's probably among the next two to four pitchers not currently on my ballot. Whitey Ford and Jim Palmer are two more pitchers that may do a little better in this kind of ranking than a straight performance ranking.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by DoubleX View Post
                      You're right and you actually got me thinking about Ryan in the last election when he just made your ballot. My issue with Ryan is that I tend to regard him as one of the most overhyped players in history, but he's popularly regarded as one of the most dominant and imposing pitchers in history, and the reputation and "fame" count for something. All those no hitters and strikeouts certainly help the notoriety factor as well.

                      I'm still not sure what to do with him, but he's probably among the next two to four pitchers not currently on my ballot. Whitey Ford and Jim Palmer are two more pitchers that may do a little better in this kind of ranking than a straight performance ranking.
                      According to WAR Ryan is almost dead even with Gibson and slightly ahead of Carlton. Blyleven goes the other way. Pure stats say that he's much more deserving than he actually is. Niekro too. WAR gives a lot of credit for just being there. According to WAR Koufax is about even woth Coveleski.

                      Rank Player (age) WAR for Pitchers Throws
                      1. Cy Young+ 146.0 R
                      2. Roger Clemens 128.4 R
                      3. Walter Johnson+ 127.7 R
                      4. Tom Seaver+ 105.3 R
                      5. Pete Alexander+ 104.9 R
                      6. Kid Nichols+ 102.3 R
                      7. Lefty Grove+ 98.3 L
                      8. Greg Maddux 96.8 R
                      Phil Niekro+ 96.8 R
                      10. Gaylord Perry+ 96.3 R
                      11. Warren Spahn+ 93.4 L
                      12. Randy Johnson 91.8 L
                      13. Bert Blyleven+ 90.1 R
                      14. Christy Mathewson+ 87.7 R
                      15. Bob Gibson+ 85.6 R
                      16. Nolan Ryan+ 84.8 R
                      17. Steve Carlton+ 84.4 L
                      18. Tim Keefe+ 82.5 R
                      19. John Clarkson+ 82.1 R
                      20. Fergie Jenkins+ 81.3 R

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by SavoyBG View Post
                        143.2 1. Cy Young+ 146.0 R
                        128.8 2. Roger Clemens 128.4 R
                        139.8 3. Walter Johnson+ 127.7 R
                        106.1 4. Tom Seaver+ 105.3 R
                        106.8 5. Pete Alexander+ 104.9 R
                        103.2 6. Kid Nichols+ 102.3 R
                        93.3 7. Lefty Grove+ 98.3 L
                        96.9 8. Greg Maddux 96.8 R
                        93.0 Phil Niekro+ 96.8 R
                        90.5 10. Gaylord Perry+ 96.3 R
                        89.7 11. Warren Spahn+ 93.4 L
                        89.6 12. Randy Johnson 91.8 L
                        87.6 13. Bert Blyleven+ 90.1 R
                        90.7 14. Christy Mathewson+ 87.7 R
                        91.8 15. Bob Gibson+ 85.6 R
                        80.5 16. Nolan Ryan+ 84.8 R
                        86.9 17. Steve Carlton+ 84.4 L
                        79.0 18. Tim Keefe+ 82.5 R
                        81.3 19. John Clarkson+ 82.1 R
                        81.5 20. Fergie Jenkins+ 81.3 R
                        82.7 Robin Roberts
                        Career WAR with offense included.
                        Si quaeris peninsulam amoenam, circumspice.

                        Comprehensive Reform for the Veterans Committee -- Fixing the Hall continued.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          01. Arky Vaughan
                          02. Joe Williams
                          03. Hank Greenberg
                          04. Bob Gibson
                          05. John Ward
                          06. Dan Brouthers
                          07. Carl Yastrzemski
                          08. Turkey Stearnes
                          09. Al Kaline
                          10. Steve Carlton

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            1. John Montgomery Ward - 10 Points, Ballot 87 (Founded Players Union and Players League)
                            2. King Kelly - 9 Points, Ballot #8 (Huge innovator for the game. Arguably baseball's first super-star)
                            3. Hank Greenberg - 8 Points, Ballot #5 (SEE PVNICK)
                            4. Reggie Jackson - 7 Points, Ballot #3 (One of baseballs most famous, most loved, and most hated personalities, specifically from post-"golden era" baseball; arguably the best right fielder not already elected here)
                            5. Bob Gibson - 6 Point, Ballot #3 (Arguably the best pitcher of the 1960's, an era filled to the brim with great pitchers; his 1968 season is possibly the greatest season by a pitcher ever)
                            6. Carl Yastrzemski - 5 Points, Ballot #3 (Considered the best LF after Musial and Williams who were both elected in the top 10; the last player to hit for the triple crown)
                            7. Sandy Koufax - 5 Points, Ballot #2 (While it's arguable if he was even the best pitcher of his generation, any people claim he was the greatest pitcher to ever play the game and is thought of highly by todays generation as well; as famous for his early retirement as he is for his record four no-hitters when he retired)
                            8. Wade Boggs - 3 Points, Ballot #2 (Along with George Brett and Eddie Mathews, it's arguable he was the 2nd greatest 3rd basemen to ever play; one of the greatest hitters to ever play)
                            9. Frank Baker - 2 Points, Ballot #2 (Known as "Home Run" Baker, he led his league in HR's 4 years straight before the HR explosion of the 1920's; part of Connie Mack's $100,000 infield; best 3rd basemen before the explosion of the 1960's-1980's)
                            10. Roy Campanella - 1 Point, Ballot #1 (One of the best hitting catchers of all time; known as one of the key members of the 1950's Dodgers; also known for his tragically short career)
                            AL East Champions: 1981 1982
                            AL Pennant: 1982
                            NL Central Champions: 2011
                            NL Wild Card: 2008

                            "It was like coming this close to your dreams and then watching them brush past you like a stranger in a crowd. At the time you don't think much of it; you know, we just don't recognize the significant moments of our lives while they're happening. Back then I thought, 'Well, there'll be other days.' I didn't realize that that was the only day." - Moonlight Graham

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by The Dude View Post
                              6. Carl Yastrzemski - 5 Points, Ballot #3 (Considered the best LF after Musial and Williams
                              Mmm. Most WAR, 800+ G in LF
                              Code:
                              Rk             Player WAR/pos OPS+    PA From   To    G
                              1           Babe Ruth   172.0  206 10617 1914 1935 2503 H
                              2         Barry Bonds   171.8  181 12606 1986 2007 2986
                              3         Stan Musial   127.8  159 12712 1941 1963 3026 H
                              4        Ted Williams   125.3  190  9791 1939 1960 2292 H
                              5    Rickey Henderson   113.1  127 13346 1979 2003 3081 H
                              6      Frank Robinson   107.4  154 11743 1956 1976 2808 H
                              7    Carl Yastrzemski    88.7  129 13991 1961 1983 3308 H
                              8        Ed Delahanty    74.7  152  8400 1888 1903 1837 H
                              9         Fred Clarke    73.4  132  9838 1894 1915 2246 H
                              10      Jesse Burkett    68.0  140  9620 1890 1905 2067 H
                              11      Manny Ramirez    67.2  154  9774 1993 2011 2302
                              12         Tim Raines    64.6  123 10359 1979 2002 2502
                              13         Al Simmons    63.6  132  9515 1924 1944 2215 H
                              14       Goose Goslin    63.0  128  9822 1921 1938 2287 H
                              15       Sherry Magee    59.1  136  8546 1904 1919 2087
                              16         Zack Wheat    57.8  129  9996 1909 1927 2410 H
                              17    Willie Stargell    57.5  147  9026 1962 1982 2360 H
                              18     Billy Williams    57.2  133 10519 1959 1976 2488 H
                              19        Joe Medwick    55.8  134  8142 1932 1948 1984 H
                              20         Joe Kelley    55.5  133  8139 1891 1908 1853 H
                              Si quaeris peninsulam amoenam, circumspice.

                              Comprehensive Reform for the Veterans Committee -- Fixing the Hall continued.

                              Comment

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