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Pirates BBF Franchise HOF round three

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  • Pirates BBF Franchise HOF round three

    This election will close on January 28, 2012, at 7:00 a.m EST.

    This is the third round for this franchise. The secong round is here.

    We inducted the following players:
    Babe Adams
    Barry Bonds
    Max Carey
    Fred Clarke
    Roberto Clemente
    Wilbur Cooper
    Bob Friend
    Ralph Kiner
    Vern Law
    Tommy Leach
    Sam Leever
    Bill Mazeroski
    Dave Parker
    Willie Stargell
    Pie Traynor
    Andy Van Slyke
    Arky Vaughan
    Honus Wagner
    Paul Waner

    Now the contributors:
    Joe Brown
    Barney Dreyfuss
    Danny Murtaugh

    PLEASE READ THE FORMAT AND RULES SECTION BEFORE VOTING. THANK YOU.

    FORMAT AND RULES

    Purpose: The purpose of this project is to create a Hall of Fame for each franchise whereby each franchise will honor those individuals whose contributions and accomplishments are most notable, significant, and enduring to that franchise's history. This project is not about simply honoring those with the best statistics with each franchise.

    Standards: Each franchise has its own unique history and context, and thus contributions and accomplishments that may stand out remarkably within one franchise's history, may not be so remarkable in another franchise's history. Standards from franchise to franchise will inherently vary, and thus there should be no impetus to create equal standards among the franchises or to aspire to the standards of the National Baseball Hall of Fame. Consequently, subjectivity within the context of the franchise in question will play an inevitable role when considering an individual's contributions and accomplishments with respect to that franchise. In sum, a franchise's Hall of Fame should be unaffected by the standards and contexts of other franchises as well as the National Baseball Hall of Fame, and should be entirely a product of its own history.

    Election Format: Elections will be conducted one franchise at a time starting in chronological order with the oldest continuously and currently operational franchise. Each election will last approximately five days.
    - Ballot Size: Voters can select up to 15 players and 5 contributors per election. There is no minimum ballot size.
    - Ballot Editing: To account for ongoing discussion, voters may edit their ballots as often as necessary through the end of an election.
    - Election Percentage: Any individual that is listed on at least 75% of either the player or contributor submitted ballots will be elected to that team's Hall of Fame. In instances where an individual receive votes as both a player and a contributor, that individual will be elected if listed on at least 75% of ballots in either category or if the individual's combined vote total is at least 75% of the category with the greatest number of ballots submitted. However, a minimum of six votes is needed for election.
    - Subsequent Rounds: After an election has been performed for each franchise, a second round of elections will commence, again proceeding in chronological order. A third round of elections (and perhaps beyond) may also be held depending on interest.

    Eligibility:
    - Players: Players may be considered by any currently operational franchise for which they appeared and are eligible either immediately upon officially retiring or after having not appeared at any level of professional baseball for an entire season for reasons not due to injury.
    - Contributors: Individuals that contributed in other capacities to a franchise may be considered, including managers, coaches, executives, owners, and broadcasters. Mascots are eligible. Contributors that are still active may only be elected by their current employing franchise, and cannot be considered by prior employing franchises until no longer active (this does not apply to individuals who are employed by a franchise only in nominal and/or non-integral ways, such as in scouting, consulting, or public relations capacities).
    - Multiple Capacities: The totality of contributions and accomplishments with respect to a franchise are to be considered, and thus an individual can only be elected once by a franchise. For purposes of ballot size limits, an individual should be designated either a player or contributor based on what the voter perceives to be the individual's greater role with the franchise. An individual should not be listed as either a player or contributor merely to facilitate ballot space for the other category.
    - Relocations/Renaming: Franchises that have relocated and/or been renamed, may still consider and elect individuals that were with the franchise prior to the relocation/renaming.
    - Multiple Franchises: An individual may be considered and elected by multiple franchises.

    PITTSBURGH PIRATES
    Franchise History
    - Founded: 1882 (AA from 1882-1886, NL since)
    - Former Locations/Names: Pittsburgh Alleghenys (1882-1890)

    Titles
    - World Series Championships: 5 (1909, 1925, 1960, 1971, 1979)
    - Pennants: 9 (1901, 1902, 1903, 1909, 1925, 1927, 1960, 1971, 1979)
    - Division Titles: 9 (1970, 1971, 1972, 1974, 1975, 1979, 1990, 1991, 1992)
    - Wild Card Berths: 0

    Helpful Links
    The following links are all courtesy of baseball-reference.com, baseball-almanac.com, and wikipedia.com and may assist voters in determining an individual's impact on this franchise:
    - Franchise Almanac
    - All Batters
    - All Pitchers
    - Batting Leaders
    - Pitching Leaders
    - Most Common Positional Starters
    - Most Common Pitching Staff Alignments
    - Managers
    - Notable Owners and Executives
    - Notable Broadcasters

    Award Recipients
    - MVP Recipients (7): Barry Bonds (1992), Barry Bonds (1990), Willie Stargell (1979), Dave Parker (1978), Roberto Clemente (1966), Dick Groat (1960), Paul Waner (1927)

    - Cy Young Recipients (2): Doug Drabek (1990), Vern Law (1960)

    - RoY Recipients (1): Jason Bay (2004)

    - Batting Triple Crown (0):

    - Pitching Triple Crown (0):

    Multiple All Star Selections (no adjustment for double selections for 1959-1962)
    Code:
    Rank 	Player			Selections
    1	Roberto Clemente	15
    2	Bill Mazeroski		10
    3	Arky Vaughan		8
    t4	Smoky Burgess		7
    t4	Willie Stargell		7
    t6	Roy Face		6
    t6	Dick Groat		6
    8	Ralph Kiner		5
    t9	Bobby Bonilla		4
    t9	Bob Elliott		4
    t9	Bob Friend		4
    t9	Dave Parker		4
    t9	Tony Pena		4
    t9	Rip Sewell		4
    t9	Paul Waner		4
    t16	Frankie Gustine		3
    t16	Jason Kendall*		3
    t16	Al Oliver		3
    t16	Freddy Sanchez*		3
    t16	Manny Sanguillen	3
    t16	Bob Skinner		3
    t16	Frank Thomas		3
    t16	Andy Van Slyke		3
    t24	Gene Alley		2
    t24	Matty Alou		2
    t24	Jason Bay*		2
    t24	Barry Bonds		2
    t24	Vince DiMaggio		2
    t24	Phil Garner		2
    t24	Brian Giles		2
    t24	Vern Law		2
    t24	Bill Madlock		2
    t24	Dick Stuart		2
    t24	Pie Traynor		2
    t24	Bob Veale		2
    t24	Mike Williams		2
    
    * Player is currently active
    Notable Player List
    The following is a list of retired players who with this franchise had at least 3,000 plate appearances (or 2,500 if predominantly played during the 19th Century), 1,000 innings pitched, or appeared as pitcher in 200 games. This list is purely meant as a guide for players who contributed to this franchise over some modicum of time, though players with this franchise not appearing on this list may still be considered by voters, as it is entirely possible that a player may have made a significant and lasting contribution to this franchise despite having a relatively short tenure with the franchise.

    Code:
    Players (100)
    Babe Adams
    Gene Alley
    Matty Alou
    Clyde Barnhart
    Ginger Beaumont
    Jake Beckley
    Jay Bell
    Lou Bierbauer
    Carson Bigbee
    Steve Blass
    Barry Bonds
    Bobby Bonilla
    Max Butcher
    Howie Camnitz
    John Candelaria
    Max Carey
    Fred Carroll
    Fred Clarke
    Roberto Clemente
    Donn Clendenon
    Wilbur Cooper
    Murry Dickson
    Patsy Donovan
    Doug Drabek
    Bob Elliott
    Dock Ellis
    Bones Ely
    Roy Face
    Elbie Fletcher
    Larry French
    Bob Friend
    Pud Galvin
    George Gibson
    Brian Giles
    Dave Giusti
    George Grantham
    Charlie Grimm
    Dick Groat
    Frankie Gustine
    Lee Handley
    Pink Hawley
    Richie Hebner
    Frank Killen
    Ralph Kiner
    Jeff King
    Bruce Kison
    Ron Kline
    Ray Kremer
    Vern Law
    Tommy Leach
    Sam Seever
    Lefty Leifield
    Jose Lind
    Bill Madlock
    Al Martin
    Bill Mazeroski
    Al McBean
    Doggie Miller
    Bob Moose
    Omar Moreno
    Ed Morris
    Johnny Morrison
    Al Oliver
    Dave Parker
    Tony Pena
    Deacon Phillippe
    Johnny Ray
    Jerry Reuss
    Rick Rhoden
    Claude Ritchey
    Don Robinson
    Jim Rooker
    Jim Russell
    Manny Sanguillen
    Scott Sauerbeck
    Rip Sewell
    Bob Skinner
    Mike Smith
    Willie Stargell
    Rennie Stennett
    Gus Suhr
    Bill Swift
    Jesse Tannehill
    Kent Tekulve
    Frank Thomas
    Salomon Torres
    Pie Traynor
    Andy Van Slyke
    Arky Vaughan
    Bob Veale
    Bill Virdon
    Honus Wagner
    Bob Walk
    Lloyd Waner
    Paul Waner
    Mike Williams
    Vic Willis
    Chief Wilson
    Kevin Young
    Notable Managers (with at least 300 games managed with this franchise or at least one pennant win)
    Code:
    Manager			Games		Win %	WS Titles	Pennants	Div Titles	Wild Cards
    Hugo Bezdek		356		.470
    Al Buckenberger		336		.565
    Donie Bush		427		.580			1
    Fred Clarke		2427		.595	1		4
    Jewel Ens		344		.513
    Frankie Frisch		1085		.505
    George Gibson		733		.549
    Fred Haney		462		.353
    Gene Lamont		647		.457
    Jim Leyland		1716		.496					3
    Lloyd McClendon		782		.430
    Bill McKechnie		707		.583	1
    Billy Meyer		774		.412
    Danny Murtaugh		2068		.540	2		5		4
    Horace Phillips		621		.482
    John Russell		485		.384
    Larry Shepard		320		.514
    Chuck Tanner		1398		.509	1		1		1
    Jim Tracy		324		.417
    Pie Traynor		868		.530
    Bill Virdon		291		.560			1		1
    Harry Walker		409		.549
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

  • #2
    My balllot:

    Players:
    Ginger Beaumont
    Jake Beckley
    Bobby Bonilla
    John Candelaria
    Roy Face
    Elbie Fletcher
    Pud Galvin
    Brian Giles
    Ed Morris
    Al Oliver
    Tony Pena
    Deacon Phillippe
    Manny Sanguillen
    Jesse Tannehill
    Bob Veale

    Contributor:
    Bob Prince
    Chuck Tanner
    Last edited by jalbright; 01-25-2012, 08:06 AM.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

    Comment


    • #3
      Players
      Gene Alley
      Jay Bell
      Bobby Bonilla
      Smoky Burgess
      Doug Drabek
      Bob Elliott
      Roy Face
      Brian Giles
      Dick Groat
      Al Oliver
      Tony Pena
      Manny Sangullen
      Rick Rhoden
      Rip Sewell
      Bob Veale

      Contributors
      John Forbes
      John Galbreath
      Bill McKechnie
      Bob Prince
      Chuck Tanner

      Comment


      • #4
        Players
        Ginger Beaumont
        Jake Beckley
        John Candelaria
        Bob Elliott
        Elbie Fletcher
        Brian Giles
        Richie Hebner
        Jason Kendall
        Ed Morris
        Al Oliver
        Deacon Phillippe
        Manny Sanguillen
        Mike Smith
        Jesse Tannehill
        Lloyd Waner

        Contributors
        Donie Bush
        George Gibson
        Bill McKechnie
        Chuck Tanner
        Bill Virdon
        *** Submit your personal HOF as your ballot for the Single Ballot BBF Hall of Fame! *** Also: Buck the Fraves!

        Comment


        • #5
          Players:

          Ginger Beaumont

          Jake Beckley

          John Candelaria

          Elbie Fletcher

          Brian Giles

          Jason Kendall

          Ed Morris

          Al Oliver

          Deacon Phillipe

          Bob Veale


          Contributors:

          Bill McKechnie

          Bob Prince

          Chuck Tanner
          Last edited by NJRob65; 01-14-2012, 09:49 PM.

          Comment


          • #6
            Haven't voted yet, but I will. I normally don't do a lot of lobbying, but I'll state categorically that, except for a couple of managers and GM/owner types, NOBODY was a bigger contributor to Pittsburgh Pirates baseball than Bob Prince. I guess you had to live it to understand it, but for more than 25 years Prince was more than the voice of the Pirates- he embodied the spirit, heart, and soul of the players and the team through his broadcasts. EVERYBODY in the tri-state area had an opinion of Prince- and it wasn't always positive, though it usually was. Prince had the uncanny ability to make everybody talk about baseball and the Pirates. He also played a very large role in helping Roberto Clemente become a hero to the Pirates fans. He glossed over Clemente's rough edges, he relentlessly played up (and sometimes overplayed) Clemente's abilities, he became a spokesman in many ways for Clemente, who for years (understandably) didn't speak English particularly well. Prince, in many ways, WAS baseball in Pittsburgh.

            Comment


            • #7
              Players:

              Jake Beckley
              Ginger Beaumont
              Bobby Bonilla
              Doug Drabek
              Bob Elliott
              Roy Face
              Pud Galvin
              Brian Giles
              Dick Groat
              Ed Morris
              Al Oliver
              Tony Pena
              Deacon Phillippe
              Rip Sewell
              Jesse Tannehill

              Contributors:

              Bob Prince (thanks BigRon for reminding me how important he's been to this franchise)
              Chuck Tanner

              Originally posted by jalbright View Post
              Vern Law
              Vern Law was elected last election

              Comment


              • #8
                Ginger Beaumont
                John Candelaria
                Elroy Face
                Brian Giles- a short run, but he was almost uniformly excellent
                Dick Groat- surprised he hasn't gotten more support
                Jason Kendall
                Al Oliver
                Tony Pena
                Deacon Phillipe
                Rip Sewell
                Gus Suhr- I'm the only one?
                Kent Tekulve- seriously, he hasn't been elected yet? No other votes? What gives?
                Bob Veale
                Bill Virdon
                Lloyd Waner

                I like Elliott, Drabek, Blass, MAlou, Burgess, Hebner- if there's a fourth round

                Contributors

                John Galbreath
                Bill McKechnie
                Bob Prince
                Chuck Tanner

                Comment


                • #9
                  When I was putting my ballot together I didn't have Kent Tekulve down, just assuming he'd been elected in round 2. Then I looked. I guess i'm amazed that no one else has voted for Tekulve. He was a really good relief pitcher for the Pirates for more than 10 years, really not that far behind Quisenberry.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by jjpm74 View Post
                    Vern Law was elected last election
                    So he was. I went for Oliver instead.
                    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      We've got six votes, which is enough to elect someone. We need two more to have a shot at another election for this franchise.
                      Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                      Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                      A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        bumping the thread.
                        Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                        Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                        A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Players
                          Jake Beckley
                          Smoky Burgess
                          John Candelaria
                          Doug Drabek
                          Bob Elliott
                          Pud Galvin
                          Roy Face
                          Dick Groat
                          Al Oliver
                          Tony Pena
                          Manny Sanguillen
                          Rip Sewell
                          Kent Tekulve

                          Contributors
                          John Forbes
                          John Galbreath
                          Bill McKechnie
                          Bob Prince
                          Chuck Tanner
                          The Writer's Journey

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Tony Pena
                            Brian Giles
                            Manny Sanguillen
                            Roy Face
                            Kent Tekulve
                            Deacon Phillippe
                            Jake Beckley
                            Lloyd Waner
                            Ginger Beaumont
                            John Candelaria
                            Doug Drabek
                            Al Oliver
                            "It ain't braggin' if you can do it." Dizzy Dean

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I'll add a vote for Bob Prince.

                              We're at eight votes for players, so I'll be looking at the results more closely to see if this franchise gets another round of voting. There are seven contributor votes, and that's one shy of what's needed to keep that part of the ballot to have a chance of continuing.
                              Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                              Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                              A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                              Comment

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