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Red Sox BBF HOF project, round four

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  • Red Sox BBF HOF project, round four

    The last round for the Red Sox can be found here: Round Three

    We have already inducted the following:

    Players
    Wade Boggs
    Roger Clemens
    Joe Cronin
    Dom DiMaggio
    Bobby Doerr
    Dwight Evans
    Carlton Fisk
    Jimmie Foxx
    Nomar Garciaparra
    Lefty Grove
    Harry Hooper
    Tex Hughson
    Fred Lynn
    Pedro Martinez
    Mel Parnell
    Rico Petrocelli
    Johnny Pesky
    Manny Ramirez
    Jim Rice
    Babe Ruth
    Reggie Smith
    Tris Speaker
    Vern Stephens
    Luis Tiant
    Ted Williams
    Carl Yastrzsemski
    Cy Young

    Contributors election concluded
    Bill Carrigan
    Joe Cronin
    Theo Epstein
    Terry Francona


    This election will close on Saturday. March 10 at 7 am EST.

    PLEASE READ THE FORMAT AND RULES SECTION BEFORE VOTING. THANK YOU.

    FORMAT AND RULES

    Purpose: The purpose of this project is to create a Hall of Fame for each franchise whereby each franchise will honor those individuals whose contributions and accomplishments are most notable, significant, and enduring to that franchise's history. This project is not about simply honoring those with the best statistics with each franchise.

    Standards: Each franchise has its own unique history and context, and thus contributions and accomplishments that may stand out remarkably within one franchise's history, may not be so remarkable in another franchise's history. Standards from franchise to franchise will inherently vary, and thus there should be no impetus to create equal standards among the franchises or to aspire to the standards of the National Baseball Hall of Fame. Consequently, subjectivity within the context of the franchise in question will play an inevitable role when considering an individual's contributions and accomplishments with respect to that franchise. In sum, a franchise's Hall of Fame should be unaffected by the standards and contexts of other franchises as well as the National Baseball Hall of Fame, and should be entirely a product of its own history.

    Election Format: Elections will be conducted one franchise at a time starting in chronological order with the oldest continuously and currently operational franchise. Each election will last approximately seven days.
    - Ballot Size: Voters can select up to 15 players and 5 contributors per election. Ballots that exceed the maximum limits at the close of an election will not be counted. There is no minimum ballot size.
    - Ballot Editing: To account for ongoing discussion, voters may edit their ballots as often as necessary through the end of an election.
    - Election Percentage: Any individual that is listed on at least 75% of either the player or contributor submitted ballots will be elected to that team's Hall of Fame. In instances where an individual receive votes as both a player and a contributor, that individual will be elected if listed on at least 75% of ballots in either category or if the individual's combined vote total is at least 75% of the category with the greatest number of ballots submitted. However, a minimum of six (6) votes is needed to elect in any and all circumstances.
    - Subsequent Rounds: After an election has been performed for each franchise, a second round of elections will commence, again proceeding in chronological order. A third round of elections (and perhaps beyond) may also be held depending on interest.

    Eligibility:
    - Players: Players may be considered by any currently operational franchise for which they appeared and are eligible either immediately upon officially retiring or after having not appeared at any level of professional baseball for an entire season for reasons not due to injury.
    - Contributors: Individuals that contributed in other capacities to a franchise may be considered, including managers, coaches, executives, owners, and broadcasters, but not fictional characters such as mascots. Contributors that are still active may only be elected by their current employing franchise, and cannot be considered by prior employing franchises until no longer active (this does not apply to individuals who are employed by a franchise only in nominal and/or non-integral ways, such as in scouting, consulting, or public relations capacities).
    - Multiple Capacities: The totality of contributions and accomplishments with respect to a franchise are to be considered, and thus an individual can only be elected once by a franchise. For purposes of ballot size limits, an individual should be designated either a player or contributor based on what the voter perceives to be the individual's greater role with the franchise. An individual should not be listed as either a player or contributor merely to facilitate ballot space for the other category.
    - Relocations/Renaming: Franchises that have relocated and/or been renamed, may still consider and elect individuals that were with the franchise prior to the relocation/renaming.
    - Multiple Franchises: An individual may be considered and elected by multiple franchises.


    BOSTON RED SOX

    Franchise History
    - Founded: 1901 (AL for entire existence)
    - Former Locations/Names: Boston Americans (1901-1907)

    Titles
    - World Series Championships: 7 (1903, 1912, 1915, 1916, 1918, 2004, 2007)
    - Pennants: 12 (1903, 1904, 1912, 1915, 1916, 1918, 1946, 1967, 1975, 1986, 2004, 2007)
    - Division Titles: 6 (1975, 1986, 1988, 1990, 1995, 2007)
    - Wild Card Berths: 7 (1998, 1999, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2008, 2009)

    Helpful Links
    The following links are all courtesy of baseball-reference.com, baseball-almanac.com, and wikipedia.com, and may assist voters in determining an individual's impact on this franchise:
    - Franchise Almanac
    - All Batters
    - All Pitchers
    - Batting Leaders
    - Pitching Leaders
    - Most Common Positional Starters
    - Most Common Pitching Staff Alignments
    - Managers
    - Notable Owners and Executives
    - Notable Broadcasters

    Award Recipients
    - MVP Recipients (11): Dustin Pedroia (2008), Mo Vaughn (1995), Roger Clemens (1986), Jim Rice (1978), Fred Lynn (1975), Carl Yastrzemski (1967), Jackie Jensen (1958), Ted Williams (1949), Ted Williams (1946), Jimmie Foxx (1938), Tris Speaker (1912)

    - Cy Young Recipients (6): Pedro Martinez (2000), Pedro Martinez (1999), Roger Clemens (1991), Roger Clemens (1987), Roger Clemens (1986), Jim Lonborg (1967)

    - RoY Recipients (6): Dustin Pedroia (2007), Nomar Garciaparra (1997), Fred Lynn (1975), Carlton Fisk (1972), Don Schwall (1961), Walt Dropo (1950)

    - Batting Triple Crown (3): Carl Yastrzemski (1967), Ted Williams (1947), Ted Williams (1942)

    - Pitching Triple Crown (2): Pedro Martinez (1999), Cy Young (1901)

    Multiple All Star Selections (no adjustment for double selections for 1959-1962)
    Code:

    Rank Player Selections
    1 Ted Williams 19
    2 Carl Yastrzemski 18
    3 Bobby Doerr 9
    t4 Wade Boggs 8
    t4 Frank Malzone 8
    t4 Manny Ramirez* 8
    t4 Jim Rice 8
    t8 Dom DiMaggio 7
    t8 Carlton Fisk 7
    t10 Jimmie Foxx 6
    t10 Fred Lynn 6
    t10 David Ortiz* 6
    t13 Roger Clemens 5
    t13 Joe Cronin 5
    t13 Nomar Garciaparra 5
    t13 Lefty Grove 5
    t13 Pete Runnels 5
    t18 Doc Cramer 4
    t18 Rick Ferrell 4
    t18 Pedro Martinez 4
    t18 Bill Monbouquette 4
    t18 Jonathan Papelbon* 4
    t18 Vern Stephens 4
    t24 Rick Burleson 3
    t24 Dwight Evans 3
    t24 Tex Hughson 3
    t24 Dustin Pedroia* 3
    t24 Jason Varitek* 3
    t24 Mo Vaughn 3
    t30 Luis Aparicio 2
    t30 Josh Beckett* 2
    t30 Scott Cooper 2
    t30 Johnny Damon* 2
    t30 Dave Ferriss 2
    t30 Rich Gedman 2
    t30 Billy Goodman 2
    t30 Mike Greenwell 2
    t30 Jackie Jensen 2
    t30 Bob Johnson 2
    t30 George Kell 2
    t30 Derek Lowe* 2
    t30 Mel Parnell 2
    t30 Rico Petrocelli 2
    t30 Jim Piersall 2
    t30 Dick Radatz 2
    t30 George Scott 2
    t30 Reggie Smith 2
    t30 Bob Stanley 2
    t30 Frank Sullivan 2
    t30 Birdie Tebbetts 2
    t30 Luis Tiant 2
    t30 Kevin Youkilis* 2

    * Player is currently active

    Notable Managers (with at least 300 games managed with this franchise or at least one pennant win)
    Code:
    Manager			Games		Win %	WS Titles	Pennants	Div Titles	Wild Cards
    Ed Barrow		418		.512	1		1
    Lou Boudreau		463		.497
    Bill Carrigan		1003		.494	2		2
    Jimmy Collins		842		.548	1		2
    Joe Cronin		2007		.539			1
    Patsy Donovan		311		.520
    Hugh Duffy		308		.442
    Lee Fohl		463		.394
    Terry Francona*		1134		.577	2		2		1		5
    Billy Herman		310		.413
    Pinky Higgins		1119		.502
    Butch Hobson		439		.472
    Ralph Houk		594		.525
    Darrell Johnson		408		.539			1		1
    Eddie Kasko		640		.539
    Kevin Kennedy		306		.559					1
    Grady Little		324		.580							1
    Joe McCarthy		369		.606
    John McNamara		571		.521			1		2
    Joe Morgan		563		.535					1
    Johnny Pesky		326		.451						
    Jake Stahl		235		.621	1		1
    Dick Williams		477		.545			1
    Jimy Williams		766		.540							2
    Don Zimmer		715		.575
    				
    * Current manager
    Last edited by jalbright; 02-25-2012, 11:23 AM.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

  • #2
    my ballot:

    Jimmy Collins
    Bill Dinneen
    Dennis Eckersley
    Larry Gardner
    Mike Greenwell
    Jackie Jensen
    Ellis Kinder
    Dutch Leonard
    Freddy Parent
    Dick Radatz
    Pete Runnels
    Bob Stanley
    Frank Sullivan
    John Valentin
    Mo Vaughn
    Last edited by jalbright; 02-25-2012, 12:57 PM.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

    Comment


    • #3
      Smoky Joe Wood was elected last round. Here's my ballot:

      Jimmy Collins
      Bill Dinneen
      Rick Ferrell
      Larry Gardner
      Mike Greenwell
      Jackie Jensen
      Ellis Kinder
      Dutch Leonard
      Jim Piersall
      Dick Radatz
      Pete Runnels
      Frank Sullivan
      John Valentin
      Jason Varitek
      Mo Vaughn
      Last edited by jjpm74; 02-28-2012, 02:27 PM.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by jjpm74 View Post
        Smoky Joe Wood was elected last round.
        So he did. He's off and Bill Dinneen on.
        Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
        Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
        A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

        Comment


        • #5
          Jimmy Collins

          Larry Gardner

          Freddy Parent

          John Valentin

          Mo Vaughn

          Tim Wakefield
          Last edited by NJRob65; 02-26-2012, 04:31 PM.

          Comment


          • #6
            Marty Barrett
            Bill Dinneen
            Joe Dobson
            Mike Greenwell
            Bruce Hurst
            Jackie Jensen
            Ellis Kinder
            Dutch Leonard
            Jim Piersall
            Dick Radatz
            Pete Runnels
            Bob Stanley
            John Valentin
            Mo Vaughn
            Tim Wakefield
            "It ain't braggin' if you can do it." Dizzy Dean

            Comment


            • #7
              Ellis Burks
              Rick Burleson
              Jimmy Collins
              Rick Ferrell
              Billy Goodman
              Mike Greenwell
              Jackie Jensen
              Frank Malzone
              Bill Monbouquette
              Jim Piersall
              Pete Runnels
              George Scott
              Bob Stanley
              Frank Sullivan
              John Valentin

              Comment


              • #8
                It may be too late to change the outcome for these players, but two Red Sox I would like to at least give a second chance to are Dick Radatz and Ellis Kinder.

                Radatz wasn't with the Sox for long, only from 1962-66. But he was the best reliever in WAR in the majors for that period, and the single best reliever in WAR in 1962, 1963 and 1964. For me, that's enough to put him in the Sox HOF.

                Kinder excelled in both starting and relieving roles for the Sox. In 1949, he was The Sporting News' Pitcher of the Year. If we use WAR instead, he was 5th in pitcher WAR in the AL in 1949, and 9th in each of 1950, 1951 and 1953. He was the best reliever in the majors in WAR in 1951 and 1953.
                Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Players
                  Jimmy Collins
                  Joe Dobson
                  Wes Ferrell
                  Larry Gardner
                  Mike Greenwell
                  Jackie Jensen
                  Ellis Kinder
                  Dutch Leonard
                  Trot Nixon
                  Freddy Parent
                  Bob Stanley
                  John Valentin
                  Jason Varitek
                  Mo Vaughn
                  Tim Wakefield
                  Last edited by Nerdlinger; 02-28-2012, 12:07 PM.
                  *** Submit your personal HOF as your ballot for the Single Ballot BBF Hall of Fame! *** Also: Buck the Fraves!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    We now have six votes cast in this election, enough to elect someone. If we get two more, this franchise has a shot at a fifth round.
                    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by jalbright View Post
                      It may be too late to change the outcome for these players, but two Red Sox I would like to at least give a second chance to are Dick Radatz and Ellis Kinder.

                      Radatz wasn't with the Sox for long, only from 1962-66. But he was the best reliever in WAR in the majors for that period, and the single best reliever in WAR in 1962, 1963 and 1964. For me, that's enough to put him in the Sox HOF.

                      Kinder excelled in both starting and relieving roles for the Sox. In 1949, he was The Sporting News' Pitcher of the Year. If we use WAR instead, he was 5th in pitcher WAR in the AL in 1949, and 9th in each of 1950, 1951 and 1953. He was the best reliever in the majors in WAR in 1951 and 1953.
                      If we have another round, at least one of these two will make my ballot. Kinder will probably be first in line.

                      Currently, I have Bob Stanley. His Boston WAR is the most of relievers. Some of that is from some time as a starter, but if we substract that, he's still highest eligible. Too bad he's often seen as a goat now.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Since Jason Varitek is retiring, I figure he's eligible now, right? I exchanged Frank Sullivan for Varitek on my ballot.
                        *** Submit your personal HOF as your ballot for the Single Ballot BBF Hall of Fame! *** Also: Buck the Fraves!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by DJC View Post
                          Since Jason Varitek is retiring, I figure he's eligible now, right? I exchanged Frank Sullivan for Varitek on my ballot.
                          I removed Stanley and replaced him with Varitek. It may be too late and he may have to go to the recent retirees round, though.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Varitek is eligible as is Wakefield. If he gets close this election, I'll change my ballot, but I'm not doing it at the moment. He will get a chance in the second chance election (all players who are currently retired and played in 2010 and/or 2011 will) as well as in the current players/recent retirees round if not elected before then. I will vote for both in those future rounds if they're eligible.
                            Last edited by jalbright; 02-28-2012, 03:23 PM.
                            Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                            Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                            A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Just under a week to go, and there's only six votes cast.
                              Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
                              Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
                              A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

                              Comment

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