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BBF Tigers HOF--second chance round

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  • BBF Tigers HOF--second chance round

    This will be one of two second chance round elections begun this week. What we'll do for the second chance election is a Yes/No vote requiring the greater of 6 or 75% of the votes to induct. The election will be limited to the listed nominees. The elections will only be open for a week--but there will be at least three or four days for discussion and new nominations. You can abstain from an entire ballot (player or contributor), but if you vote in that portion of the ballot, only the guys you expressly vote yes for get credit for a positive vote. The others in that section of the ballot will be considered to have gotten a "no" vote. There will be no limits on how many nominees you can vote for . I will also provide the nomination discussions for the nominees.

    In this case, the election will not begin until Saturday, June 16 at 7 am EDT, and will end at 7 am EDT June 23. Nominations close 43 hours before the election begins, or June 14 at noon EDT. Ballots not cast within the stated election time frame will not count.


    The Tigers have the following already inducted:

    Inducted Players (25): Tommy Bridges, Jim Bunning, Donie Bush, Norm Cash, Ty Cobb, Sam Crawford, Bill Freehan, Charlie Gehringer, Kirk Gibson, Hank Greenberg, John Hiller, Al Kaline, Harry Heilmann, Chet Lemon, Mickey Lolich, Dick McAuliffe, Jack Morris, Hal Newhouser, Lance Parrish, Alan Trammell, Dizzy Trout, Virgil Trucks, Bobby Veach, Lou Whitaker, Rudy York

    - Inducted Contributors (5): Sparky Anderson, Jim Campbell, Mickey Cochrane, Ernie Harwell, Hughie Jennings, George Kell

    The list of nominees at present is:

    Players
    Rocky Colavito
    Hooks Dauss
    Bill Donovan
    Cecil Fielder
    Travis Fryman
    Willie Hernandez
    Willie Horton
    Harvey Kuenn
    Frank Lary
    Denny McLain
    George Mullin
    Schoolboy Rowe

    Contributors
    Frank Navin
    Steve O'Neill
    Mayo Smith
    Ty Tyson
    Last edited by jalbright; 06-13-2012, 05:33 PM.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

  • #2
    dgarza also offered this on behalf of Rocky Colavito for the Tigers (no second required):

    Originally posted by dgarza View Post
    Case for...

    Rocky Colavito
    Despite only playing for Detroit for 4 seasons (1960-1963), he was part of 4 ASGs as a Tiger and started 3 of them.
    He only had 2 ASG hits as a Tiger, but they were both Home Runs, giving him a .615 ASG SLG as a Tiger.

    1961 was his best season with Detroit (Tiger seasonal rankings).
    45 HRs (3rd) [Only Cecil Fielder has it as many since.]
    140 RBIs (5th) [No Tiger has had as many since.]
    19 WAR Runs Fielding (9th tied w/ 3 others)
    129 Runs (12th) [No Tiger has had as many since.]
    113 BBs (13th)
    338 Total Bases (16th)
    7.9 WAR (18th)

    From 1960-1963, Colavito :
    1st in RBIs in the AL :
    Code:
                                        
    Rk              Player RBI From   To
    1       Rocky Colavito 430 1960 1963
    2     Harmon Killebrew 424 1960 1963
    3          Roger Maris 406 1960 1963
    4          Jim Gentile 398 1960 1963
    5          Bob Allison 367 1960 1963
    1st in Total Bases in the AL :
    Code:
                                          
    Rk             Player   TB   G From   To
    1      Rocky Colavito 1171 629 1960 1963
    2    Harmon Killebrew 1151 571 1960 1963
    3         Roger Maris 1111 544 1960 1963
    4           Al Kaline 1056 545 1960 1963
    5     Brooks Robinson 1050 638 1960 1963
    2nd in Runs in the AL :
    Code:
                                         
    Rk               Player   R From   To
    1         Mickey Mantle 386 1960 1963
    2        Rocky Colavito 377 1960 1963
    3           Roger Maris 375 1960 1963
    4           Bob Allison 363 1960 1963
    5             Al Kaline 360 1960 1963
    3rd in HRs in the AL :
    Code:
                                        
    Rk              Player  HR From   To
    1     Harmon Killebrew 170 1960 1963
    2          Roger Maris 156 1960 1963
    3       Rocky Colavito 139 1960 1963
    4        Mickey Mantle 139 1960 1963
    5            Norm Cash 124 1960 1963
    5th in WAR in the AL :
    Code:
                                               
    Rk             Player WAR/pos   G From   To
    1       Mickey Mantle    29.0 494 1960 1963
    2         Roger Maris    22.6 544 1960 1963
    3           Norm Cash    20.9 575 1960 1963
    4           Al Kaline    20.5 545 1960 1963
    5      Rocky Colavito    17.5 629 1960 1963
    5th in WAR Runs Fielding in the AL :
    Code:
                                              
    Rk             Player Rfield   G From   To
    1         Clete Boyer     89 582 1960 1963
    2     Brooks Robinson     63 638 1960 1963
    3       Luis Aparicio     54 608 1960 1963
    4          Ron Hansen     48 523 1960 1963
    5      Rocky Colavito     47 629 1960 1963
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

    Comment


    • #3
      Fielder qualifies for consideration, but not my vote.
      Originally posted by dgarza View Post
      Cecil Fielder
      Fielder was a 3x AS (1990,1991,1993) and a 2x Silver Slugger (1990,1991).
      Fielder was 2nd in AL MVP voting 2 years straight (1990-1991), 73% Award Share each.

      Fielder is best remembered as the 1st player to hit 50 HRs since 1977. That 13 year drought was the longest in MLB history since 1920.

      Led AL in SLG (1990), HRs (1990,1991), RBIs (1990,1991,1992).

      30 HRs 5x [1996 was an additional year, but not all with Tigers] (1994 might have given him another in not for the strike) - potentially 7x
      100 RBIs 4x [1996 was an additional year, but not all with Tigers] (1994 might have given him another in not for the strike) - potentially 6x

      Tiger Career Records :
      3rd in ISO (500 game min.)
      5th in HRs
      8th in SLG (500 game min.)

      1990-1996
      Most HRs & RBIs in the AL (even if we subtract the Yankee stats from 1996).

      Fielder was named "Tiger of the Year" by the Detroit chapter of the BBWAA in 1990, 1991, and 1992.

      He was one of only four players, and the only Tiger, to homer over the left-field roof at Tiger Stadium.
      Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
      Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
      A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

      Comment


      • #4
        dgarza has added Travis Fryman to the list of Tigers to be considered with this case:

        Originally posted by dgarza View Post
        Travis Fryman
        It's possible to see Fryman as the Tiger of the 90s.
        He lead the Tigers in total WAR, Games, Hits, Runs, Doubles, Triples
        Was 2nd in HRs, RBIs

        It's also possible to see Fryman as the best Tiger 3B ever.
        Leads 3B in WAR, Runs, Hits, Doubles, HRs, RBIs
        2nd is SLG (500 game min.)

        4x All Star (1992,1993,1994,1996)
        Silver Slugger (1992)

        Led AL at 3B :
        Putouts (1997)
        Assists (1994,1995,1996)
        Range Factor/9 (1995)
        Range Factor/Game (1995)
        Fielding % (1996,1997)
        WAR Runs Fielding (1995)
        SLG (1994)
        HRs (1994)
        Triples (1994,1995)
        RBIs (1994)

        Led AL at SS :
        WAR (1993)
        SLG (1992)
        OPS+ (1992)
        Runs (1992)
        Hits (1992,1993)
        Doubles (1992)
        Triples (1993)
        HRs (1992)
        RBIs (1992,1993)
        Walks (1993)
        I like Fryman, but I found his case awkward to put together in large part because one of the key aspects of his value, his versatility, makes cobbling a case together more difficult than one position guys.
        Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
        Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
        A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

        Comment


        • #5
          dgarza argues for Willie Hernandez for the Tiger HOF.

          Originally posted by dgarza View Post
          Willie Hernandez
          Hernandez played for Detroit from 1984-1989.
          483.2 IPs
          135 ERA+
          120 Saves
          3x All Star (1984,1985,1986)
          1984 AL MVP
          1984 AL CY
          1984 AL Sporting News Pitcher of the Year

          2nd highest MLB Seasonal pWAR for relievers, 1984-1989 :
          Code:
                                                    
          Rk              Player WAR Year Age  Tm Lg
          1        Mark Eichhorn 6.4 1986  25 TOR AL
          2     Willie Hernandez 4.8 1984  29 DET AL
          3         Bruce Sutter 4.7 1984  31 STL NL
          4           Mark Davis 4.4 1989  28 SDP NL
          5            Tim Burke 4.2 1987  28 MON NL
          Led the 1984 Tigers to the World Series Championish by being the team pitcher with the highest WAR, despite the fact that he never started a game.
          In the 1984 WS, 3 games, 5.1 IPs, ERA 1.69, 2 Saves.

          Total Tiger Post-Season Stats:
          7 games, 9.2 IPs, 1.86 ERA, 3 Saves

          Tiger Team Records :
          2nd in WHIP (200 IP min.), Oppnt. OBP (200 IP min.) [limited historical records]
          4th in Oppnt. OPS+ (200 IP min.) [limited historical records]
          5th in Hits/9 (200 IP min.), Oppnt. AVG (200 IP min.) [limited historical records]
          6th in K/BB (200 IP min.)
          Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
          Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
          A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

          Comment


          • #6
            dgarza poses this case for the Tigers:

            Originally posted by dgarza View Post
            Harvey Kuenn
            Harvey Kuenn was a very popular player in the 1950s.
            Ever since his rookie year, he received some sort of recognition each season he was with the Tigers.
            Won AL ROY by a landslide (1953)
            Make 8 straight All Star squads in 7 years (1953-1959) [started 3, 1955-1957]
            Was an AL MVP candidate for 7 straight seasons (1953-1959) [MVP finishes :4,8,8,13,15,18,22]

            Stayed on the BBWAA for all of 15 years, always receiving double digit percentages [14.6% - 39.3%] (1977-1991)

            Tiger stats :
            .314/.360/.426
            112 OPS+
            Hits - 1372
            Doubles - 244

            Tiger team records :
            5th in AVG (1000 game min.)
            10th in AVG (500 game min.)
            11th in Doubles
            12th in OBP (1000 game min.)
            15th in Hits

            Probably can be considered the 2nd best AL SS in the 1950s :
            Code:
                                                         
            Rk              Player WAR/pos    G From   To
            1         Phil Rizzuto    21.5  824 1950 1956
            2         Harvey Kuenn    19.3 1049 1952 1959
            3     Chico Carrasquel    17.7 1325 1950 1959
            4          Eddie Joost    10.7  543 1950 1955
            5        Luis Aparicio    10.5  592 1956 1959
            Lead League :
            Singles (1953)
            Hits (1953,1954,1956,1959)
            Doubles (1955,1958,1959)
            AVG (1959)
            Putouts as SS (1953,1954)
            Assists as SS (1954)
            Putouts as CF (1958)
            Range Factor/Game as CF (1958)
            Fielding % as RF (1959)
            Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
            Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
            A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

            Comment


            • #7
              Denny McLain
              McLain is the last MLB pitcher to win 30 games in a season.

              117-62 = .654
              110 ERA+
              20.4 pWAR
              1.112 WHIP
              1150 Ks

              1968 AL Cy Young
              1968 ML Major League Player of the Year
              1968 AL MVP
              1968 AL TSN Pitcher of the Year
              1969 AL Cy Young
              1969 AL TSN Pitcher of the Year

              All-Star Games
              1966 (P)
              1968 *
              1969 *

              McLain is the Top 10 in WHIP and Winning % in the 1960s for all of baseball.

              Tiger team career records :
              1st in WHIP and Winning %

              WAR for Pitchers
              1969 AL 7.5 (1st)

              Wins
              1968 AL 31 (1st)
              1969 AL 24 (1st)

              Win-Loss %
              1968 AL .838 (1st)

              Innings Pitched
              1968 AL 336.0 (1st)
              1969 AL 325.0 (1st)

              Complete Games
              1968 AL 28 (1st)

              Shutouts
              1969 AL 9 (1st)

              Strikeouts / Base On Balls
              1968 AL 4.444 (1st)

              Comment


              • #8
                Frank Navin
                Initially, in 1902, Navin was the Tigers' bookkeeper, and he also served as secretary, treasurer, business manager, farm director, chief ticket seller, advertising manager, etc.

                Helped build the Tigers up in the early years, including signing Cobb. And helped build the team that won the 1935 World Series.

                Principal owner of the Detroit Tigers from 1908 to 1935.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Frank Lary
                  He was known as "The Yankee Killer" because of his rare ability to beat the Yankees on a fairly consistently basis.
                  28-13 = .683 vs. NYY

                  123-110 = .528
                  116 ERA+
                  26.7 pWAR
                  27.6 WAR

                  All-Star Games
                  1960-1 *
                  1960-2 *
                  1961-1 *

                  Gold Gloves
                  1961 AL (P)

                  Tiger Career Records:
                  10th in IPs, Shutouts, Wins

                  Led all AL pitchers in pWAR & Wins 1955-1961
                  Code:
                                                             
                  Rk         Player  WAR   W     IP From   To
                  1      Frank Lary 26.6 117 1799.2 1955 1961
                  2    Billy Pierce 24.9 110 1584.1 1955 1961
                  3     Jim Bunning 22.0  87 1361.0 1955 1961
                  4     Whitey Ford 22.0 115 1507.2 1955 1961
                  5      Early Wynn 21.6 108 1613.2 1955 1961

                  WAR for Pitchers
                  1958 AL 6.4 (1st)

                  Wins
                  1956 AL 21 (1st)

                  Innings Pitched
                  1956 AL 294.0 (1st)
                  1958 AL 260.3 (1st)
                  1960 AL 274.3 (1st)

                  Complete Games
                  1958 AL 19 (1st)
                  1960 AL 15 (1st)
                  1961 AL 22 (1st)

                  1951-52 in military

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Steve O'Neill
                    MGR for 6 seasons.
                    Never under .500
                    1945 WS championship

                    509-414 = .551

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Willie Horton
                      .276/.337/.472
                      262 HRs
                      127 OPS+
                      22.8 WAR

                      All-Star Games
                      1965 (LF)
                      1968 (LF)
                      1970 *
                      1973 *

                      Tiger HR list
                      Code:
                                                       
                      Rk           Player  HR From   To
                      1         Al Kaline 399 1953 1974
                      2         Norm Cash 373 1960 1974
                      3    Hank Greenberg 306 1930 1946
                      4     Willie Horton 262 1963 1977
                      5     Cecil Fielder 245 1990 1996
                      1963-1976 AL HR list
                      Code:
                                                              
                      Rk             Player  HR    G From   To
                      1    Harmon Killebrew 301 1440 1965 1975
                      2      Reggie Jackson 281 1365 1967 1976
                      3    Carl Yastrzemski 279 1811 1965 1976
                      4       Willie Horton 260 1474 1965 1976
                      5         Boog Powell 260 1590 1965 1976
                      1968 WS stats
                      Code:
                                                                                                    
                      Year    Tm Lg Series Opp Rslt G PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB   BA  OBP  SLG   OPS
                      1968   DET AL     WS STL    W 7 29 23 6 7  1  1  1   3  5 .304 .448 .565 1.013
                      Horton has served as a Special Assistant to Tigers President/CEO/General Manager Dave Dombrowski.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Mayo Smith
                        Managed the 1968 WS championship Tigers.
                        Known for his strategic move in the 1968 World Series of moving OFer Mickey Stanley to SS to get stronger bats in the lineup.

                        Named The Sporting News Major League Manager of the Year in 1968.

                        363-285 = .560

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Schoolboy Rowe
                          105-62 = .629
                          113 ERA+
                          21.5 pWAR
                          26.3 WAR

                          A good hitting pitcher too
                          .271/.330/.389
                          82 OPS+
                          4.8 WAR

                          All-Star Games
                          1935
                          1936 *

                          Tiger career records (500 IP)
                          4th in Winning %

                          Win-Loss %
                          1940 AL .842 (1st)

                          Shutouts
                          1935 AL 6 (1st)

                          Strikeouts / Base On Balls
                          1934 AL 1.840 (1st)
                          1935 AL 2.059 (1st)

                          Rowe pitched very well during the 1934 & 1935 World Series
                          Code:
                                                                                       
                          Year   Series Rslt Opp W L W-L%  ERA G GS GF CG   IP SO  WHIP
                          1934       WS    L STL 1 1 .500 2.95 3  2  0  2 21.1 12 0.891
                          1935       WS    W CHC 1 2 .333 2.57 3  2  1  2 21.0 14 0.952
                          Tigers coach in 1954 and 1955 and was a scout for the club until his death.
                          Last edited by dgarza; 06-13-2012, 07:59 AM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Ty Tyson
                            Radio broadcaster from 1927-1942, and then from 1951-1953.
                            He also did some TV broadcasting in the 1950s.

                            In 2000, the Detroit Sports Broadcasters Association established an annual Ty Tyson Award for Excellence in Sports Broadcasting.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Bill Donovan
                              140-96 = .593
                              1.192 WHIP
                              109 ERA+
                              32.0 pWAR
                              33.8 WAR

                              Win-Loss %
                              1907 AL .862 (1st)

                              Complete Games
                              1903 AL 34 (1st)

                              8th in Tiger Wins
                              3rd in Complete Games
                              6th in pWAR
                              Code:
                                                                             
                              Rk             Player  WAR   W     IP From   To
                              1       Hal Newhouser 54.5 200 2944.0 1939 1953
                              2       Tommy Bridges 48.1 194 2826.1 1930 1946
                              3       Mickey Lolich 42.8 207 3361.2 1963 1975
                              4         Dizzy Trout 40.9 161 2591.2 1939 1952
                              5         Jack Morris 34.4 198 3042.2 1977 1990
                              6        Bill Donovan 32.0 140 2137.1 1903 1918
                              7       George Mullin 31.1 209 3394.0 1902 1913
                              8         Hooks Dauss 30.6 223 3390.2 1912 1926
                              9    Justin Verlander 29.8 112 1409.0 2005 2012
                              10        John Hiller 29.6  87 1242.0 1965 1980

                              Comment

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