Pirates BBF Franchise HOF second chance round

[jalbright]

This will be one of two second chance round elections begun this week. What we'll do for the second chance election is a Yes/No vote requiring the greater of 6 or 75% of the votes to induct. The election will be limited to the listed nominees. The elections will only be open for a week--but there will be at least three or four days for discussion and new nominations. You can abstain from an entire ballot (player or contributor), but if you vote in that portion of the ballot, only the guys you expressly vote yes for get credit for a positive vote. The others in that section of the ballot will be considered to have gotten a "no" vote. There will be no limits on how many nominees you can vote for . I will also provide the nomination discussions for the nominees.

In this case, the election will not begin until Saturday, June 23 at 7 am EDT, and will end at 7 am EDT June 30. Nominations close 43 hours before the election begins, or June 21 at noon EDT. Ballots not cast within the stated election time frame will not count.

The Pirates have the following already inducted:

- Inducted Players (30): Babe Adams, Ginger Beaumont, Jake Beckley, Barry Bonds, John Candelaria, Max Carey, Fred Clarke, Roberto Clemente, Wilbur Cooper, Bob Elliott, Roy Face, Bob Friend, Brian Giiles, Jason Kendall, Ralph Kiner, Vern Law, Tommy Leach, Sam Leever, Bill Mazeroski, Al Oliver, Dave Parker, Tony Pena, Deacon Phillippe, Manny Sanguillen, Willie Stargell, Pie Traynor, Andy Van Slyke, Arky Vaughan, Honus Wagner, Paul Waner

- Inducted Contributors (5): Joe Brown, Barney Dreyfuss, Danny Murtaugh, Bob Prince, Chuck Tanner

The list of nominees at present is:

Players
Gene Alley
Jay Bell
Bobby Bonilla
Smoky Burgess
Doug Drabek
Dick Groat
Ed Morris
Rick Rhoden
Rip Sewell
Gus Suhr
Jesse Tannehill
Kent Tekulve
Frank Thomas
Bob Veale
Lloyd Waner

Contributors
Lanny Frattare
John Galbreath
Bill McKechnie
Denny McKnight
William Nimick
Jim Woods

[jalbright]

This was posted for Lanny Frattare as a contributor for the Pirates:

I had to give a nod to Frattare for 33 years in the booth.

[jalbright]

Paul Wendt posted this for Denny McKnight as a contributor for the Pirates:

Denny McKnight was the founding owner of the Allegheny club (Pirates) and president of the AA.

[jalbright]

Beady made this post on behalf of William Nimick as a contributor for the Pirates:

William Nimick was the head of a group of wealthy investors who settled the club's debts and took over control around the end of 1884 or the beginning of 1885, then bought out the Columbus club the following fall to make their team instantly respectable, in fact pretty good.

[jalbright]

Big Ron made this post about Lloyd Waner of the Pirates:

Lloyd Waner, while not deserving of Cooperstown, played long and well for the Pirates. He was almost strictly a singles hitter, but in 14 seasons with the Pirates plus fractions of 3 other seasons, he amassed 2317 hits while playing a fine centerfield.

NJRob65 posted this as a supplement about Lloyd Waner:

Waner did manage to accumulate a 24.8 WAR for the Pirates.

[jalbright]

I put together this argument for Kent Tekulve of the Pirates:

I realized I had voted for Roy Face but not Kent Tekulve. When I compare their Pirate careers, it's tough to choose which was better. I think I should support both.:

Let's look at Roy Face and Kent Tekulve of the Pirates with my main measures:

Tekulve
career WAR with franchise 18.8
best 3 seasons of WAR with franchise 9.7
best 5 consecutive WAR with franchise 11.4

Face
career WAR with franchise 16.9
best 3 seasons of WAR with franchise 8.7
best 5 consecutive WAR with franchise 10.3

This would tilt the balance toward Tekulve. However, we can also compare Tekulve and Face with the Pirates in terms of how they performed against the relievers who were their peers. Tekulve had five rankings in the top 18, a 4th in 1978, a 5th in 1983, a 7th in 1979, a 13th in 1981, and an 18th in 1982. When we compare Face to his peer relievers, he was better than Tekulve: 2d overall in 1956 and 1962, 3d overall in 1959, 7th in 1960, 8th in 1958, 14th in 1966 and 1967, and 18th in 1957. It's a close call between them, depending on what you give the most weight to.

[jalbright]

Here are a couple noms for the Pirates:

Ed Morris
34.1 pWAR (5th in franchise history)
2.81 ERA (15th)
129 wins (9th)
1.125 WHIP (6th)
8.363 H/9 (21st)
1.762 BB/9 (9th)
2104.0 IP (8th)
890 SO (8th)
240 GS (12th)
235 CG (3rd)
25 SHO (tied for 7th)
2.160 SO/BB (19th)
8719 BF (9th)
116 ERA+ (tied for 18th)

Jesse Tannehill
24.8 pWAR (tied for 10th in franchise history)
2.75 ERA (13th)
116 wins (tied for 12th)
0.667 W-L% (3rd)
1.196 WHIP (18th)
1.450 BB/9 (4th)
1508.0 IP (18th)
171 GS (25th)
149 CG (9th)
17 SHO (tied for 13th)
6182 BF (19th)
128 ERA+ (tied for 2nd)

[dgarza]

Dick Groat
1953-54 - in military

.290/.329/.370
20.0 WAR
1435 Hits

1960 NL MVP

1960 ML Lou Gehrig Memorial Award

All-Star Games
1959-1 *
1959-2 *
1960-1 *
1960-2 *
1962-1 (SS)
1962-2 (SS)

Defensive WAR
1960 NL 2.6 (1st)

Batting Average
1960 NL .325 (1st)

Putouts as SS
1955 NL 330 (1st)
1958 NL 307 (1st)
1959 NL 301 (1st)
1962 NL 314 (1st)

Assists as SS
1962 NL 521 (1st)

Total Zone Runs as SS
1960 NL 16 (1st)

Range Factor/9Inn as SS† s c a p y
1952 NL 5.50 (1st)

Range Factor/Game as SS
1955 NL 5.23 (1st)
1960 NL 5.00 (1st)
1962 NL 5.19 (1st)

[dgarza]

John Forbes
Forbes Field was named after him.

John Forbes was a British general in the French and Indian War. He is best known for leading the Forbes Expedition that captured the French outpost at Fort Duquesne and for naming the city of Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania after British Secretary of State William Pitt the Elder.

[dgarza]

Gene Alley
Alley was arguably the best defensive SS in the NL in the 60s & 70s:
WAR Runs Fielding

                                           
Rk             Player Rfield From   To    G
1         Dal Maxvill     62 1962 1974 1287
[B]2          Gene Alley     58 1963 1973 1195[/B]
3        Bill Russell     56 1969 1979 1415
4     Dave Concepcion     55 1970 1979 1349
5          Hal Lanier     50 1964 1971 1101

22.7 WAR

All-Star Games
1967 (SS)
1968

Gold Gloves
1966 NL (SS)
1967 NL (SS)

Defensive WAR
1965 NL 3.4 (1st)
1968 NL 3.6 (1st)

Putouts as SS
1967 NL 257 (1st)

Assists as SS
1967 NL 500 (1st)

Total Zone Runs as SS
1965 NL 17 (1st)
1968 NL 12 (1st)

Range Factor/9Inn as SS
1968 NL 5.45 (1st)

Range Factor/Game as SS
1967 NL 5.18 (1st)
1970 NL 5.40 (1st)

[jalbright]

John Forbes
Forbes Field was named after him.

John Forbes was a British general in the French and Indian War. He is best known for leading the Forbes Expedition that captured the French outpost at Fort Duquesne and for naming the city of Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania after British Secretary of State William Pitt the Elder.

Very tenuous connection to the team, IMHO. This one absolutely requires a second which indicates the seconder will indeed vote for the candidate--and I promise to question anyone who does so to verify his/her sincerity.

[dgarza]

Bobby Bonilla
Bonilla was star in the late 80s/early 90s.
From 1988-1991, he received MVP votes each year, totaling over 400 MVP points in that time.
Top MVP Years
1990 NL (2, 63%)
1991 NL (3, 56%)

.284/.357/.481
134 OPS+

All Star Games
1988 (3B)
1989 *
1990 *
1991 (DH)


Silver Sluggers
1988 NL (3B)
1990 NL (OF)
1991 NL (OF)

Doubles
1991 NL 44 (1st)

OPS+ of 140+ in 3 different seasons.

[BigRon]

Short on time but I'll nominate Gus Suhr, first baseman for the Pirates in the 30s. Suhr hit .278/.366/.427 for the Pirates in 1365 games in 10 seasons, with a 112 OPS+. He had 30 or more doubles 6 times, and 10 or more triple 8 times for the Pirates. Suhr played in 822 consecutive games for the Pirates, a NL record until broken by Stan Musial in the late 50s.

[dgarza]

John Galbreath
Franchise owner from 1945 to 1985, during which the Pirates won three world championships in 1960, 1971, and 1979.

He was the first owner to break the so-called "Million Dollar Mark" when he signed Dave Parker to a multi-year contract in 1979. He also signed Hall of Fame player Roberto Clemente.

[dgarza]

Bill McKechnie
409-293 = .583 - 2nd best record in Pirate history
1 Pennant and 1 World Series Title