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  • Reggie Jackson on hall of famers

    http://espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/stor...taints-numbers

    Jackson also let it be known who he thinks shouldn't be current members in the Hall.

    "I didn't see Kirby Puckett as a Hall of Famer," Jackson told SI. "I didn't see Gary Carter as a Hall of Famer. I didn't see Don Sutton as a Hall of Famer. I didn't see Phil Niekro as a Hall of Famer. As much as I like Jim Rice, I'm not so sure he's a Hall of Famer."

    Jackson didn't think Bert Blyleven should be voted in, either.

    "Blyleven wasn't even the dominant pitcher of his era; it was Jack Morris," Jackson said.

  • #2
    Its funny, I am kind of outraged that someone would not see Carter as a hall of famer. 9 20+ home run seasons for a catcher, including big seasons in '77, '80, '82, '84 and '85 at least. but the funny part is that I didn't see Carter, Blylevin, Neikro, or Sutton as hall of famers 10 years ago.

    Comment


    • #3
      I agree with Reggie about Puckett. I think it's a joke that he's in the Hall Of Fame - eye problems or not.

      That being said, Gary Carter is a no-brainer HOFer. He's top 10 all-time at his position. Can Reggie make the same claim?
      My top 10 players:

      1. Babe Ruth
      2. Barry Bonds
      3. Ty Cobb
      4. Ted Williams
      5. Willie Mays
      6. Alex Rodriguez
      7. Hank Aaron
      8. Honus Wagner
      9. Lou Gehrig
      10. Mickey Mantle

      Comment


      • #4
        I don't know how much they interacted, but a lot of players didn't respond well to Carter...thought he was a phony, although it turned out that Gary was really a nice, optimistic, and truly religious person. Maybe that colored Reggie's view of him, as Carter is clearly one of the best catchers of all time.

        I want Rice to challenge Reggie to a cage match now. Even though Jim is a few years younger, it'd probably still be a good fight...they're both still in great shape.
        "If I drink whiskey, I'll never get worms!" - Hack Wilson

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by GiambiJuice View Post
          I agree with Reggie about Puckett. I think it's a joke that he's in the Hall Of Fame - eye problems or not.

          That being said, Gary Carter is a no-brainer HOFer. He's top 10 all-time at his position. Can Reggie make the same claim?
          Why is it a joke? It's obvious that Puckett got " extra credit" because of how his career ended. I'm sure many of the voters just assumed that Puckett would have easily reached 3,000 hits sans the eye injury. Plus, Kirby had a boatload of extras. Kirby played just 12 years:

          10 time All-Star
          6 Gold Gloves
          6 Silver Sluggers
          3rd in RoY voting
          5 200-hit seasons plus a 199 hit season
          .318 career BA

          Add to that the two improbable World Series titles that Puckett helped win and you got a HoFer in the eyes of the voters. Granted Puckett wasn't as good ans the voters thought but I don't think Puckett's induction was a joke.
          Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules View Post
            Why is it a joke? It's obvious that Puckett got " extra credit" because of how his career ended. I'm sure many of the voters just assumed that Puckett would have easily reached 3,000 hits sans the eye injury. Plus, Kirby had a boatload of extras. Kirby played just 12 years:

            10 time All-Star
            6 Gold Gloves
            6 Silver Sluggers
            3rd in RoY voting
            5 200-hit seasons plus a 199 hit season
            .318 career BA

            Add to that the two improbable World Series titles that Puckett helped win and you got a HoFer in the eyes of the voters. Granted Puckett wasn't as good ans the voters thought but I don't think Puckett's induction was a joke.

            I don't believe in electing players based on "could've, would've, should've". He was a good batting average guy but was never a dominant player. If you want to get in with a short career, you better have a dominant peak like Koufax or Kiner.

            Of all players with a .318 BA, Puckett is dead last in OBP. He couldn't take a walk, and his batting average obviously would have decreased with a normal decline. Kirby got on base less often in his career than his teammate, Kent Hrbek
            Last edited by GiambiJuice; 07-06-2012, 11:23 AM.
            My top 10 players:

            1. Babe Ruth
            2. Barry Bonds
            3. Ty Cobb
            4. Ted Williams
            5. Willie Mays
            6. Alex Rodriguez
            7. Hank Aaron
            8. Honus Wagner
            9. Lou Gehrig
            10. Mickey Mantle

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by brett View Post
              Its funny, I am kind of outraged that someone would not see Carter as a hall of famer. 9 20+ home run seasons for a catcher, including big seasons in '77, '80, '82, '84 and '85 at least. but the funny part is that I didn't see Carter, Blylevin, Neikro, or Sutton as hall of famers 10 years ago.
              Here'e the thing.

              The fact that someone had great athletic talent and was a great baseball player (Reggie) in no way qualifies him to analyze the hall of fame worthiness of other players. Playing baseball, and analyzing the value of players require an entirely different set of skills.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by GiambiJuice View Post
                I don't believe in electing players based on "could've, would've, should've". He was a good batting average guy but was never a dominant player. If you want to get in with a short career, you better have a dominant peak like Koufax or Kiner.

                Of all players with a .318 BA, Puckett is dead last in OBP. He couldn't take a walk, and his batting average obviously would have decreased with a normal decline. Kirby got on base less often in his career than his teammate, Kent Hrbek
                I'm sure the voters viewed Puckett as a "dominant" player as most HoF voters are not sabermetic savvy.
                Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules View Post
                  I'm sure the voters viewed Puckett as a "dominant" player as most HoF voters are not sabermetic savvy.

                  I think that a 5 time gold glove winning centerfielder with a .318 lifetime average and 2300 hits in 12 years with 5 20 home run seasons was considered dominant at that time. He had 7 top 7 MVP finishes, and 3 top 3 finishes.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Reggie should look at himself. How dominant was he really? He is in the HOF due to his fame because he played forever and compiled impressive numbers, but after age 38 he was a dead ringer for Fred Mcgriff..who isn't in the HOF.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by brett View Post
                      I think that a 5 time gold glove winning centerfielder with a .318 lifetime average and 2300 hits in 12 years with 5 20 home run seasons was considered dominant at that time. He had 7 top 7 MVP finishes, and 3 top 3 finishes.
                      Six Gold Gloves actually, plus five 200-hit seasons and a 199 hit season. Also, Puckett's 1991 World Series performance was probably still fresh in people's minds.
                      Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by brett View Post
                        http://espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/stor...taints-numbers
                        Jackson also let it be known who he thinks shouldn't be current members in the Hall.
                        "I didn't see Kirby Puckett as a Hall of Famer," Jackson told SI. "I didn't see Gary Carter as a Hall of Famer. I didn't see Don Sutton as a Hall of Famer. I didn't see Phil Niekro as a Hall of Famer. As much as I like Jim Rice, I'm not so sure he's a Hall of Famer."
                        Jackson didn't think Bert Blyleven should be voted in, either.
                        "Blyleven wasn't even the dominant pitcher of his era; it was Jack Morris," Jackson said.
                        I totally agree with Reggie about all except Puckett. Rice is probably OK. The problem is that Reggie isn’t exactly Ted Williams. I think that only high echelon HOFers should comment on anyone’s worthiness.

                        Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules View Post
                        Why is it a joke? It's obvious that Puckett got " extra credit" because of how his career ended. I'm sure many of the voters just assumed that Puckett would have easily reached 3,000 hits sans the eye injury. Plus, Kirby had a boatload of extras. Kirby played just 12 years:
                        10 time All-Star
                        6 Gold Gloves
                        6 Silver Sluggers
                        3rd in RoY voting
                        5 200-hit seasons plus a 199 hit season
                        .318 career BA
                        Add to that the two improbable World Series titles that Puckett helped win and you got a HoFer in the eyes of the voters. Granted Puckett wasn't as good ans the voters thought but I don't think Puckett's induction was a joke.
                        Post season counts for a lot (see Reggie himself). Puckett was a fabulous player and deserves to be in on his career as it stands

                        Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules View Post
                        I'm sure the voters viewed Puckett as a "dominant" player as most HoF voters are not sabermetic savvy.
                        Whew!! That’s a good thing, IMO. Who wants Darrell Evans in the HOF. He got on base more than Puckett

                        And in Reggies era, greenies were popped like m&ms
                        This week's Giant

                        #5 in games played as a Giant with 1721 , Bill Terry

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by willshad View Post
                          Reggie should look at himself. How dominant was he really? He is in the HOF due to his fame because he played forever and compiled impressive numbers, but after age 38 he was a dead ringer for Fred Mcgriff..who isn't in the HOF.
                          --Reggie played in one of the lowest offensive eras in pitchers parks (his best years in the AL's most extreme pitchers park). In context he was most definately a dominant player. His analysis here is very flawed, but there is zero corelation between being a great ballplayer and a great - or even good - analyst.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Also, as it has been pointed out in the other Reggie threads, how often did Reggie see Phil Niekro pitch? Reggie didn't face Niekro until Niekro was 45 years old and still only went 1 for 17 lifetime against Niekro.
                            Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules View Post
                              Also, as it has been pointed out in the other Reggie threads, how often did Reggie see Phil Niekro pitch? Reggie didn't face Niekro until Niekro was 45 years old and still only went 1 for 17 lifetime against Niekro.
                              Maybe there's a prejudice against knuckleballers?
                              46 wins to match last year's total

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