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BBF Reliever HoF: Qualifier

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  • BBF Reliever HoF: Qualifier

    I've never conducted a BBF HoF before, and I've hardly participated in the existing ones. Any constructive feedback is much appreciated because this site is the most collectively knowledgeable baseball meeting in the universe of this third dimension.

    I have a great interest in relief pitching, from the pioneers to the groundbreakers to the specialists of today. I hope to create a Hall of Fame composed exclusively of relievers.

    Who is a reliever? Since 1950, it's anyone who's either appeared in 70% of their games as a reliever or finished 400 games. Before 1950, it's anyone who's finished at least 150 games. Anyone who crosses over the two eras qualifies if they finished at least 200 games.

    The rest is up to you. This first round is dedicated to seeing who qualifies. Subsequent rounds will feature the first alphabetical twenty relievers to decide their enshrinement. For now, I ask you to simply list anyone you believe should be at least considered for enshrinement. Use the mentioned guidelines. For relievers who were also starters, you don't necessarily need to consider their starting career, but give some thought to whether or not they were successful and/or how useful they were as a spot starter.

    List as many as you want. Players who receive 75% of nominations will qualify for election rounds. Unfortunately, I won't have computer access for the next few hours. I will check back ASAP to see how things are going, the feedback, amount of participants to that point, etc.
    "Allen Sutton Sothoron pitched his initials off today."--1920s article

  • #2
    For the pre-Hoyt Wilhelm era, Mordecai Brown and Dolf Luque are the first two that come to mind. There's also Jack Quinn, Hilton Smith.

    Comment


    • #3
      Firpo Marberry, Ace Adams, Joe Page would be candidates. Since Mordecai Brown is nominted you can add Ellis Kinder. It's up to others, but how do you want to define reliever for pre-Wilhelm. I have read Grove would relieve. So perhaps it was not uncommon for stud starters to do so without really being relievers. But on the other hand maybe that is the concept of a late inning guy in its infancy and the role developed and specialized with time.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by PVNICK View Post
        Firpo Marberry, Ace Adams, Joe Page would be candidates. Since Mordecai Brown is nominted you can add Ellis Kinder. It's up to others, but how do you want to define reliever for pre-Wilhelm. I have read Grove would relieve. So perhaps it was not uncommon for stud starters to do so without really being relievers. But on the other hand maybe that is the concept of a late inning guy in its infancy and the role developed and specialized with time.
        I think Hilton Smith is the prototype for the modern long reliever. He frequently would come into games that Paige started to finish them.

        Comment


        • #5
          While Grove certainly did appear in quite a number of games as a relief pitcher, including guys like him in this project muddies the waters.

          I'll help, but let's put those pitchers who really were starts aside.
          Your Second Base Coach
          Garvey, Lopes, Russell, and Cey started 833 times and the Dodgers went 498-335, for a .598 winning percentage. That’s equal to a team going 97-65 over a season. On those occasions when at least one of them missed his start, the Dodgers were 306-267-1, which is a .534 clip. That works out to a team going 87-75. So having all four of them added 10 wins to the Dodgers per year.
          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5hCIvMule0

          Comment


          • #6
            Eddie Rommel, Johnny Murphy, Hugh Casey
            Last edited by dgarza; 08-10-2012, 01:32 PM.

            Comment


            • #7
              Most saves, debut <1950:
              Code:
              Rk           Player  SV  GF  GS ERA+     IP From   To   G
              1     Johnny Murphy 107 293  40  117 1045.0 1932 1947 415
              2      Ellis Kinder 102 255 122  125 1479.2 1946 1957 484
              3    Firpo Marberry 101 272 186  116 2067.1 1923 1936 551
              4          Joe Page  76 182  45  106  790.0 1944 1954 285
              5     Jim Konstanty  74 266  36  112  945.2 1944 1956 433
              6         Al Benton  66 171 167  115 1688.1 1934 1952 455
              7       Clint Brown  64 249 130  109 1485.2 1928 1942 434
              8        Joe Heving  63 232  40  108 1038.2 1930 1945 430
              9      Gerry Staley  61 246 186  109 1981.2 1947 1961 640
              10        Al Brazle  60 178 117  120 1376.2 1943 1954 441
              11     Marv Grissom  58 176  52  116  810.0 1946 1959 356
              12       Jack Quinn  57 217 443  114 3920.1 1909 1933 756
              13      Tom Ferrick  56 210   7  118  674.0 1941 1952 323
              14       Hugh Casey  55 189  56  112  939.2 1935 1949 343
              15      Lefty Grove  55 123 457  148 3940.2 1925 1941 616
              16       Waite Hoyt  52 171 425  112 3762.1 1918 1938 674
              17      Johnny Sain  51 124 245  107 2125.2 1942 1955 412
              18   Allie Reynolds  49  97 309  109 2492.1 1942 1954 434
              19        Ace Adams  49 218   7  104  552.2 1941 1946 302
              20      Wilcy Moore  49 160  32  110  691.0 1927 1933 261
              21   Mordecai Brown  49 138 332  139 3172.1 1903 1916 481
              Si quaeris peninsulam amoenam, circumspice.

              Comprehensive Reform for the Veterans Committee -- Fixing the Hall continued.

              Comment


              • #8
                I was hoping people would list 50+ names.
                "Allen Sutton Sothoron pitched his initials off today."--1920s article

                Comment


                • #9
                  Most saves, debut 1949-59, ERA+ 100+, relief G 60%+:
                  Code:
                  Rk           Player  SV ERA+ OPS+  GF  GS     IP From   To    G   W   L
                  1      Hoyt Wilhelm 227  147   67 651  52 2254.1 1952 1972 1070 143 122
                  2          Roy Face 193  109   84 574  27 1375.0 1953 1969  848 104  95
                  3    Lindy McDaniel 172  110   90 577  74 2139.1 1955 1975  987 141 119
                  4        Stu Miller 154  115   82 405  93 1693.1 1952 1968  704 105 103
                  5       Don McMahon 153  120   84 506   2 1310.2 1957 1974  874  90  68
                  6     Ted Abernathy 148  107   93 416  34 1148.1 1955 1972  681  63  69
                  7    Al Worthington 110  110   89 314  69 1246.2 1953 1969  602  75  82
                  8         Ron Kline 108  102  100 338 203 2078.0 1952 1970  736 114 144
                  9       Clem Labine  96  112   86 288  38 1079.2 1950 1962  513  77  56
                  10       Bill Henry  90  120   88 252  44  913.0 1952 1969  527  46  50
                  11     Turk Farrell  83  104  100 301 134 1704.2 1956 1969  590 106 111
                  12     Larry Sherry  82  102  103 245  16  799.1 1958 1968  416  53  44
                  13     Eddie Fisher  81  101   94 344  63 1538.2 1959 1973  690  85  70
                  14        Dick Hall  68  111   83 237  74 1259.2 1955 1971  495  93  75
                  15      Jim Brosnan  67  112   91 201  47  831.1 1954 1963  385  55  47
                  16       Tom Morgan  64  107  100 204  61 1023.1 1951 1963  443  67  47
                  17       Don Elston  63  106   99 241  15  755.2 1953 1964  450  49  54
                  18       Ed Roebuck  62  115  101 206   1  791.0 1955 1966  460  52  31
                  19   Hal Woodeshick  61  103   97 197  62  847.1 1956 1967  427  44  62
                  20     Ray Narleski  58  107   88 132  52  702.0 1954 1959  266  43  33
                  21    Moe Drabowsky  55  101   97 220 154 1641.0 1956 1972  589  88 105
                  22   Mike Fornieles  55  100   96 195  76 1156.2 1952 1963  432  63  64
                  23       Bob Miller  51  106   97 290  99 1551.1 1957 1974  694  69  81
                  24        Don Mossi  50  115   86 147 165 1548.0 1954 1965  460 101  80
                  25     Bobby Shantz  48  119   80 192 171 1935.2 1949 1964  537 119  99
                  Others with high ERA+:
                  Code:
                  Rk            Player ERA+ OPS+ SV  GF  GS     IP From   To   G  W  L
                  1          Leo Kiely  126   96 29  99  39  523.0 1951 1960 209 26 27
                  2    Sandy Consuegra  119   86 26  91  71  809.1 1950 1957 248 51 32
                  3       Hank Aguirre  117   85 33 124 149 1375.1 1955 1970 447 75 72
                  4    George Zuverink  106  105 40 139  31  642.1 1951 1959 265 32 36
                  5         Tom Gorman  105   94 42 132  33  689.1 1952 1959 289 36 36
                  6           Bob Grim  105   94 37 120  60  759.2 1954 1962 268 61 41
                  Last edited by Freakshow; 08-11-2012, 07:14 PM.
                  Si quaeris peninsulam amoenam, circumspice.

                  Comprehensive Reform for the Veterans Committee -- Fixing the Hall continued.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Here's about 60 names. I know there are some pre-1950 relievers I am missing....

                    Mariano Rivera
                    Dennis Eckersley
                    Hoyt Wilhelm
                    Trevor Hoffman
                    Lee Smith
                    Goose Gossage
                    Rollie Fingers
                    Billy Wagner
                    John Franco
                    Eddie Rommel
                    Firpo Marberry
                    Bruce Sutter
                    Dan Quisenberry
                    Tom Gordon
                    Tom Henke
                    Sparky Lyle
                    Jeff Reardon
                    Joe Nathan
                    John Wetteland
                    Lindy McDaniel
                    Kent Tekulve
                    Roberto Hernandez
                    Doug Jones
                    Rick Aguilera
                    Troy Percival
                    Mike Marshall
                    Randy Myers
                    Jeff Montgomery
                    Francisco Rodriguez
                    Robb Nen
                    Dave Righetti
                    Roy Face
                    Stu Miller
                    Jesse Orosco
                    Jose Mendez
                    Ellis Kinder
                    Tug McGraw
                    Armando Benitez
                    Gene Garber
                    Bob Stanley
                    John Hiller
                    Clay Carroll
                    Ron Perranoski
                    Don McMahon
                    Greg Swindell
                    Bob Wickman
                    Syl Johnson
                    Mike Jackson
                    Francisco Cordero
                    Jeff Fassero
                    Keith Foulke
                    Mike Timlin
                    Ron Kline
                    Jonathan Papelbon
                    Willie Hernandez
                    Rod Beck
                    Rick Honeycutt
                    Dan Plesac
                    Jason Isringhausen
                    Ugueth Urbina
                    Steve Bedrosian
                    Johnny Murphy

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Most saves, debut 1960-70, relief G 60%+:
                      Code:
                      Rk           Player  SV ERA+ OPS+  GF  GS     IP From   To   G   W   L
                      1    Rollie Fingers 341  120   84 709  37 1701.1 1968 1985 944 114 118
                      2       Sparky Lyle 238  128   87 634   0 1390.1 1967 1982 899  99  76
                      3       Gene Garber 218  117   88 609   9 1510.0 1969 1988 931  96 113
                      4     Mike Marshall 188  118   89 549  24 1386.2 1967 1981 723  97 112
                      5        Tug McGraw 180  117   88 541  39 1514.2 1965 1984 824  96  92
                      6    Ron Perranoski 179  124   90 458   1 1174.2 1961 1973 737  79  74
                      7       Dave Giusti 145   95   98 380 133 1716.2 1962 1977 668 100  93
                      8    Darold Knowles 143  113  101 417   8 1092.0 1965 1980 765  66  74
                      9      Clay Carroll 143  121   90 373  28 1353.1 1964 1978 731  96  73
                      10       Jim Brewer 132  111   91 351  35 1040.1 1960 1976 584  69  65
                      11     Dave LaRoche 126  106   96 381  15 1049.1 1970 1983 647  65  58
                      12      John Hiller 125  134   83 363  43 1242.0 1965 1980 545  87  76
                      13        Jack Aker 123  106  101 321   0  746.0 1964 1974 495  47  45
                      14      Dick Radatz 122  123   83 297   0  693.2 1962 1969 381  52  43
                      15      Frank Linzy 111  124   89 342   2  817.1 1963 1974 516  62  57
                      16    Fred Gladding 109  114   94 278   1  601.0 1961 1973 450  48  34
                      17    Wayne Granger 108  114   98 270   0  638.2 1968 1976 451  35  35
                      18         Ron Reed 103  108   89 300 236 2477.2 1966 1984 751 146 140
                      19       John Wyatt 103  109   99 291   9  687.1 1961 1969 435  42  44
                      20    Tom Burgmeier 102  119   95 370   3 1258.2 1968 1984 745  79  55
                      21      Joe Hoerner  99  121   95 268   0  563.0 1963 1977 493  39  34
                      22      Al Hrabosky  97  122   85 307   1  722.0 1970 1982 545  64  35
                      23       Bob Locker  95  122   84 288   0  879.0 1965 1975 576  57  39
                      24       Phil Regan  92   98  104 289 105 1372.2 1960 1972 551  96  81
                      25      Ken Sanders  86  119   93 285   1  656.2 1964 1976 408  29  45
                      26     Cecil Upshaw  86  113   95 229   0  563.0 1966 1975 348  34  36
                      27     Pedro Borbon  80  101  105 278   4 1026.2 1969 1980 593  69  39
                      28       Eddie Watt  80  117   83 240  13  659.2 1966 1975 411  38  36
                      Others with high ERA+:
                      Code:
                      Rk           Player ERA+ OPS+ SV  GF GS     IP From   To   G  W  L
                      1     Steve Mingori  127   90 42 173  2  584.2 1970 1979 385 18 33
                      2      Chuck Taylor  123   91 31 133 21  607.0 1969 1976 305 28 20
                      3    Steve Hamilton  115   85 42 181 17  663.0 1961 1972 421 40 31
                      4         Al McBean  111   96 63 186 76 1072.1 1961 1970 409 67 50
                      5          Tom Hall  108   87 32 131 63  852.2 1968 1977 358 52 33
                      Si quaeris peninsulam amoenam, circumspice.

                      Comprehensive Reform for the Veterans Committee -- Fixing the Hall continued.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Most saves, debut 1971-81, relief G 66%+:
                        Code:
                        Rk             Player  SV ERA+ OPS+  GF  GS     IP From   To    G   W   L
                        1           Lee Smith 478  132   80 802   6 1289.1 1980 1997 1022  71  92
                        2    Dennis Eckersley 390  116   84 577 361 3285.2 1975 1998 1071 197 171
                        3        Jeff Reardon 367  122   86 695   0 1132.1 1979 1994  880  73  77
                        4        Rich Gossage 310  126   80 681  37 1809.1 1972 1994 1002 124 107
                        5        Bruce Sutter 300  136   75 512   0 1042.0 1976 1988  661  68  71
                        6       Dave Righetti 252  114   86 474  89 1403.2 1979 1995  718  82  79
                        7     Dan Quisenberry 244  146   80 553   0 1043.1 1979 1990  674  56  46
                        8          Dave Smith 216  130   83 432   1  809.1 1980 1992  609  53  53
                        9     Steve Bedrosian 184  115   88 439  46 1191.0 1981 1995  732  76  79
                        10       Kent Tekulve 184  132   80 638   0 1436.2 1974 1989 1050  94  90
                        11         Jay Howell 155  114   86 360  21  844.2 1980 1994  568  58  53
                        12        Greg Minton 150  118   92 415   7 1130.2 1975 1990  710  59  65
                        13   Willie Hernandez 147  119   87 419  11 1044.2 1977 1989  744  70  63
                        14       Jesse Orosco 144  126   79 501   4 1295.1 1979 2003 1252  87  80
                        15       Gary Lavelle 136  126   87 399   3 1085.0 1974 1987  745  80  77
                        16        Bob Stanley 132  118   92 376  85 1707.0 1977 1989  637 115  97
                        17          Ron Davis 130  101  101 340   0  746.2 1978 1988  481  47  53
                        18      Terry Forster 127  116   88 318  39 1105.2 1971 1986  614  54  65
                        19      Bill Campbell 126  111   89 455   9 1229.1 1973 1987  700  83  68
                        20     Tippy Martinez 115  112   91 320   2  834.0 1974 1988  546  55  42
                        21       Bill Caudill 106  110   93 293  24  667.0 1979 1987  445  35  52
                        22     Tom Niedenfuer  97  112   95 276   0  653.0 1981 1990  484  36  46
                        23         Mark Davis  96   89  107 265  85 1145.0 1980 1997  624  51  84
                        24      Randy Moffitt  96  103   98 306   1  781.1 1972 1983  534  43  52
                        25      Aurelio Lopez  93  112   89 281   9  910.0 1974 1987  459  62  36
                        26           Tom Hume  92   98  104 267  55 1086.0 1977 1987  543  57  71
                        27         Steve Howe  91  130   76 257   0  606.0 1980 1996  497  47  41
                        Others with high ERA+:
                        Code:
                        Rk           Player ERA+ SV OPS+  GF GS     IP From   To   G  W  L
                        1        Al Holland  123 78   84 216 11  646.0 1977 1987 384 34 30
                        2    Larry Andersen  121 49   85 267  1  995.1 1975 1994 699 40 39
                        3       Terry Leach  120 10   89 138 21  700.0 1981 1993 376 38 27
                        4        Gary Lucas  119 63   90 206 18  669.0 1980 1987 409 29 44
                        5    Alejandro Pena  119 74   83 232 72 1057.2 1981 1996 503 56 52
                        6       Joe Sambito  116 84   89 274  5  629.0 1976 1987 461 37 38
                        7          Jim Kern  116 88   86 254 14  793.1 1974 1986 416 53 57
                        8         Rick Camp  115 57   97 170 65  942.1 1976 1985 414 56 49
                        Si quaeris peninsulam amoenam, circumspice.

                        Comprehensive Reform for the Veterans Committee -- Fixing the Hall continued.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Most saves, debut 1982-89, relief G 70%+:
                          Code:
                          Rk            Player  SV ERA+ OPS+  GF  GS     IP From   To    G   W   L
                          1        John Franco 424  138   84 774   0 1245.2 1984 2005 1119  90  87
                          2        Randy Myers 347  123   84 548  12  884.2 1985 1998  728  44  63
                          3     John Wetteland 330  148   68 523  17  765.0 1989 2000  618  48  45
                          4          Jose Mesa 321  100   99 633  95 1548.2 1987 2007 1022  80 109
                          5      Rick Aguilera 318  118   88 557  89 1291.1 1985 2000  732  86  81
                          6          Tom Henke 311  157   63 548   0  789.2 1982 1995  642  41  42
                          7    Jeff Montgomery 304  135   79 549   1  868.2 1987 1999  700  46  52
                          8         Doug Jones 303  129   84 640   4 1128.1 1982 2000  846  69  79
                          9       Todd Worrell 256  122   87 456   0  693.2 1985 1997  617  50  52
                          10       Gregg Olson 217  123   82 447   0  672.0 1988 2001  622  40  39
                          11     Bobby Thigpen 201  119   93 356   0  568.2 1986 1994  448  31  36
                          12     Mike Henneman 193  131   82 432   0  732.2 1987 1996  561  57  42
                          13    Mitch Williams 192  111   95 419   3  691.1 1986 1997  619  45  58
                          14      Jeff Russell 186  112   91 340  79 1099.2 1983 1996  589  56  73
                          15      Bryan Harvey 177  162   56 278   0  387.0 1987 1995  322  17  25
                          16     Jeff Brantley 172  115   94 379  18  859.1 1988 2001  615  43  46
                          17    Roger McDowell 159  115   93 430   2 1050.0 1985 1996  723  70  70
                          18        Tom Gordon 158  113   81 347 203 2108.0 1988 2009  890 138 126
                          19        Dan Plesac 158  117   84 422  14 1072.0 1986 2003 1064  65  71
                          20   Michael Jackson 142  126   79 422   7 1188.1 1986 2004 1005  62  67
                          21        Steve Farr 132  127   89 313  28  824.1 1984 1994  509  48  45
                          22        Duane Ward 121  124   72 272   2  666.2 1986 1995  462  32  37
                          23         Tim Burke 102  136   85 262   2  699.1 1985 1992  498  49  33
                          24    Craig Lefferts 101  109   99 286  45 1145.2 1983 1994  696  58  72
                          25      Mike Fetters 100  116   94 292   6  716.2 1989 2004  620  31  41
                          Others with high ERA+:
                          Code:
                          Rk             Player ERA+ SV OPS+  GF GS     IP From   To    G  W  L
                          1       Mark Eichhorn  142 32   79 226  7  885.2 1982 1996  563 48 43
                          2           Jim Corsi  133  7   83 115  1  481.1 1988 1999  368 22 24
                          3          Rob Dibble  129 89   67 204  0  477.0 1988 1995  385 27 25
                          4    Paul Assenmacher  118 56   88 275  1  855.2 1986 1999  884 61 44
                          5        Mike Stanton  112 84   87 363  1 1114.0 1989 2007 1178 68 63
                          6       Norm Charlton  112 97   86 280 37  899.1 1988 2001  605 51 54
                          Si quaeris peninsulam amoenam, circumspice.

                          Comprehensive Reform for the Veterans Committee -- Fixing the Hall continued.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Most saves, ERA+ >100, debut 1990-97, relief G 70%+:
                            Code:
                            Rk               Player  SV ERA+ OPS+  GF GS     IP From   To    G  W  L
                            1        Mariano Rivera 608  206   45 892 10 1219.2 1995 2012 1051 76 58
                            2        Trevor Hoffman 601  141   67 856  0 1089.1 1993 2010 1035 61 75
                            3          Billy Wagner 422  187   49 703  0  903.0 1995 2010  853 47 40
                            4         Troy Percival 358  146   58 546  1  708.2 1995 2009  703 35 43
                            5     Roberto Hernandez 326  131   82 667  3 1071.1 1991 2007 1010 67 71
                            6            Todd Jones 319  111   91 619  1 1072.0 1993 2008  982 58 63
                            7              Robb Nen 314  139   72 549  4  715.0 1993 2002  643 45 42
                            8    Jason Isringhausen 300  116   88 496 52  999.1 1995 2012  714 51 55
                            9       Armando Benitez 289  140   69 527  0  779.0 1994 2008  762 40 47
                            10             Rod Beck 286  124   85 519  0  768.0 1991 2004  704 38 45
                            11          Bob Wickman 267  126   87 511 28 1059.0 1992 2007  835 63 61
                            12        Ugueth Urbina 237  128   74 408 21  697.1 1995 2005  583 44 49
                            13            Jeff Shaw 203  119   89 384 19  848.0 1990 2001  633 34 54
                            14         Keith Foulke 191  140   68 406  8  786.2 1997 2008  619 41 37
                            15       Eddie Guardado 187  109   93 401 25  944.2 1993 2009  908 46 61
                            16         Danny Graves 182  109  102 360 30  808.1 1996 2006  518 43 44
                            17          Mike Timlin 141  125   82 467  4 1204.1 1991 2008 1058 75 73
                            18         Joe Borowski 131  104   94 268  1  454.1 1995 2008  423 22 34
                            19    Antonio Alfonseca 129  104  104 301  0  613.0 1997 2007  592 35 37
                            20            Mel Rojas 126  107   88 282  0  667.0 1990 1999  525 34 31
                            21         Mark Wohlers 119  108   79 293  0  553.1 1991 2002  533 39 29
                            22      Ricky Bottalico 116  110   93 301  0  628.2 1994 2005  562 33 42
                            23         Billy Taylor 100  110   86 194  0  324.2 1994 2001  317 16 28
                            Others with high ERA+:
                            Code:
                            Rk                Player ERA+ SV OPS+  GF GS    IP From   To   G  W  L
                            1            Jeff Nelson  133 33   76 237  0 784.2 1992 2006 798 48 45
                            2             Steve Reed  132 18   83 197  0 870.2 1992 2005 833 49 44
                            3             Dave Veres  131 95   88 284  0 694.0 1994 2003 605 36 35
                            4         Greg McMichael  131 53   81 164  0 523.1 1993 2000 453 31 29
                            5            Steve Kline  125 39   89 231  1 682.1 1997 2007 796 34 39
                            6    Shigetoshi Hasegawa  125 33   89 191  8 720.1 1997 2005 517 45 43
                            7              Jim Mecir  122 12   79 126  0 527.0 1995 2005 474 29 35
                            Last edited by Freakshow; 08-13-2012, 05:24 AM.
                            Si quaeris peninsulam amoenam, circumspice.

                            Comprehensive Reform for the Veterans Committee -- Fixing the Hall continued.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Tyrus4189Cobb View Post
                              I was hoping people would list 50+ names.
                              Freakshow just gave you a cool 200. I was going to reply but there's no major league player I could add that would remotely qualify.
                              http://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploa...-showalter.gif

                              Comment

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