Weak HOFers

[538280]

Weak HOFers

What are some Hall of Famers who shouldn't be in the Hall of Fame? Here is my list, in no particular order

Freddie Lindstrom
George Kell
Kirby Puckett
Rick Ferrell
George Kelly
Catfish Hunter
Gary Carter
George Kelly

[Bleacherbee]

Maz and Rizzuto

[leecemark]

Mr October, your list could be much longer, but you've still managed to to put a couple names I can't agree with on it. Gary Carter is one of the top 10 catchers in MLB history. That is a surefire Hall of Famer. Puckett is arguably the same in CF and was The Man for two championship teams. Don't you think its a little harsh to kick George Kelly out twice?

[The Dude]

I'd rather have boyer and Hack in before taking Kell out.

[Bleacherbee]

Dave Bancroft

[Captain Cold Nose]

Travis Jackson
Tommy McCarthy
Roger Bresnahan

[leecemark]

Chick Hafey, Lloyd Waner and Ross Youngs

[ElHalo]

Going position by position:

C: Rick Ferrell, Gary Carter
1B: George Kelly, Tony Perez
2B: Johnny Evers, Billy Herman
SS: Bobby Wallace, Phil Rizzuto
3B: Freddie Lindstrom, George Kell
OF: Tommy McCarthy, Jimmy Collins, Max Carey, Harry Hooper, Lou Brock, Lloyd Waner

I think it's hard to make a case for any of those guys. Yes, Mark, that includes Gary Carter (although it pains me to say it for some of those guys, because I hate to see a guy with a .300 BA kicked out of the Hall).

[Honus Wagner Rules]

Going position by position:

C: Rick Ferrell, Gary Carter
1B: George Kelly, Tony Perez
2B: Johnny Evers, Billy Herman
SS: Bobby Wallace, Phil Rizzuto
3B: Freddie Lindstrom, George Kell
OF: Tommy McCarthy, Jimmy Collins, Max Carey, Harry Hooper, Lou Brock, Lloyd Waner

I think it's hard to make a case for any of those guys. Yes, Mark, that includes Gary Carter (although it pains me to say it for some of those guys, because I hate to see a guy with a .300 BA kicked out of the Hall).

Gary Carter??!!!!!!

[538280]

Leecemark, you say Gary Carter should be in the Hall of Fame because he is one of the top 10 catchers ever. You can't say someone should be in the Hall just because he is near the top of an extremely weak crop of catchers. Why should we let in Carter just because he is a catcher? Would he be in with his stats if he was a first baseman?

[538280]

Leecemark:

I not looking to make an enemy here, but I need to correct you again. George Kell and George Kelly are not the same person. They both are in the Hall of Fame (although they shouldn't be) and are different players. If you don't believe me, look it up.

[ElHalo]

Gary Carter??!!!!!!

Yes, Gary Carter. Defensively he's probably the fourth worst C in the Hall (though he was of course very good), ahead of Ferrell, Dickey, and Lombardi. Offensively he's probably the third worst C in the Hall, ahead of Ferrell and Schalk. A 115 career OPS+ puts him back in the pack for catchers, and outside of 1982, none of his offensive seasons are anything to really speak of. I thought it was a joke when he made it in, and I still believe he's the second worst C in the Hall, ahead of only Ferrell.

[Bleacherbee]

Leecemark:

I not looking to make an enemy here, but I need to correct you again. George Kell and George Kelly are not the same person. They both are in the Hall of Fame (although they shouldn't be) and are different players. If you don't believe me, look it up.

I believe leecemark is aware.

You still put George Kelly up there twice

[leecemark]

--I know all about George Kell. He was the Tiger's TV broadcaster for many years. Even though he was a questionable selection, I'm glad he is there for strictly sentimental reasons.
--If you think a catcher needs offensive stats comparable to a firstbaseman to make the Hall, you probably ought to be campaigning to have them all kicked out. Johnny Bench and Yogi Berra's numbers are just pretty good when compared to the elite 1B's and they would be questionable selections if they weren't catchers. Unless you think the Hall should be limited to less than 100 players its hard to see any argument for not including Gary Carter.

[ElHalo]

--If you think a catcher needs offensive stats comparable to a firstbaseman to make the Hall, you probably ought to be campaigning to have them all kicked out. Johnny Bench and Yogi Berra's numbers are just pretty good when compared to the elite 1B's and they would be questionable selections if they weren't catchers. Unless you think the Hall should be limited to less than 100 players its hard to see any argument for not including Gary Carter.

I don't compare C's to 1Bmen, I compare C's to other C's. I'm not really in a position to argue the merits of 19th century players, so I'll forget about Kelly and Ewing, but as far as 20th century players go, Carter just doesn't have the offensive prowess of Lombardi, Berra, Dickey, Cochrane, Hartnett, Campanella, Bresnahan, Bench, or Fisk.