Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Jeff Bagwell

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • He any people who leave him off had anything to say for themselves other than SteveGarveyman. Raines, Trammell I can see if people are hung up on counting #s or 100 R/RBI seasons, I don't agreebut I can see it, they may not get a vote. Bagwell has 400+ HR 1500 R and RBI .297 avg what more could they want.

    Comment


    • I think of Bagwell as a definite HOF player. I rank him as the #5 1B of all-time behind Pujols, Gehrig, Buck Leonard & Foxx

      Comment


      • I think he was a first-ballot, but the voters flexed their muscles and served "punishment" to anybody playing during the "steroid era" - whether in the Mitchell report or not.
        "Chuckie doesn't take on 2-0. Chuckie's hackin'." - Chuck Carr two days prior to being released by the Milwaukee Brewers

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Ben Grimm View Post
          I think he was a first-ballot, but the voters flexed their muscles and served "punishment" to anybody playing during the "steroid era" - whether in the Mitchell report or not.
          Not true. Tony Gwynn and Cal Ripken Jr. played in the steroid era, and both were first ballot Hofers with instant ease. Bagwell for some reason has a steroid stigma attached to him, which is sad.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by fenrir View Post
            Not true. Tony Gwynn and Cal Ripken Jr. played in the steroid era, and both were first ballot Hofers with instant ease. Bagwell for some reason has a steroid stigma attached to him, which is sad.
            The steroid slander only affects those who were power hitters in the steroid era. This despite all of the people who have been busted (or strongly connected) who were pitchers or small middle infielders or career scrubs.
            1885 1886 1926 1931 1934 1942 1944 1946 1964 1967 1982 2006 2011

            1887 1888 1928 1930 1943 1968 1985 1987 2004 2013

            1996 2000 2001 2002 2005 2009 2012 2014 2015


            The Top 100 Pitchers In MLB History
            The Top 100 Position Players In MLB History

            Comment


            • Whether we want him to be or not Jeff Bagwell is going into the Hall. You don't have 56% of the vote in your second time on the ballot and not get elected to the Hall. It simply doesn't happen. At some point in the next two years he'll get in.

              Both Cal and Tony got in before the real backlash against the steroid era got started, not that the backlash would have stopped them from getting in on the first ballot.

              2007 was Mark McGwire's first year on the ballot and since then as the backlash has grown he's lost a small amount of ground in the voting percentages.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Ubiquitous View Post
                Whether we want him to be or not Jeff Bagwell is going into the Hall. You don't have 56% of the vote in your second time on the ballot and not get elected to the Hall. It simply doesn't happen. At some point in the next two years he'll get in.

                .
                Yes, Bagwell will make it, but it may take a while since there will be a huge flood of high profile HOFers on the ballot over the next several years. I think he may have to wait until some of the tidal wave goes down.
                1885 1886 1926 1931 1934 1942 1944 1946 1964 1967 1982 2006 2011

                1887 1888 1928 1930 1943 1968 1985 1987 2004 2013

                1996 2000 2001 2002 2005 2009 2012 2014 2015


                The Top 100 Pitchers In MLB History
                The Top 100 Position Players In MLB History

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Ben Grimm View Post
                  I think he was a first-ballot, but the voters flexed their muscles and served "punishment" to anybody playing during the "steroid era" - whether in the Mitchell report or not.
                  I agree with all of this. My belief that the stigmatization of "roiders" is unfair and unjust is documented in other threads. Bags is a victim of flat out guilt by association. Most of the folks who have done this to Bagwell would be criying to High Heaven if it were done to them.
                  "I do not care if half the league strikes. Those who do it will encounter quick retribution. All will be suspended and I don't care if it wrecks the National League for five years. This is the United States of America and one citizen has as much right to play as another. The National League will go down the line with Robinson whatever the consequences. You will find if you go through with your intention that you have been guilty of complete madness."

                  NL President Ford Frick, 1947

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Matthew C. View Post
                    The steroid slander only affects those who were power hitters in the steroid era. This despite all of the people who have been busted (or strongly connected) who were pitchers or small middle infielders or career scrubs.
                    Pitchers face less steroid scrutiny because of the lack of big names involved in the scandal. Clemens is by far the biggest name. After that you have Kevin Brown, who was an excellent pitcher, but nowhere near a Roger Clemens level. If someone else at Clemens level ended up involved in the steroid scandal (Maddux, Johnson, or Pedro), then that would change a lot of people's perspectives. Compare that to position players, specifically home run hitters where you have bunches of big names involved. Bonds, Arod, Manny, Mcgwire, Sosa, Palmerio, Sheffield, etc.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by fenrir View Post
                      Pitchers face less steroid scrutiny because of the lack of big names involved in the scandal. Clemens is by far the biggest name. After that you have Kevin Brown, who was an excellent pitcher, but nowhere near a Roger Clemens level. If someone else at Clemens level ended up involved in the steroid scandal (Maddux, Johnson, or Pedro), then that would change a lot of people's perspectives. Compare that to position players, specifically home run hitters where you have bunches of big names involved. Bonds, Arod, Manny, Mcgwire, Sosa, Palmerio, Sheffield, etc.
                      Good point. Also, consider the fact that it was offense that was up during the steroid era. If the pitchers were juicing as well, then it didn't appear to be helping them much, or at least not as much as the hitters.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by willshad View Post
                        Good point. Also, consider the fact that it was offense that was up during the steroid era. If the pitchers were juicing as well, then it didn't appear to be helping them much, or at least not as much as the hitters.
                        I've always agreed that based on the available evidence that hitters benefited more than pitchers, mainly because we know less of the effects steroids have on pitchers besides obvious quicker recovery time, and possible increases in velocity. That said, while steroids most certainly played a large part in the offensive explosion in this era, I think this would be a hitters era regardless of steroids because of many other factors.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by willshad View Post
                          Good point. Also, consider the fact that it was offense that was up during the steroid era. If the pitchers were juicing as well, then it didn't appear to be helping them much, or at least not as much as the hitters.

                          Either that or it would have been even more of a massacre if the pitchers weren't juicing.

                          Comment


                          • Though most voters likely disregard the fact as trivial, I think the fact that Jeff Bagwell was a first baseman with very good speed for most of his career should weight largely on his Hall of Fame case. Not only could the guy hurt the opposition with the home run, he could also hurt it with his legs once he got on base. Very few first basemen could do that.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Cowtipper View Post
                              Though most voters likely disregard the fact as trivial, I think the fact that Jeff Bagwell was a first baseman with very good speed for most of his career should weight largely on his Hall of Fame case. Not only could the guy hurt the opposition with the home run, he could also hurt it with his legs once he got on base. Very few first basemen could do that.
                              How was his D? I never saw him in his prime.
                              "The first draft of anything is crap." - Ernest Hemingway

                              There's no such thing as an ultimate stat.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by 1905 Giants View Post
                                How was his D? I never saw him in his prime.
                                WAR says he wasn't a great fielder, but he did win a Gold Glove and he led the league in 1B assists a bunch of times.

                                Comment

                                Ad Widget

                                Collapse
                                Working...
                                X