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The Shadow Hall of Fame - Discussion Thread

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  • The Shadow Hall of Fame - Discussion Thread

    There are 317 members of the Baseball Hall of Fame which includes former players, managers and executives. This project seeks to determine the 317 most worthy individuals outside the Hall of Fame. 249 of those members were inducted primarily for their playing career. 68 members were inducted primarily for their non-playing career.

    Your task is to select the 249 most deserving players and 68 most deserving contributors (non-players) for election to a “Shadow” Hall of Fame.

    Rule #1 – For all candidates, the weight of consideration should be given to their performance, talent and contributions to their organization(s) though character, integrity and sportsmanship may also factored into the equation.

    Rule #2 – You may select candidates from the Major Leagues, various Negro Leagues and from among the assorted Cuban, Mexican, Japanese and other foreign professional leagues. For our purposes “Major Leagues” include the 1871-1875 National Assocation and the professional clubs preceding it. Candidates banned from MLB are eligible for this project.

    Rule #3 – There is no minimum service time requirement, but no candidate may have been active in the capacity for which he is being considered beyond the 2011 season unless the candidate is, today, deceased or at least 65 years of age.

    Rule #4 – Ballots must list no more than 249 players and no more than 68 contributors separately. All candidates should also be sorted by primary position and/or the specific category of contributor (manager, executive/pioneer, or umpire). Candidates may be listed either in descending order of merit or alphabetically, at your discretion.

    Rule #5 – We will not use the Hall of Fame’s positional quotas, merely the total number of players and the total number of contributors (249 and 68, respectively). You are not required, for example, to list 77 pitchers. You may have 30 or 150 or any other number so long as your total number of players does not exceed 249. I will maintain a running tally of all official ballots and post the cumulative totals for every candidate listed on a ballot.

    Rule #6 – To ease things for all participants, a separate thread will be maintained strictly for ballots and amendments to ballots. All discussion of this project, the rules, the ballots and the results, etc. must take place within this thread.

    Rule #7 – When the Hall of Fame elects additional members in the future, we will make appropriate adjustments to our ballots and the overall results.

    Link to the Voting Thread.
    Last edited by Chadwick; 05-10-2017, 04:10 PM.
    "It is a simple matter to erect a Hall of Fame, but difficult to select the tenants." -- Ken Smith
    "I am led to suspect that some of the electorate is very dumb." -- Henry P. Edwards
    "You have a Hall of Fame to put people in, not keep people out." -- Brian Kenny
    "There's no such thing as a perfect ballot." -- Jay Jaffe

  • #2
    Results
    TBA
    "It is a simple matter to erect a Hall of Fame, but difficult to select the tenants." -- Ken Smith
    "I am led to suspect that some of the electorate is very dumb." -- Henry P. Edwards
    "You have a Hall of Fame to put people in, not keep people out." -- Brian Kenny
    "There's no such thing as a perfect ballot." -- Jay Jaffe

    Comment


    • #3
      ------------------------------------------------- MY "SHADOW HALL" ----------------------------------------------------


      67 MLB Pitchers
      Babe Adams
      Kevin Appier
      Vida Blue
      Tommy Bond
      Harry Brecheen
      Ted Breitenstein
      Tommy Bridges
      Kevin Brown
      Bob Caruthers
      Roger Clemens
      David Cone
      Wilbur Cooper
      Wes Ferrell
      Chuck Finley
      Larry French
      Bob Friend
      Dwight Gooden
      Ron Guidry
      Mel Harder
      Orel Hershiser
      John Hiller
      Larry Jackson
      Tommy John
      Jim Kaat
      Jimmy Key
      Jerry Koosman
      Dutch Leonard
      Mickey Lolich
      Dolf Luque
      Carl Mays
      Bobby Mathews
      Jim McCormick
      Tony Mullane
      George Mullin
      Mike Mussina
      Don Newcombe
      Bobo Newsom
      Claude Passeau
      Billy Pierce
      Jack Powell
      Dan Quisenberry
      Brad Radke
      Rick Reuschel
      Steve Rogers
      Eddie Rommel
      Schoolboy Rowe
      Nap Rucker
      Bret Saberhagen
      Curt Schilling
      Bob Shawkey
      Urban Shocker
      Dave Stieb
      Jack Stivetts
      Mel Stottlemyre
      Jesse Tannehill
      Luis Tiant
      Dizzy Trout
      George Uhle
      Hippo Vaughn
      Fernando Valenzuela
      Javier Vazquez
      Frank Viola
      Bucky Walters
      Lon Warneke
      Jim Whitney
      Smoky Joe Wood
      Wilbur Wood


      15 MLB Catchers
      Charlie Bennett
      Smoky Burgess
      Jack Clements
      Bill Freehan
      Tom Haller
      Elston Howard
      Jason Kendall
      Thurman Munson
      Lance Parrish
      Darrell Porter
      Jorge Posada
      Wally Schang
      Ted Simmons
      Jim Sundberg
      Gene Tenace


      20 MLB First Basemen
      Dolph Camilli
      Norm Cash
      Will Clark
      Jake Daubert
      Carlos Delgado
      Jack Fournier
      Steve Garvey
      Mark Grace
      Keith Hernandez
      Kent Hrbek
      Gil Hodges
      Ed Konetchy
      Don Mattingly
      Frank McCormick
      Fred McGriff
      Mark McGwire
      John Olerud
      Rafael Palmeiro
      Joe Start
      Bill White


      20 MLB Second Basemen
      Max Bishop
      Cupid Childs
      Tony Cuccinello
      Larry Doyle
      Fred Dunlap
      Lonny Frey
      Jim Gilliam
      Bobby Grich
      Chuck Knoblauch
      Davey Lopes
      Dick McAuliffe
      Gil McDougald
      Danny Murphy
      Buddy Myer
      Del Pratt
      Willie Randolph
      Hardy Richardson
      Eddie Stanky
      Robby Thompson
      Lou Whitaker


      13 MLB Third Basemen
      Dick Allen
      Sal Bando
      Buddy Bell
      Ken Boyer
      Ron Cey
      Bob Elliott
      Darrell Evans
      Heinie Groh
      Stan Hack
      Edgar Martinez
      Graig Nettles
      Robin Ventura
      Matt Williams


      22 MLB Shortstops
      Dick Bartell
      Mark Belanger
      Donie Bush
      Bert Campaneris
      Dave Concepcion
      Bill Dahlen
      Al Dark
      Tony Fernandez
      Art Fletcher
      Jim Fregosi
      Nomar Garciaparra
      Jack Glasscock
      Dick Groat
      Herman Long
      Freddy Parent
      Roger Peckinpaugh
      Johnny Pesky
      Rico Petrocelli
      Vern Stephens
      Alan Trammell
      Cecil Travis
      Maury Wills


      21 MLB Left Fielders
      Moises Alou
      Albert Belle
      Barry Bonds
      Jose Cruz
      George Foster
      Kirk Gibson
      Luis Gonzalez
      Sid Gordon
      Frank Howard
      Bob Johnson
      Charley Jones
      Charlie Keller
      Sherry Magee
      Minnie Minoso
      Tony Phillips
      Manny Ramirez
      Jimmy Sheckard
      Harry Stovey
      Bobby Veach
      Roy White
      Ken Williams


      18 MLB Center Fielders
      Wally Berger
      Pete Browning
      Ellis Burks
      Brett Butler
      Cesar Cedeno
      Willie Davis
      Lenny Dykstra
      Jim Edmonds
      Curt Flood
      George Gore
      Paul Hines
      Chet Lemon
      Kenny Lofton
      Fred Lynn
      Dale Murphy
      Vada Pinson
      Bernie Williams
      Jim Wynn


      24 MLB Right Fielders
      Jesse Barfield
      Bobby Bonds
      Jose Canseco
      Jack Clark
      Rocky Colavito
      Gavvy Cravath
      J.D. Drew
      Dwight Evans
      Brian Giles
      Vladimir Guerrero
      David Justice
      Tony Oliva
      Magglio Ordonez
      Dave Parker
      Tim Salmon
      Gary Sheffield
      Ken Singleton
      Reggie Smith
      Sammy Sosa
      Rusty Staub
      Darryl Strawberry
      Mike Tiernan
      Dixie Walker
      Larry Walker


      ------------------------------------------------- JUST FOR FUN ----------------------------------------------------


      29 Non-MLB Players
      John Beckwith, 3B
      Akira Bessho, P
      Bill Byrd, P
      Perucho Cepeda, SS
      Bingo DeMoss, 2B
      Yutaka Enatsu, P
      Yutaka Fukumoto, CF
      Isao Harimoto, LF
      Tetsuharu Kawakami, 1B
      Kazuhisa Inao, P
      Masaichi Kaneda, P
      Hiromitsu Kadota, RF
      Home Run Johnson, SS
      Dick Lundy, SS
      Oliver Marcelle, 3B
      Dobie Moore, SS
      Shigeo Nagashima, 3B
      Katsuya Nomura, C
      Hiromitsu Ochiai, 1B
      Sadaharu Oh, 1B
      Bruce Petway, C
      Dick Redding, P
      George Scales, 2B
      Victor Starffin, P
      Shigeru Sugishita, P
      Quincy Trouppe, C
      Nip Winters, P
      Wild Bill Wright, RF
      Kazuhiro Yamauchi, CF


      68 MLB Contributors
      Doc Adams
      James Andrews
      Buzzie Bavasi
      Estevan Bellán
      Sy Berger
      Ed Bolden
      Sam Breadon
      Joe L. Brown
      Gussie Busch
      Al Campanis
      Bill Cammeyer
      Jim Campbell
      Frank Cashen
      O.P. Caylor
      Jim Creighton
      Harry Dalton
      L. Bob Davids
      Bing Devine
      Bill Dinneen
      Jack Dunn
      Charles Ebbets
      Al Munro Elias
      Bud Fowler
      Bruce Froemming
      Gus Greenlee
      Vic Harris
      John A. Heydler
      Ralph Houk
      Bob Howsam
      Frank Jobe
      Davey Johnson
      Henry Killea
      Ernest J. Lanigan
      Jim Leyland
      Charlie Manuel
      Billy Martin
      Marvin Miller
      Shigeru Mizuhara
      Danny Murtaugh
      David Neft
      Lefty O’Doul
      Buck O’Neil
      Pete Palmer
      Lou Piniella
      John Quinn
      Al Reach
      Ben Shibe
      Charles Somers
      Alfred H. Spink
      Cedric Tallis
      C.I. Taylor
      Kazuto Tsuruoka
      Ted Turner
      Chris Von der Ahe
      Louis Wadsworth
      Frank Warfield
      Lee Weyer
      William Wheaton
      Last edited by Chadwick; 04-09-2017, 04:30 PM.
      "It is a simple matter to erect a Hall of Fame, but difficult to select the tenants." -- Ken Smith
      "I am led to suspect that some of the electorate is very dumb." -- Henry P. Edwards
      "You have a Hall of Fame to put people in, not keep people out." -- Brian Kenny
      "There's no such thing as a perfect ballot." -- Jay Jaffe

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Chadwick View Post
        ------------------------------------------------- MY "SHADOW HALL" ----------------------------------------------------


        68 MLB Contributors
        TBD
        May I suggest:

        Paul Krichell
        Emil Bossard
        George Ellard
        Jim Creighton
        Earnshaw Cook
        Last edited by westsidegrounds; 04-09-2017, 12:56 PM.

        Comment


        • #5
          LET’S GIVE IT A TRY: PART ONE

          CATCHERS
          Bennett, Charlie
          Boone, Bob
          Clements, Jack
          Freehan, Bill
          Howard, Elston
          Kendall, Jason
          McGuire, Deacon
          Munson, Thurman
          Parrish, Lance
          Porter, Darrell
          Posada, Jorge
          Schang, Wally
          Simmons, Ted
          Sundberg, Jim
          Tenace, Gene

          FIRST BASEMEN
          Camilli, Dolph
          Cash, Norm
          Clark, Will
          Cooper, Cecil
          Daubert, Jake
          Delgado, Carlos
          Galarraga, Andres
          Garvey, Steve
          Grace, Mark
          Hernandez, Keith
          Hodges, Gil
          Konetchy, Ed
          Mattingly, Don
          McGriff, Fred
          McGwire, Mark
          Olerud, John
          Palmeiro, Rafael
          Powell, Boog
          Start, Joe
          Vernon, Mickey

          SECOND BASEMEN
          Bishop, Max
          Childs, Cupid
          Doyle, Larry
          Dunlap, Fred
          Franco, Julio
          Gilliam, Jim
          Grich, Bobby
          Kent, Jeff
          Knoblauch, Chuck
          Lopes, Davey
          McDougald, Gil
          Murphy, Danny
          Myer, Buddy
          Phillips, Tony
          Pratt, Del
          Randolph, Willie
          Richardson, Hardy
          Stanky, Eddie
          Whitaker, Lou
          White, Frank

          SHORTSTOPS
          Bartell, Dick
          Belanger, Mark
          Bush, Donie
          Campaneris, Bert
          Concepcion, Dave
          Dahlen, Bill
          Dark, Al
          Fernandez, Tony
          Fletcher, Art
          Fregosi, Jim
          Garciaparra, Nomar
          Glasscock, Jack
          Groat, Dick
          Kuenn, Harvey
          Long, Herman
          McKean, Ed
          Pesky, Johnny
          Petrocelli, Rico
          Stephens, Vern
          Trammell, Alan
          Travis, Cecil
          Wills, Maury

          THIRD BASEMEN
          Allen, Dick
          Bando, Sal
          Boyer, Ken
          Bell,Buddy
          Cey, Ron
          Elliott, Bob
          Evans, Darrell
          Groh, Heinie
          Hack, Stan
          Martinez, Edgar
          Nettles, Graig
          Sutton, Ezra
          Ventura, Robin
          Last edited by TheSlaff; 04-24-2017, 12:55 PM.
          Nos Amours! ... 1969-2004

          Comment


          • #6
            PART TWO

            LEFT FIELDERS
            Alou, Moises
            Belle, Albert
            Bonds, Barry
            Burns, George J.
            Cruz, Jose
            Foster, George
            Gibson, Kirk
            Gonzalez, Luis
            Howard, Frank
            Johnson, Bob
            Jones, Charley
            Keller, Charlie
            Magee, Sherry
            Minoso, Minnie
            O'Neill, Tip
            Ramirez, Manny
            Sheckard, Jimmy
            Stovey, Harry
            Veach, Bobby
            White, Roy
            Williams, Ken

            CENTER FIELDERS
            Browning, Pete
            Butler, Brett
            Cedeno, Cesar
            Davis, Chili
            Davis, Willie
            Edmonds, Jim
            Finley, Steve
            Gore, George
            Hines, Paul
            Lofton, Kenny
            Lynn, Fred
            Murphy, Dale
            Oliver, Al
            Pinson, Vada
            Ryan, Jimmy
            Van Haltren, George
            Williams, Bernie
            Wynn, Jim

            RIGHT FIELDERS
            Baines, Harold
            Bonds, Bobby
            Canseco, Jose
            Clark, Jack
            Colavito, Rocky
            Cravath, Gavvy
            Evans, Dwight
            Giles, Brian
            Gonzalez, Juan
            Guerrero, Vladimir
            Herman, Babe
            Oliva, Tony
            O'Neill, Paul
            Ordonez, Magglio
            Parker, Dave
            Salmon, Tim
            Sheffield, Gary
            Singleton, Ken
            Smith, Reggie
            Sosa, Sammy
            Staub, Rusty
            Strawberry, Darryl
            Tiernan, Mike
            Walker, Larry
            Last edited by TheSlaff; 04-24-2017, 01:00 PM.
            Nos Amours! ... 1969-2004

            Comment


            • #7
              67 MLB Pitchers

              Babe Adams
              Kevin Appier
              Tommy Bond
              Vida Blue
              Harry Brecheen
              Ted Breitenstein
              Tommy Bridges
              Kevin Brown
              Charlie Buffington
              John Candelaria
              Bob Caruthers
              Roger Clemens
              David Cone
              Wilbur Cooper
              Wes Ferrell
              Chuck Finley
              Ned Garver
              Dwight Gooden
              Ron Guidry
              Orel Hershisher
              John Hiller
              Larry Jackson
              Tommy John
              Jim Kaat
              Jimmy Key
              Silver King
              Jerry Koosman
              Mark Langston
              Al Leiter
              Emil "Dutch" Leonard
              Red Lucas
              Dolph Luque
              Carl Mays
              Jim McCormick
              Sam McDowell
              Andy Messersmith
              Tony Mullane
              Mike Mussina
              Don Newcombe
              Claude Passeau
              Billy Pierce
              Jack Quinn
              Dan Quisenberry
              Brad Radke
              Rick Resuchel
              Steve Rogers
              Schoolboy Rowe
              Eddie Romel
              Nap Rucker
              Bret Saberhagen
              Curt Schiling
              Uran Shocker
              Dave Steib
              Jack Stivetts
              Mel Stottlemyre
              Frank Tanana
              Luis Tiant
              Dizzy Trout
              Virgil Trucks
              George Uhle
              Javier Vazquez
              Frank Viola
              Bucky Walters
              Lon Warneke
              David Wells
              Jim Whitney
              Wilbur Wood

              15 MLB Catchers

              Charlie Bennett
              Smokey Burgess
              Jack Clements
              Bill Freehan
              Tom Haller
              Jason Kendall
              Sherm Lollar
              Thurman Munson
              Lance Parrish
              Darrell Porter
              Jorge Posada
              Wally Schang
              Ted Simmons
              Jim Sundberg
              Gene Tenace

              20 MLB First Basemen

              Dolph Camilli
              Norm Cash
              Will Clark
              Carlos Delgado
              Jack Fournier
              Pedro Guerrero
              Mark Grace
              Keith Hernandez
              Gil Hodges
              Kent Hrbek
              Joe Judge
              Ed Konetchy
              Don Mattingly
              Fred McGriff
              Mark McGwire
              John Olerud
              Rafael Palmeiro
              Boog Powell
              Joe Start
              Bill White

              20 MLB Second Basemen

              Max Bishop
              Cupid Childs
              Larry Doyle
              Fred Dunlop
              Lonny Fry
              Jim Gilliam
              Bobby Grich
              Jeff Kent
              Chuck Knoblauch
              Davey Lopes
              Dick McAuliffe
              Gil McDougald
              Buddy Myer
              Tony Phillips
              Del Pratt
              Willie Randolph
              Hardy Richardson
              Eddy Stanky
              Robby Thompson
              Lou Whitaker

              13 MLB Third Basemen

              Dick Allen
              Sal Bando
              Buddy Bell
              Ken Boyer
              Ron Cey
              Bob Elliott
              Darrell Evans
              Heinie Groh
              Stan Hack
              Toby Harrah
              Edgar Martinez
              Graig Nettles
              Robin Ventura

              22 MLB Shortstops

              Dick Bartell
              Mark Belanger
              Jay Bell
              Bert Campaneris
              Ray Chapman
              Bill Dahlen
              Alvin Dark
              Tony Fernandez
              Art Fletcher
              Jim Fregosi
              Nomar Garciaparra
              Jack Glasscock
              Johnny Logan
              Freddy Parent
              Roger Peckinpaugh
              Rico Petrocelli
              Johnny Pesky
              Alan Trammell
              Vern Stephens
              Cecil Travis
              Maury Wills
              Glenn Wright

              21 MLB Left Fielders

              Moises Alou
              Albert Belle
              Barry Bonds
              Jose Cruz
              Brian Downing
              George Foster
              Kirk Gibson
              Luis Gonzalez
              Sid Gordon
              Jeff Heath
              Bob Johnson
              Charlie Keller
              Sherry Magee
              Minnie Minoso
              Manny Ramirez
              Jimmy Sheckard
              Lonnie Smith
              Harry Stovey
              Bobby Veach
              Roy White
              Ken Williams

              18 MLB Center Fielders

              Wally Berger
              Pete Browning
              Brett Butler
              Ellis Burks
              Cesar Cedeno
              Willie Davis
              Lenny Dykstra
              Jim Edmonds
              Curt Flood
              Chet Lemon
              Kenny Lofton
              Fred Lynn
              Dale Murphy
              Vada Pinson
              Devon White
              Bernie Williams
              Willie Wilson
              Jimmy Wynn

              24 MLB Right Fielders

              Jesse Barfield
              Bobby Bonds
              Jose Canseco
              Jack Clark
              Rocky Colavito
              J.D. Drew
              Dwight Evans
              Brian Giles
              Vladimir Guerrero
              Babe Herman
              Tommy Henrich
              David Justice
              Roger Maris
              Tony Oliva
              Tim Salmon
              Reggie Sanders
              Gary Sheffield
              Ken Singleton
              Reggie Smith
              Sammy Sosa
              Darryl Strawberry
              Mike Tiernan
              Dixie Walker
              Larry Walker
              Last edited by NJRob65; 04-11-2017, 01:34 PM.

              Comment


              • #8
                Very nice, guys. I'll start tallying these some time this weekend. I'll have some questions for you individually at that point. Impressed with some of the names you guys came up with that I didn't have.
                "It is a simple matter to erect a Hall of Fame, but difficult to select the tenants." -- Ken Smith
                "I am led to suspect that some of the electorate is very dumb." -- Henry P. Edwards
                "You have a Hall of Fame to put people in, not keep people out." -- Brian Kenny
                "There's no such thing as a perfect ballot." -- Jay Jaffe

                Comment


                • #9
                  I just don't have 220 candidates, I'm afraid, so I don't know if my voice counts. But I'll just throw in - in addition to the "contributors" I mentioned above - Steve O'Neill. He's kind of the catching equivalent of Bill Mazeroski (whose selection I support): possibly the best fielder ever at a crucial defensive position. "... for much of his 17-year major-league career he was arguably the best all-around backstop in the game." says the SABR bio at bbref. He was also 1,040-821 as a manager, with never a losing season, if that helps.
                  Last edited by westsidegrounds; 04-12-2017, 12:15 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    There are 23 managers in the Hall of Fame. If I had to the next-best group of 23 managers, Steve O'Neill would be in there.
                    "It is a simple matter to erect a Hall of Fame, but difficult to select the tenants." -- Ken Smith
                    "I am led to suspect that some of the electorate is very dumb." -- Henry P. Edwards
                    "You have a Hall of Fame to put people in, not keep people out." -- Brian Kenny
                    "There's no such thing as a perfect ballot." -- Jay Jaffe

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Manny Sanguillen should definitely be in a Hall of Very Good catchers. Overshadowed by Bench in the 70s, but still an outstanding catcher. Too bad we don't have pitch framing numbers from this era, and Sanguillen was a lethal hitter. I would either jettison Tom Haller, or one of the 19th century guys we have very little info on.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        PART THREE

                        PITCHERS (FINAL VERSION)
                        Adams, Babe
                        Appier, Kevin
                        Blue, Vida
                        Bond, Tommy
                        Bridges, Tommy
                        Brown, Kevin
                        Caruthers, Bob
                        Clemens, Roger
                        Cone, David
                        Cooper, Wilbur
                        Cuellar, Mike
                        Ferrell, Wes
                        Finley, Chuck
                        Franco, John
                        French, Larry
                        Gooden, Dwight
                        Guidry, Ron
                        Harder, Mel
                        Hershiser, Orel
                        Hiller, John
                        Hoffman, Trevor
                        Jackson, Larry
                        John, Tommy
                        Kaat, Jim
                        Key, Jimmy
                        Koosman, Jerry
                        Leever, Sam
                        Leonard, Dutch
                        Lolich, Mickey
                        Luque, Dolf
                        Marberry, Firpo
                        Martinez, Dennis
                        Mathews, Bobby
                        Mays, Carl
                        McCormick, Jim
                        Morris, Jack
                        Mullane, Tony
                        Mullin, George
                        Mussina, Mike
                        Newcombe, Don
                        Phillippe, Deacon
                        Pierce, Billy
                        Quinn, Jack
                        Quisenberry, Dan
                        Reuschel, Rick
                        Rogers, Steve
                        Rommel, Eddie
                        Root, Charlie
                        Saberhagen, Bret
                        Schilling, Curt
                        Shawkey, Bob
                        Shocker, Urban
                        Smith, Lee
                        Stieb, Dave
                        Stivetts, Jack
                        Tanana, Frank
                        Tannehill, Jesse
                        Tiant, Luis
                        Vaughn, Hippo
                        Viola, Frank
                        Wagner, Billy
                        Walters, Bucky
                        Warneke, Lon
                        Wells, David
                        Wetteland, John
                        Wood, Joe
                        Wood, Wilbur
                        Last edited by TheSlaff; 04-24-2017, 01:00 PM.
                        Nos Amours! ... 1969-2004

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          In the process of revamping my rankings, will start with pitchers.

                          Thanks for the thread Chadwick!

                          Babe Adams
                          Kevin Appier
                          Vida Blue
                          Tommy Bond
                          Harry Brecheen
                          Tommy Bridges
                          Kevin Brown
                          Charlie Buffinton
                          Bob Caruthers
                          Roger Clemens
                          David Cone
                          Wilbur Cooper
                          Wes Ferrell
                          Chuck Finley
                          Larry French
                          Bob Friend
                          Doc Gooden
                          Ron Guidry
                          Mel Harder
                          Orel Hershiser
                          Trevor Hoffman
                          Larry Jackson
                          Tommy John
                          Jim Kaat
                          Jimmy Key
                          Jerry Koosman
                          Mark Langston
                          Dutch Leonard
                          Mickey Lolich
                          Dolf Luque
                          Sal Maglie - bump for Mexican league credit
                          Dennis Martinez
                          Carl Mays
                          Jim McCormick
                          Lindy McDaniel
                          Tony Mullane
                          Mike Mussina
                          Don Newcombe
                          Camilo Pascual
                          Claude Passeau
                          Billy Pierce
                          Jack Quinn
                          Rick Reuschel
                          Kenny Rogers
                          Steve Rogers
                          Eddie Rommel
                          Schoolboy Rowe
                          Bret Saberhagen
                          Johnny Sain
                          Curt Schilling
                          Bob Shawkey
                          Urban Shocker
                          Dave Stieb
                          Frank Tanana
                          Luis Tiant
                          Dizzy Trout
                          George Uhle
                          Fernando Valenzuela
                          Hippo Vaughn
                          Javier Vazquez
                          Frank Viola
                          Billy Wagner
                          Bucky Walters
                          Lon Warneke
                          David Wells
                          Jim Whitney
                          Wilbur Wood

                          Catchers: - deep position
                          Charlie Bennett
                          Del Crandall
                          Bill Freehan
                          Elston Howard
                          Jason Kendall
                          Javier Lopez
                          Cal McVey
                          Thurman Munson
                          Lance Parrish
                          Darrell Porter
                          Jorge Posada
                          Wally Schang
                          Ted Simmons
                          Jim Sundberg
                          Gene Tenace

                          First Basemen: - very shallow
                          Dolph Camili
                          Norm Cash
                          Will Clark
                          Harry Davis
                          Carlos Delgado
                          Elbie Fletcher
                          Jack Fournier
                          Pedro Guerrero
                          Keith Hernandez
                          Gil Hodges
                          Ed Konetchy
                          Don Mattingly
                          Fred McGriff
                          Mark McGwire
                          John Olerud
                          Rafael Palmeiro
                          Boog Powell
                          Joe Start
                          Fred Tenney
                          Rudy York

                          Second Basemen: - loaded with HOF:
                          Bobby Avila
                          Ross Barnes
                          Max Bishop
                          Cupid Childs
                          Fred Dunlap
                          Julio Franco
                          Lonny Frey
                          Jim Gilliam
                          Bobby Grich
                          Jeff Kent
                          Chuck Knoblauch
                          Davey Lopes
                          Dick McAulife
                          Gil McDougald
                          Tony Phillips
                          Del Pratt
                          Eddie Stanky
                          Willie Randolph
                          Hardy Richardson
                          Lou Whitaker

                          Third Basemen: - I'd be fine with these guys in the regular hall, let alone a shadow.
                          Dick Allen
                          Sal Bando
                          Buddy Bell
                          Ken Boyer
                          Ron Cey
                          Darrell Evans
                          Heinie Groh
                          Stan Hack
                          Tommy Leach
                          Edgar Martinez
                          Greg Nettles
                          Robin Ventura
                          Ed Williamson

                          Shortstop: - well balanced
                          Dick Bartell
                          Jay Bell
                          Donie Bush
                          Bert Campaneris
                          Bill Dahlen
                          Al Dark
                          David Concepcion
                          Tony Fernandez
                          Art Fletcher
                          Jim Fregosi
                          Nomar Garciaparra
                          Jack Glasscock
                          Toby Harrah
                          Dickey Pearce
                          Roger Peckinpaugh
                          Johnny Pesky
                          Rico Petrocelli
                          Phil Rizzuto
                          Vern Stephens
                          Alan Trammell
                          Cecil Travis
                          Maury Wills

                          Will try to update outfielders this week (the positions become blurry for me).

                          21 MLB Left Fielders - half HOF types, half not too far off
                          Albert Belle
                          Barry Bonds
                          George Burns
                          Jose Cruz
                          Brian Downing
                          George Foster
                          Augie Galan
                          Luis Gonzalez
                          Bob Johnson
                          Charley Jones
                          Fielder Jones
                          Charlie Keller
                          Sherry Magee
                          Minnie Minoso
                          Manny Ramirez
                          Jimmy Sheckard
                          Mike "Elmer" Smith
                          Harry Stovey
                          Bobby Veach
                          Roy White
                          Ken Williams

                          18 MLB Center Fielders - overflowing with HOF level or ever so close
                          Wally Berger
                          Pete Browning
                          Cesar Cedeno
                          Willie Davis
                          Dom DiMaggio
                          Jim Edmonds
                          George Gore
                          Mike Griffin
                          Paul Hines
                          Kenny Lofton
                          Fred Lynn
                          Dale Murphy
                          Amos Otis
                          Lip Pike
                          Jimmy Ryan
                          Cy Seymour
                          Bernie Williams
                          Jimmy Wynn

                          24 MLB Right Fielders - handful of HOF level, deep position of not quite enough level
                          Jesse Barfield
                          Bobby Bonds
                          Johnny Callison
                          Jose Canseco
                          Jack Clark
                          Rocky Colavito
                          Gavvy Cravath
                          Dwight Evans
                          Brian Giles
                          Vladimir Guerrero
                          Tommy Henrich
                          Bill Nicholson
                          Tony Oliva
                          Paul O'Neill
                          Dave Parker
                          Tim Salmon
                          Gary Sheffield
                          Reggie Smith
                          Sammy Sosa
                          Rusty Staub
                          Darryl Strawberry
                          Mike Tiernan
                          Dixie Walker
                          Larry Walker
                          Last edited by Jar of Flies; 05-07-2017, 04:17 PM.
                          Jacquelyn Eva Marchand (1983-2017)
                          http://www.tezakfuneralhome.com/noti...uelyn-Marchand

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Chadwick, no love for Grantland Rice? I think between his newspaper and radio work, he did more for the game than a lot of guys on your list.
                            "If on-base percentage is so important, then why don't they put it on the scoreboard?" -Jeff Francoeur"

                            Play the Who am I? game in trivia and you can make this signature line yours for three days (baseball signatures only!)


                            Go here for all your 1920's/1930's OF info

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Cool idea. I'll try to post something when I get a chance. Just a heads up: the earliest era of baseball does not have a 10 year limit for eligibility. Ross Barnes, Cal McVey and several other players were considered for the final ballot the last go around for the VC voting and there is a precedent for the HOF making an exemption in Addie Joss.
                              Last edited by jjpm74; 04-21-2017, 12:19 PM.

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