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Best Season by a Bad Player?

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  • #16
    Richard Hidalgo or Preston Wilson.
    My top 10 players:

    1. Babe Ruth
    2. Barry Bonds
    3. Ty Cobb
    4. Ted Williams
    5. Willie Mays
    6. Alex Rodriguez
    7. Hank Aaron
    8. Honus Wagner
    9. Lou Gehrig
    10. Mickey Mantle

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    • #17
      Esteban Loaiza 2003.

      20 - 9 2.90 ERA 226 IP, led the league with 207 K's

      159 ERA+. Did not have another full season ERA+ above 111
      Only had one other season with more than 150 K's

      7 of 31 career fWAR cam in 2003.

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      • #18
        Also Derick Turnbow 2005

        7-1, 1.74 ERA, 39 saves in 67 innings.

        Rest of his career:
        10-15, 5.20 ERA, 26 saves in 190 innings

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        • #19
          Originally posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
          .330 19 HR at home
          .245 11 HR on the road

          typical Fenway Park inflation

          Why is this surprising?
          You caused that season to shock me again. He actually hit 11 on the road?

          I think his previous high for a season was 11 for the whole season (albeit his only real previous season as a regular)

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          • #20
            Jose Lima- I remember he had that great season with the Astros, and spent most of the rest of his career being not bad, but horrible.

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            • #21
              79 Dave Kingman for once he was really good
              This week's Giant

              #5 in games played as a Giant with 1721 , Bill Terry

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              • #22
                Originally posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
                Zoilo Versalles in 1965 - His OPS+ that year was only 116, so he wasn't really amazing, but he won the MVP and his career totals are rather...bad.

                1965 Zoilo Versalles
                American League MVP. Gold Glove SS.
                Led Position Players in WAR, Offensive WAR, and Defensive WAR!
                Led league in runs (126), Total bases (308), Doubles (45), 3B (12), Extra Base Hits (76) and Power-Speed Number. Hit 19 HR from leadoff position. Second in Hits, Sac Flies, SB%. Third in SB (27) and runs created. Grounded into just 7 DP in 728 PA and 666 AB. Participated in 105 defensive double plays.

                he actually had a pretty good run from 1961-65
                thanks Roy for pointing about the weakness of OPS+ Zoilo had a huge season in 65 and deserved the MVP.
                This week's Giant

                #5 in games played as a Giant with 1721 , Bill Terry

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by JR Hart View Post
                  thanks Roy for pointing about the weakness of OPS+ Zoilo had a huge season in 65 and deserved the MVP.
                  I agree that Versalles had a stellar year in '65, but isn't a 116 OPS+ pretty good for a SS? I am no expert on that stat, but I thought it was pretty good for a SS (non-PED slugger, anyway) to have an OPS+ like that. I might be wrong.
                  "It ain't braggin' if you can do it." Dizzy Dean

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Herr28 View Post
                    I agree that Versalles had a stellar year in '65, but isn't a 116 OPS+ pretty good for a SS? I am no expert on that stat, but I thought it was pretty good for a SS (non-PED slugger, anyway) to have an OPS+ like that. I might be wrong.
                    I agree, especially back in that era.

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                    • #25
                      It's pretty good for a typical SS but obviously not even close to being good enough for a great SS.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Ubiquitous View Post
                        It's pretty good for a typical SS but obviously not even close to being good enough for a great SS.
                        Most hall of fame shortstops have a career OPS+ that's not as good as Zoilo's was in 1965.

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                        • #27
                          How about Kevin Maas 1990?
                          "If I drink whiskey, I'll never get worms!" - Hack Wilson

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                          • #28
                            This isn't a perfect example, because Ron Bryant had a better 1972 season than I had realized, but his 1973 season always stood out to this fan. Afterwards, he had a horrid 1974 and then fell off the Giants' roster and was out of the game by mid-1975.

                            Bryant was 24-12, 3.53 ERA, 270 IP, 8 CGs, and finished 3rd in the Cy Young voting in 1973. Only 1972 provided any clue, with 11 CGs and 14-7 W/L, but his other seasons were awful. Career, 57-56, 4.02, 917 IP, 23 CGs and no statistical measure which would hint at what he did in this year and a half. Again, it is not a perfect example because this occurred over a year and a half.

                            Because he was pitching on the West Coast, I suppose I never had the details of his demise. Injuries must have been the problem, but I have no idea how.

                            http://www.baseball-reference.com/pl...ryanro01.shtml
                            Catfish Hunter, RIP. Mark Fidrych, RIP. Skip Caray, RIP. Tony Gwynn, #19, RIP

                            A fanatic is someone who can't change his mind and won't change the subject. -- Winston Churchill. (Please take note that I've recently become aware of how this quote applies to a certain US president. This is a coincidence, and the quote was first added to this signature too far back to remember when).

                            Experience is the hardest teacher. She gives the test first and the lesson later. -- Dan Quisenberry.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by SavoyBG View Post
                              Most hall of fame shortstops have a career OPS+ that's not as good as Zoilo's was in 1965.


                              Luke Appling had 7 full seasons over 115.
                              Cal Ripken had 6 full seasons over 115 with another season at 115.
                              Joe Sewell had 3 season over 115.
                              Bobby Wallace had 6 seasons
                              Travis Jackson had 3 seasons
                              Dave Bancroft had 3 seasons
                              Joe Tinker had 2 seasons
                              Phil Rizzuto had 1 season


                              But your statement begs the question. A Hall of Fame plaque does not necessarily mean a player is great.

                              Comment

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