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Sorry to bring up southpaws again, but I finally wrapped up evaluating every one's ca

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  • Sorry to bring up southpaws again, but I finally wrapped up evaluating every one's ca

    NOTE: The title should read "Sorry to bring up southpaws again, but I finally wrapped up evaluating every one's career since 1900 "


    In the end, 232 scored a 50 or better using my evaluation formula. My ultimate goal now is to track down an autograph of as many of them as possible. If I get within 20 or so, I'll consider it a huge success! The (flawed) formula I used took 2 years of on and off tweaking and can be found here (the 10th post down). In the end, I'm pretty happy with how everyone stacked up.

    The List (active players in bold):

    #1 Randy Johnson 1,820.591
    #2 Lefty Grove 1,652.649
    #3 Warren Spahn 1,608.774
    #4 Sandy Koufax 1,577.672
    #5 Steve Carlton 1,517.759
    #6 Eddie Plank 1,458.759
    #7 Carl Hubbell 1,390.582
    #8 Rube Waddell 1,219.266
    #9 Whitey Ford 1,087.238
    #10 Hal Newhouser 1,003.541
    #11 Doc White 836.997
    #12 Noodles Hahn 820.907
    #13 Lefty Gomez 802.258
    #14 Ron Guidry 767.595
    #15 Hippo Vaughn 739.603
    #16 Wilbur Cooper 728.105
    #17 Jesse Tannehill 711.082
    #18 Herb Pennock 638.316
    #19 Nap Rucker 631.724
    #20 Rube Marquard 614.991
    #21 Tom Glavine 610.668
    #22 Eppa Rixey 610.619
    #23 Tommy John 605.588
    #24 Mickey Lolich 595.394
    #25 Jim Kaat 586.184
    #26 Vida Blue 570.198
    #27 David Wells 567.363
    #28 Billy Pierce 545.851
    #29 Dutch Leonard 519.350
    #30 Mike Cuellar 492.150
    #31 Frank Tanana 483.448
    #32 Dave McNally 475.480
    #33 Slim Sallee 465.943
    #34 Fernando Valenzuela 455.906
    #35 Jack Pfiester 443.013
    #36 Wilbur Wood 433.068
    #37 Babe Ruth 432.528
    #38 Sam McDowell 430.447
    #39 Jerry Koosman 430.129
    #40 Hooks Wiltse 414.102
    #41 Andy Pettitte 388.848
    #42 Harry Brecheen 383.025
    #43 Case Patten 379.792
    #44 Art Nehf 374.489
    #45 Reb Russell 372.126
    #46 Jimmy Key 371.788
    #47 Jake Weimer 370.427
    #48 Jerry Reuss 344.231
    #49 Ed Lopat 337.251
    #50 Gary Peters 337.206
    #51 Frank Viola 333.342
    #52 John Candelaria 332.506
    #53 Johnny Antonelli 331.710
    #54 Jon Matlack 326.406
    #55 Larry French 324.208
    #56 Bobby Shantz 319.326
    #57 John Tudor 317.148
    #58 Claude Osteen 310.163
    #59 Jamie Moyer 294.543
    #60 Mark Langston 291.489
    #61 Ed Killian 290.740
    #62 Randy Jones 286.129
    #63 Harvey Haddix 285.074
    #64 Curt Simmons 283.761
    #65 Lefty Tyler 277.643
    #66 Johan Santana 275.405
    #67 Preacher Roe 275.325
    #68 Sid Fernandez 270.544
    #69 Ken Holtzman 269.344
    #70 Fritz Peterson 267.645
    #71 Teddy Higuera 267.008
    #72 Nick Altrock 259.315
    #73 Lefty Leifield 253.930
    #74 Mike Caldwell 251.584
    #75 Ray Collins 249.930
    #76 Harry Coveleski 247.870
    #77 Chuck Finley 246.638
    #78 Ed Siever 245.268
    #79 Ken Raffensberger 245.068
    #80 Thornton Lee 243.082
    #81 Vean Gregg 242.858
    #82 Johnny Podres 242.099
    #83 Johnny Vander Meer 242.029
    #84 John Franco 238.770
    #85 Howie Pollet 236.526
    #86 Irv Young 236.157
    #87 Barry Zito 234.858
    #88 Mel Parnell 234.693
    #89 Mark Mulder 230.015
    #90 Mark Buehrle 228.460
    #91 Kenny Rogers 219.033
    #92 George Mogridge 215.013
    #93 Dutch Ruether 214.129
    #94 Bruce Hurst 213.989
    #95 Al Downing 213.840
    #96 Chris Short 211.304
    #97 Randy Myers 204.855
    #98 Al Leiter 204.571
    #99 Carl Weilman 198.869
    #100 Rudy May 198.670
    #101 Mike Flanagan 196.148
    #102 Tom Zachary 193.463
    #103 Earl Whitehill 191.198
    #104 Rube Benton 191.181
    #105 Bob Knepper 189.623
    #106 Greg Swindell 187.311
    #107 Max Lanier 185.608
    #108 Danny Jackson 184.032
    #109 Dave Righetti 182.810
    #110 Bob Veale 182.223
    #111 Scott McGregor 181.174
    #112 John Smiley 179.665
    #113 Don Gullett 177.240
    #114 Bill Sherdel 174.446
    #115 Lefty Williams 170.310
    #116 Dick Ellsworth 168.729
    #117 Charlie Leibrandt 164.678
    #118 Juan Pizarro 159.952
    #119 Sparky Lyle 156.280
    #120 Bob Ojeda 155.250
    #121 Sherry Smith 155.214
    #122 Denny Neagle 153.293
    #123 Ed Brandt 153.062
    #124 Larry Gura 152.171
    #125 Mike McCormick 152.105
    #126 Willie Hernandez 149.757
    #127 Bill Hallahan 146.490
    #128 Don Mossi 145.790
    #129 Dave Roberts 145.451
    #130 Jim Merritt 145.253
    #131 Watty Clark 145.223
    #132 Ed Karger 143.580
    #133 Dontrelle Willis 143.005
    #134 Mike Hampton 142.895
    #135 Herb Score 142.080
    #136 Hank Aguirre 141.595
    #137 Ross Grimsley 139.177
    #138 Nick Cullop 137.820
    #139 Tom Browning 134.438
    #140 Bill Walker 133.225
    #141 Willie Mitchell 132.190
    #142 Rube Walberg 127.568
    #143 Billy Wagner 127.350
    #144 Gene Packard 127.065
    #145 Terry Mulholland 126.684
    #146 Ferdie Schupp 124.795
    #147 Johnny Lush 122.868
    #148 Billy O'Dell 120.131
    #149 Floyd Bannister 118.988
    #150 Pete Richert 116.954
    #151 Lefty Stewart 116.275
    #152 Jesse Orosco 114.321
    #153 Jim O'Toole 113.786
    #154 Rick Honeycutt 113.410
    #155 Joe Nuxhall 111.729
    #156 Ray Sadecki 109.739
    #157 Steve Barber 109.376
    #158 Harry Krause 106.540
    #159 Earl Hamilton 103.954
    #160 Joe Page 103.440
    #161 Ron Perranoski 103.397
    #162 Cliff Melton 102.390
    #163 Tug McGraw 102.204
    #164 John Hiller 101.095
    #165 Johnny Schmitz 100.882
    #166 Garland Braxton 99.800
    #167 Otto Hess 98.525
    #168 Jeff Fassero 97.894
    #169 Jim Brewer 97.702
    #170 Bud Black 97.339
    #171 Billy Hoeft 95.993
    #172 Dan Plesac 95.813
    #173 Bill Lee 95.265
    #174 Clyde Wright 94.817
    #175 Paul Splittorff 94.386
    #176 Gene Bearden 93.925
    #177 Fred Norman 91.067
    #178 Steve Avery 90.267
    #179 Woodie Fryman 88.619
    #180 Patsy Flaherty 88.477
    #181 Jesse Petty 88.455
    #182 Geoff Zahn 85.088
    #183 Atlee Hammaker 83.852
    #184 Doug Rau 83.483
    #185 Britt Burns 82.291
    #186 Clarence Mitchell 81.005
    #187 Zane Smith 79.531
    #188 Hank Robinson 78.625
    #189 Fritz Ostermueller 78.474
    #190 Mark Davis 77.551
    #191 Jarrod Washburn 75.433
    #192 Pete Schourek 74.683
    #193 Dave Dravecky 74.337
    #194 Al Smith 73.685
    #195 Jack Harshman 73.103
    #196 Kirk Rueter 72.865
    #197 Eric Milton 71.197
    #198 Odalis Perez 68.290
    #199 Mitch Williams 67.230
    #200 Jack Kralick 66.905
    #201 Ernie White 66.070
    #202 Eddie Guardado 65.600
    #203 Wilson Alvarez 65.474
    #204 Jumbo Elliott 65.002
    #205 Ron Bryant 64.860
    #206 Joe Magrane 63.607
    #207 George Brunet 63.129
    #208 Shawn Estes 61.989
    #209 Joe Shaute 61.895
    #210 Jim Abbott 61.530
    #211 Jim Rooker 61.021
    #212 Dave LaRoche 60.548
    #213 Mike Stanton 60.530
    #214 Tommy Byrne 59.730
    #215 Dave Koslo 59.518
    #216 Dickie Kerr 59.490
    #217 Terry Forster 58.974
    #218 Ed Doheny 58.937
    #219 Frank Allen 58.695
    #220 Dennis Rasmussen 58.462
    #221 Al Brazle 58.242
    #222 Randy Wolf 58.022
    #223 Allan Anderson 57.050
    #224 Harry Harper 56.780
    #225 C.C. Sabathia 56.560
    #226 Gary LaVelle 56.473
    #227 Emil Yde 56.035
    #228 Clyde Shoun 55.718
    #229 Denny LeMaster 55.112
    #230 Darold Knowles 54.065
    #231 Sterling Hitchc.ock 53.989
    #232 Doc Newton 52.277
    #233 Brian Anderson 51.462
    #234 Craig Lefferts 50.434

    NOTE: 2 active pitchers, Rheal Cormier and Cliff Lee are on the cusp of joining this list:

    Rheal Cormier 49.872
    Cliff Lee 41.515

    The autographs I already have can be found under here.

    Thanks for letting me rejoice!
    Last edited by cjedmonton; 02-16-2006, 11:16 AM.

  • #2
    My fellow Wright State alum Brian Anderson is out of baseball?

    Nice work, as always.
    Dave Bill Tom George Mark Bob Ernie Soupy Dick Alex Sparky
    Joe Gary MCA Emanuel Sonny Dave Earl Stan
    Jonathan Neil Roger Anthony Ray Thomas Art Don
    Gates Philip John Warrior Rik Casey Tony Horace
    Robin Bill Ernie JEDI

    Comment


    • #3
      Good eye. Thanks for the correction.

      Comment


      • #4
        I used to love going to your site until the rankings were so top-heavy with Saber stats that completely riduculous results were occuring. Any system which ranks Doc White and Nap Rucker ahead of Tom Glavine and Noodles Hahn ahead of Lefty Gomez, and Dutch Lenard on par with Billy Pierce is no longer credible. I mean, common sense can't be completely thrown out when ranking players.

        Putting too much value on how success is reached undermindes the fact that it was achieved.

        Did you factor in total bases allowed per 9 (something Glavine is very good at?)

        HBP per 9? (something Glavine is very good at)

        WP per 9?

        BAA w/ RISP

        K ratio w/ RISP (All Glavine specialties)

        Defensive and offesnive abilities of each pitcher?

        Double Plays induced per 9?

        Ability to hold runners? (Again, all things Tom Glavine excells in.)

        There are so many ways to prevent runs from scoring. Certainly more than just having a lot of K's or a microscopic WHIP. Glavine's exceptional HR/9 and 2B/9 rates have saved tons of bases and runs in which a pitcher with a lower WHIP but more homeruns does not save.

        If Tom Glavine is the 21st best left-handed pitcher of all-time, than John Tudor must be in the little leagues. Please rejoin the world of common sense and leave the world of extreme-saber metrics behind!
        1885 1886 1926 1931 1934 1942 1944 1946 1964 1967 1982 2006 2011

        1887 1888 1928 1930 1943 1968 1985 1987 2004 2013

        1996 2000 2001 2002 2005 2009 2012 2014 2015


        The Top 100 Pitchers In MLB History
        The Top 100 Position Players In MLB History

        Comment


        • #5
          Well, as I mentioned before, this was just a fun project for me to tinker around with. You could ask 100 different people to rank their top 25 lefties (let alone the top 234), and you'd likely get 100 different responses. Keep in mind that this is just my take, no one else's. Are some of my categories too heavily weighted, leading to a few surprising results? Perhaps. However, I stand by my observation that very few of these folks are outrageously over/underranked.

          If you feel Mr. Glavine's current ranking is too low, I encourage you to come up with your own criteria to see how he fares against history's best lefties. Keep in mind, though, that his career is not over yet. If (when) he is enshrined in Cooperstown, I suspect he'll end up somewhere around #13-15th. Not too shabby at all.

          Now, I readily admit that I am the farthest thing from a sabermetrician you can find. However, I wanted to come up with a more sophisticated formula that simply using wins/innings/strikeouts as a barometer of success (I'm exaggerating). Furthermore, I'm hardly entertaining the possibility of publishing my "findings". Again, it was just a fun way for me to enjoy the history of this much underappreciated type of ballplayer.

          I also have to say that my evaluation criteria is as un-sabermetric as possible. All of the advanced stats you mentioned are nowhere to be found, I agree. I don't have the experience, time, or inclination to delve into that. Besides, that wasn't the intent of this project.

          The bottom line is that every player's career since 1900 was run through the same formula. The results are what they are, not gospel...and certainly not something worth questioning my ability to use common sense;-)

          As far as not enjoying my site anymore, I'm very sorry to hear that. However, there is much, much more to my site than just these rankings. In fact, I'd go as far to say that 90% of the content is not rankings related. There are quotes/videos/career achievements, stats leaders, my southpaw autograph collection, All-Stars, draft picks, etc... Anyway, I do hope you visit again someday. I've had a ball putting it together. Thanks.

          Chris

          Southpaw Legacy
          Last edited by cjedmonton; 02-16-2006, 11:14 AM.

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