Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

2019 BBF Top 100 Position Players of All Time #36-40

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • 2019 BBF Top 100 Position Players of All Time #36-40

    1. Babe Ruth
    2. Willie Mays
    3. Ty Cobb
    4. Barry Bonds
    5. Honus Wagner
    6. Ted Williams
    7. Hank Aaron
    8. Stan Musial
    9. Rogers Hornsby
    10. Tris Speaker
    11. Lou Gehrig
    12. Mickey Mantle
    13. Alex Rodriguez
    14. Joe DiMaggio
    15. Mike Schmidt
    16. Albert Pujols
    17. Eddie Collins
    18. Frank Robinson
    19. Rickey Henderson
    20. Oscar Charleston
    21. Jimmie Foxx
    22. Mel Ott
    23. Nap Lajoie
    24. Eddie Mathews
    25. Johnny Bench
    26. Joe Morgan
    27. Josh Gibson
    28. Ken Griffey Jr.
    29. Mike Piazza
    30. Jackie Robinson
    31. George Brett - 52
    32. Roberto Clemente - 48
    33. Cal Ripken Jr. - 42
    34. Cap Anson - 32
    35. Mike Trout - 28


    Others
    Delahanty - 16
    Brouthers - 11
    Chipper - 11
    Yaz - 7
    Berra - 7
    Mize - 6
    Lloyd - 6
    Thome - 5
    Kaline - 4
    Vaughan - 4
    Bagwell - 2
    Keeler - 2
    Hamilton - 2
    Carter - 2
    Beltre - 2
    Leonard - 2
    McCovey - 1
    Sosa - 1
    Manny - 1
    Ivan R. 1
    Walker- 1

    --------------------------------------

    Kaline - 5
    Mize - 4
    Vauhgan - 3
    Yaz - 2
    Berra - 1
    1885 1886 1926 1931 1934 1942 1944 1946 1964 1967 1982 2006 2011

    1887 1888 1928 1930 1943 1968 1985 1987 2004 2013

    1996 2000 2001 2002 2005 2009 2012 2014 2015


    The Top 100 Pitchers In MLB History
    The Top 100 Position Players In MLB History

  • #2
    1. Jim Thome
    2. Sammy Sosa
    3. Ed Delahanty
    4. Dan Brouthers
    5. Chipper Jones

    Comment


    • #3
      1. Chipper Jones
      2. Al Kaline
      3. Jeff Bagwell
      4. Carl Yastrzemski
      5. Johnny Mize

      Comment


      • #4
        1. Wade Boggs
        2. Carl Yastrzemski
        3. Gary Carter
        4. Pop Lloyd
        5. Jeff Bagwell
        "It is a simple matter to erect a Hall of Fame, but difficult to select the tenants." -- Ken Smith
        "I am led to suspect that some of the electorate is very dumb." -- Henry P. Edwards
        "You have a Hall of Fame to put people in, not keep people out." -- Brian Kenny
        "There's no such thing as a perfect ballot." -- Jay Jaffe

        Comment


        • #5
          1. Ed Delahanty
          2. Dan Brouthers
          3. Al Kaline
          4. Carl Yastrzemski
          5. Yogi Berra

          Comment


          • #6
            Yogi Berra
            Al Kaline
            Carl Yastrzemski
            Charlie Gehringer
            Reggie Jackson


            Coming up- Carew, Mize, Rose

            Comment


            • #7
              Dan Brouthers
              Billy Hamilton
              Chipper Jones
              Ed Delahanty
              Charlie Gehringer

              Comment


              • #8
                Brouthers
                Delahanty
                Yaz
                Manny
                Gehringer
                This week's Giant

                #5 in games played as a Giant with 1721 , Bill Terry

                Comment


                • #9
                  1. Yaz
                  2. Chipper Jones
                  3. Al Kaline
                  4. Brouthers
                  5. Wade Boggs

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    1. John Henry Lloyd
                    2. Pudge Rodriguez
                    3. Carl Yastrzemski
                    4. Miguel Cabrera
                    5. Ernie Banks

                    Originally posted by John Shoemaker View Post
                    1. Jim Thome
                    2. Sammy Sosa
                    3. Ed Delahanty
                    4. Dan Brouthers
                    5. Chipper Jones
                    I have Sosa 23rd all-time all stats at face value. But won't vote for him because:

                    1. Even the folks that don't care about PED's won't give him respect
                    2. Most here are accounting for PED's.
                    3. His WAR isn't high enough for that crowd even though he hit 60+ HR 3/4 seasons and averaged .289/49/127 from '95-03 and from '98-02 he averaged .306/58/141. Not sure what you have to do to get some WAR. I guess play in the 1930's?
                    4. I refuse to vote for him any lower than the top 30.
                    Last edited by bluesky5; 10-12-2019, 09:56 AM.
                    "No matter how great you were once upon a time — the years go by, and men forget,” - W. A. Phelon in Baseball Magazine in 1915. “Ross Barnes, forty years ago, was as great as Cobb or Wagner ever dared to be. Had scores been kept then as now, he would have seemed incomparably marvelous.”

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Savoy's ballot:

                      1. Berra
                      2. Delahanty
                      3. Vaughan
                      4. Joe Jackson
                      5. Pop Lloyd
                      1885 1886 1926 1931 1934 1942 1944 1946 1964 1967 1982 2006 2011

                      1887 1888 1928 1930 1943 1968 1985 1987 2004 2013

                      1996 2000 2001 2002 2005 2009 2012 2014 2015


                      The Top 100 Pitchers In MLB History
                      The Top 100 Position Players In MLB History

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Adrian Beltre
                        Larry Walker
                        Wade Boggs
                        Chipper Jones
                        Charlie Gehringer
                        My top 10 players:

                        1. Babe Ruth
                        2. Barry Bonds
                        3. Ty Cobb
                        4. Ted Williams
                        5. Willie Mays
                        6. Alex Rodriguez
                        7. Hank Aaron
                        8. Honus Wagner
                        9. Lou Gehrig
                        10. Mickey Mantle

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Bothrops Atrox View Post

                          Kaline - 5
                          Mize - 4
                          Vauhgan - 3
                          Yaz - 2
                          Berra - 1
                          What get's Yaz and Kaline over Beltre for you? Is his clutch bad?


                          I'm thinking of putting Carter over Berra on my catchers list. If his early framing is on arc with his latter then he was probably a defensive "ace", maybe the best fielding catcher ever, and possibly the most important defensive player of all time which could have made him a borderline HOFer with an 85 OPS+, but he was a middle of the lineup guy on some good offenses.

                          Also, maybe it's down the line but I have noticed that Reese comes out to about 80 WAR and 40 WAA with interpolated war credit. Somewhat surprising, but still, 80 war guys should typically crack the top 50 list. Reese with war credit virtually matches Gehringer in WAR and WAA playing into an well integrated league. Looks like basically the product of on-base percentage, defense and baserunning so maybe there is doubt about the defense or baserunning making up so much of his value. Appling probably cracks 50 WAA and 85 WAR with war credit too-nearly 90 WAR.
                          Last edited by brett; 10-13-2019, 07:57 AM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by bluesky5 View Post
                            1. John Henry Lloyd
                            2. Pudge Rodriguez
                            3. Carl Yastrzemski
                            4. Miguel Cabrera
                            5. Ernie Banks



                            I have Sosa 23rd all-time all stats at face value. But won't vote for him because:

                            1. Even the folks that don't care about PED's won't give him respect
                            2. Most here are accounting for PED's.
                            3. His WAR isn't high enough for that crowd even though he hit 60+ HR 3/4 seasons and averaged .289/49/127 from '95-03 and from '98-02 he averaged .306/58/141. Not sure what you have to do to get some WAR. I guess play in the 1930's?
                            4. I refuse to vote for him any lower than the top 30.
                            Even at face value, Sosa is nowhere near the top 30. It has nothing to do with PEDs. Frank Thomas (also not top 30) for instance had a career of the same length and a 28 point OPS+ advantage.
                            Last edited by willshad; 10-13-2019, 08:44 AM.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by brett View Post

                              What get's Yaz and Kaline over Beltre for you? Is his clutch bad?


                              I'm thinking of putting Carter over Berra on my catchers list. If his early framing is on arc with his latter then he was probably a defensive "ace", maybe the best fielding catcher ever, and possibly the most important defensive player of all time which could have made him a borderline HOFer with an 85 OPS+, but he was a middle of the lineup guy on some good offenses.

                              Also, maybe it's down the line but I have noticed that Reese comes out to about 80 WAR and 40 WAA with interpolated war credit. Somewhat surprising, but still, 80 war guys should typically crack the top 50 list. Reese with war credit virtually matches Gehringer in WAR and WAA playing into an well integrated league. Looks like basically the product of on-base percentage, defense and baserunning so maybe there is doubt about the defense or baserunning making up so much of his value. Appling probably cracks 50 WAA and 85 WAR with war credit too-nearly 90 WAR.
                              I've been calculating WAA and War for some pre-1950 players who were likely to get a boost from non-regressed fielding (DRA) and baserunning.
                              I got the idea after finding out how easy it was to manually calculate Joe DiMaggio's projected WAA and War. Maybe Bothrops helped get the wheels turning as well with our discussion in the Parc-D thread.

                              Appling and Reese both benefited a good deal, but so did some others.


                              My results so far, in Waa/War:

                              Gehringer- 47/80
                              BBRef- 46/81

                              Clarke- 46/79
                              BBRef- 35/68

                              Appling- 45/78
                              BBRef- 41/75

                              Frisch- 46/77
                              BBRef- 39/70

                              Waner- 43/77
                              BBRef- 39/73

                              Reese- 33/67
                              BBRef- 32/66

                              Keeler- 26/61
                              BBRef- 21/54

                              For fielding I used a combination of DRA & TZ.

                              For baserunning I looked at BBProspectus and Sean Smith's Baseball Projection.
                              I also took Tom Thress' fielding and baserunning stats into consideration.

                              I should note that this is total WAA listed, which includes negative WAA seasons. I typically throw out those negative WAA seasons when judging a player.


                              Gehringer comes out on top
                              Clarke rockets up my top 100 thanks to a massive boost in both fielding and baserunning value
                              Appling looks great, but it should be pointed out his best year was at age 36 in a weakened AL, though it would get weaker the next two years
                              DRA gives Frisch almost 300 fielding runs, but I felt uncomfortable giving him more than 180. Maybe he deserves over 200, or maybe he benefited from a ground ball staff that increased his chances in a big way. He very well could be a 80 War player.
                              Reese with war credit is indeed an arguable top 50 player
                              Keeler goes from a borderline HOF'er to clearly in.
                              Last edited by layson27; 10-13-2019, 11:28 AM.

                              Comment

                              Ad Widget

                              Collapse
                              Working...
                              X