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Pujols career .620 slugging%

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  • Pujols career .620 slugging%

    do you think it stays that high by the time he retires? he's only 27, and while he's had a great season every year since he's been in the league, he might soon reach his peak. most players reach their peaks around 27-30, and pujols could be one of them. then again maybe we've seen his best...and he just stays consistent for a long time, till he declines. anyone think he has a shot at retiring with a career slugging% over .600? that's obviously hard to do, mostly the oldtimers were the only ones to accomplish it, and bonds is there thanks to "flaxseed oil"lol...toss out bonds...and you've only got ruth, ballgame, gehrig, foxx, and greenberg. and greenberg's career was short...and foxx was helped a lot by his homepark.

  • #2
    I would bet against it though I wouldn't count him out.

    Thomas was above .600 and he's fallen to .561 and hasn't even hit 2300 games yet.

    Pujols has an advantage in that he had a better first 2 full years, so he didn't need to make up for as much to get past .600.

    The problem as I see it is that a guy can slug .630 for 10 years and then start slipping but he can still be very productive with a .520-.540 slugging for several more years. .630 for 10 and .540 for 6 is gonna be under .600.

    Next year might be the critial year. If he goes .590, not a chance, if he goes .650, he has a chance. If he has a total breakthrough season and goes .700 then yea.

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    • #3
      unless he retires early no.

      maybe if he has a few .700 seasons in the future though?

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      • #4
        Originally posted by blackout805 View Post
        unless he retires early no.

        maybe if he has a few .700 seasons in the future though?
        Only way that has a chance of happening is a Pujols for Holliday and Fuentes deal.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Sultan_1895-1948 View Post
          Only way that has a chance of happening is a Pujols for Holliday and Fuentes deal.
          why? he hit .671 a few years back and .667 once


          nobody who hasn't had a huge steroid cloud over their head (mcgwire, bonds, sosa) has slugged .700 since 1994 (larry walker doesn't count)


          if anyone in the game can do it its Pujols or maybe Howard.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by blackout805 View Post
            why? he hit .671 a few years back and .667 once


            nobody who hasn't had a huge steroid cloud over their head (mcgwire, bonds, sosa) has slugged .700 since 1994 (larry walker doesn't count)


            if anyone in the game can do it its Pujols or maybe Howard.
            Well Howard might as well be playing in Coors as far as I'm concerned. That park is a friekin' joke. Not great for batting average like Coors, because it's too short for that, but my God, 75% of high schools have about the same dimensions, and the school fields aren't built for the ball to carry like that abortion of a stadium.

            Pujols has had some great slugging years. He is gonna be 28 though. Most hitters are leveling out at this point and can only go down from here. He's a monster though. How do you think taking more walks would help his chances of increasing his SA?

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            • #7
              As much i like pujols (and he is my favourite active player) i dont see him maintaining his slugging average for the rest of his career, although through age 27 he's in touch with all those who DID hit .600 for their career.

              Code:
              Slugging % up to and inc aged 27
              Rank	Player	  	SLG	  	PA
              1.	Babe Ruth		0.696		3130
              2.	Ted Williams		0.647		3287
              3.	Jimmie Foxx		0.640		5239
              4.	Lou Gehrig		0.639		4024
              5.	Albert Pujols		0.620		4741
              6.	Hank Greenberg		0.616		3313
              7.	Johnny Mize		0.611		3035
              8.	Joe DiMaggio		0.607		4417
              9.	Frank Thomas		0.593		3491
              10.	Willie Mays		0.591		3981
              As you can see, only 7 other players in history have had a .600 SA at the same age, and of those only Foxx had more PA. So based on that he has a very good shot. Nobody has had a higher SA at this point and then NOT gone on to stay above .600 in their career.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Sultan_1895-1948 View Post
                Pujols has had some great slugging years. He is gonna be 28 though. Most hitters are leveling out at this point and can only go down from here. He's a monster though. How do you think taking more walks would help his chances of increasing his SA?
                Well, the walks would only help under the assumption that his raw numbers will decline. If he walks more as he declines, the lower seasonal numbers will have less weight than the previous higher ones. Like if you combine Ichiro and Adam Dunn's career BAs and take the overall average, it will be a lot closer to Ichiro's than Dunn's because Ichiro piles up so many more ABs.

                For most players, discipline could help SLG because it would improve their selectivity, and therefore they'd be swinging at better pitches. That's not a criticism that's partcularly applicable to Pujols. He seems to do just fine as far as hitting the ball with authority, and his walk rates are pretty high anyway - understandably so, he'd scare me if I was pitcher!

                People, in general, underappreciate how great and difficult it is to put up .600+ SLG numbers, let alone .700. .690, IMO, is Ruth's most impressive overall stat. It's staggering that an individual can slug .690 for a career. It's greater than the OPS+ over 200, IMO because you can't rationalize it by saying the league was weak, etc. .690 was just Ruth, independent of his comp, just going off on the record book.

                I've said it before, but Teddy Ballgame clocks in at (a distant) second, with a .634 (arguably mid .640s if he hadn't left for war the first time), ridiculously impressive in its own right. BUT, the difference between Ruth an Williams in raw terms is greater than the difference between Mickey Mantle and Scott effin Rolen! If that doesn't express Ruth's greatness, I don't know what does.
                Last edited by digglahhh; 03-21-2008, 07:55 AM.
                THE REVOLUTION WILL NOT COME WITH A SCORECARD

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                • #9
                  I would be extremely surprised if it was near that when he retires. He is good enough to have it near there, but not that high. Where he ranks in the list of all time slugging % is interesting, and impressive.
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                  • #10
                    the only way he will end up over .600 for his career would be to retire before age 30. Players like Pujols, besides the steroids guys, start to show serious decline and/or injuries entering their 30s. He wil probably end up with about the same career stats as Frank Thomas, minus all the walks.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by digglahhh View Post
                      For most players, discipline could help SLG because it would improve their selectivity, and therefore they'd be swinging at better pitches. That's not a criticism that's partcularly applicable to Pujols. He seems to do just fine as far as hitting the ball with authority, and his walk rates are pretty high anyway - understandably so, he'd scare me if I was pitcher!
                      That's kinda what I was gettin' at. The odds of hitting the ball with authority would increase, therefore increasing the chances of extra base hits in his AB. In terms of being scary, Pujols should be a 120 BB a year guy, probably 140 if he was a lefty.

                      People, in general, underappreciate how great and difficult it is to put up .600+ SLG numbers, let alone .700. .690, IMO, is Ruth's most impressive overall stat. It's staggering that an individual can slug .690 for a career. It's greater than the OPS+ over 200, IMO because you can't rationalize it by saying the league was weak, etc. .690 was just Ruth, independent of his comp, just going off on the record book.

                      I've said it before, but Teddy Ballgame clocks in at (a distant) second, with a .634 (arguably mid .640s if he hadn't left for war the first time), ridiculously impressive in its own right. BUT, the difference between Ruth an Williams in raw terms is greater than the difference between Mickey Mantle and Scott effin Rolen! If that doesn't express Ruth's greatness, I don't know what does.
                      I agree whole-heartedly. And think, it would be .700 if you went from 1918-1935...it would be .705 if you went from 1919-1935...and it would be .708 if you counted 1920-1935. If you started in 1920 and someone had convinced him to retire after 1933, you're looking at a .720 career SA. Pretty filthy.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Sultan_1895-1948 View Post
                        I agree whole-heartedly. And think, it would be .700 if you went from 1918-1935...it would be .705 if you went from 1919-1935...and it would be .708 if you counted 1920-1935. If you started in 1920 and someone had convinced him to retire after 1933, you're looking at a .720 career SA. Pretty filthy.
                        Here's another way to look at Ruth's .690. I'm a big Sadaharu Oh fan. In his career he hit 868 HRs ,drew 2,390 walks, slugged over .700 NINE TIMES, had thirteen 40+ HR seasons (playing 120-140 game seasons), had 16 100 walk seasons, and played in a lower quality professional league. Yet, even Oh ended up with only a career .634 slugging percentage. Ruth's .690 is just insane!
                        Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by bob View Post
                          As much i like pujols (and he is my favourite active player) i dont see him maintaining his slugging average for the rest of his career, although through age 27 he's in touch with all those who DID hit .600 for their career.

                          Code:
                          Slugging % up to and inc aged 27
                          Rank	Player	  	SLG	  	PA
                          1.	Babe Ruth		0.696		3130
                          2.	Ted Williams		0.647		3287
                          3.	Jimmie Foxx		0.640		5239
                          4.	Lou Gehrig		0.639		4024
                          5.	Albert Pujols		0.620		4741
                          6.	Hank Greenberg		0.616		3313
                          7.	Johnny Mize		0.611		3035
                          8.	Joe DiMaggio		0.607		4417
                          9.	Frank Thomas		0.593		3491
                          10.	Willie Mays		0.591		3981
                          As you can see, only 7 other players in history have had a .600 SA at the same age, and of those only Foxx had more PA. So based on that he has a very good shot. Nobody has had a higher SA at this point and then NOT gone on to stay above .600 in their career.
                          Is not Todd Helton on that list?

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by willshad View Post
                            the only way he will end up over .600 for his career would be to retire before age 30. Players like Pujols, besides the steroids guys, start to show serious decline and/or injuries entering their 30s. He wil probably end up with about the same career stats as Frank Thomas, minus all the walks.
                            its very odd pujols hasnt had a 100 walk season

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by willshad View Post
                              the only way he will end up over .600 for his career would be to retire before age 30. Players like Pujols, besides the steroids guys, start to show serious decline and/or injuries entering their 30s. He wil probably end up with about the same career stats as Frank Thomas, minus all the walks.
                              Considering he is 28 years old, I think he may keep it until he retires aged 35. I have calculated this, and this is my findings.
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