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Whats the overall hitter approach over there? Whats the K ratio? Do they attempt a lot of steaks?
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There's been some interesting discussion on Japanese hitting mechanics. Some people believe Japanese hitting mechanics are inferior because supposedly it limits a player's ability to hit for BA and power. I am no hitting expert by any means so I'll just post and you decide. Actually, I'd love to hear your take on these links, Randy.Originally posted by Sultan_1895-1948 View Post
http://www.baseball-fever.com/showth...ach-to-hitting
http://rhm001.blogspot.com/2014/04/t...f-hitting.html
https://torque-hitting.com/tag/hitting-torque/
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/09/sp...hass.html?_r=0Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash DavisComment
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I just read an article that mentioned that Ruth was on his way to challenging the HR record in 1930 until he got injured. Does anybody know what happened to Babe in 1930? Just for fun, I looked up his stats that year. It appears that he got hurt on 7/5/1930 since he only had 2 PA that game in a tight 3-2 loss. He then missed the next 7 days and 5 games.
Through 73 games, Babe played in all of them and had scored 94 runs, had 32 HRS, 84 RBI with a line of .373/.517/.837. That includes his 0-2 game in which he allegedly was injured.
I'm curious about the actual extent to how much this injury actually affected Ruth that year. The stats that he had up until the point were incredible. Up until the alleged injury, he was on pace for 198 runs scored, 68 HRS, and 177 RBI over 154 gamesComment
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That article appears to downplay how serious that knee injury was. Obviously being so young at the time, helped the healing.Originally posted by elmer View Post
In fact, I have some old newspaper articles where Harry Frazee pointed out that knee injury as one of the reasons for shipping off the Babe.
Harry stated he didn't see a long career for the Bam, not with that knee injured.
He had to sooth some of Bosox fans, some irate that it was good move for the team.
Bad knee and oh yes, he was hurting the team. They didn't need a one man team.
In that season, Babe led "both" leagues in so many offensive stats and was 9-5 pitching.
What was Harry thinking, that message to some teams that might be interested in picking him up??????????????????
Kind of like selling a car and telling the potential buyers, it's got a bad transmission.Last edited by SHOELESSJOE3; 09-21-2016, 11:44 AM.Comment
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Ruth knocked out.jpg
On a sunny day on July 5th, 1924, the Yankees were in Griffith Stadium, playing a doubleheader against the Senators. In the fourth inning of the first game, before 24,000 fans, the home team’s Joe Judge swung his bat; the ball sailed just over the right-field line, heading toward the bleachers in foul territory.
Racing to make the catch, Babe Ruth slammed into a concrete wall and was knocked unconscious. He was already a national phenomenon, already the best-paid major league player there had ever been. As he lay unconscious on the field, the Yankees’ trainer, Doc Woods, rushed to him with a first-aid kit and poured icy water onto his face.
Ruth was out for five anxiety-producing minutes. The District of Columbia police (led by one Captain Doyle) kept the curious and concerned at bay. When the Babe finally opened his eyes, the Yankees’ manager, Miller Huggins, offered to take him out, but Ruth would not hear of it. Nowadays a player so injured would be taken to a hospital for neurological tests, but this was 1924. Ruth went back into the game, showing a conspicuous limp (he had damaged his left hip) as he recorded two more hits, drawing louder cheers than usual, for his fortitude, as he rounded the bases. He even kept playing through the second gameComment
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Frazee said lots of bad things about Ruth - "...one of the most selfish and inconsiderate men that ever wore a baseball uniform. Had he ... been willing to take orders and work for the good of the team, I would have never dared let him go." etc. etc.
But back then the major league owners were a pretty close-knit bunch. They probably understood that Frazee's comments were for damage control.Comment
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Got that but to say a player your trying to trade or sell off....................may not have a long career because of a serious leg injury.Originally posted by westsidegrounds View PostComment
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Frazee's quote about Babe ruth: “There is no getting away from the fact that despite his 29 home runs, the Red Sox finished sixth last year,” Frazee said. “What the Boston fans want, I take it, and what I want because they want it, is a winning team, rather than a one-man team that finishes in sixth place.” Frazee also called Ruth’s home runs “more spectacular than useful.”Comment
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Best Babe Ruth biopic ever!
By the way, has everybody seen the John Candy version of The Babe Ruth Story?
I can't get it to embed, sorry, cause I can't seem to get the url right.
But just go to youtube & search
Candy Ruth SCTV
It's well worth it.Comment
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Oh had only 25 career triples and didn't hit a ton of doubles. When he played, doubles and triples were fairly low for the league. I did an analysis once and estimated that Oh's OPS+ was about 190-195 in his league though it is a little hard to figure because of park effects. In '74 as an example, his OPS+ was 264 if we don't take out pitchers. I think they have a DH league and a non-DH league but I can't remember.Originally posted by Sultan_1895-1948 View Post
http://www.baseball-reference.com/re...d=oh----000sadComment
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1930 was interesting. He just signed that massive (for the times) contract of 80k, it was the first time exhibition gate profits would go to him as well, 50% I believe. Also, he was coming off miserable 1929 where he literally had a nervous breakdown, with Helen and Huggins passing. He was ready for a fresh start and like you pointed out, was killin' it.Originally posted by pheasant View Post
Jenkinson states that he tore off the fingernail of his ring finger trying to prevent a home run. That had to feel good. He also was as wreckless as ever in the field, making great plays and throws all season long, but shortly after the fingernail incident, he apparently tweaked his back pretty bad, colliding with catchers on more than one occasion. Of course he would play through anything and his numbers were bound to suffer.
Here's an excerpt from The Year Babe Ruth Hit 104 Home Runs
104.jpg
Babe couldn't keep up that homer pace all year, but he never stopped playing great baseball. He missed some time after tearing a fingernail from his left ring finger trying to prevent a home run. With the hand injury limiting his power, Ruth was held to six homers in July. The Yanks were ten games behind the Athletics and now trailed the Senators as well. But as the season swung into August, Babe was still going full throttle. He made another run of outstanding defensive plays early in the month and kept colliding with catchers at home plate. With all this, he wrenched his back, but still wouldn't quit. Ruth recorded eight homers in August, and showed up for work September 1 with a fire still burning in his belly.
Babe was battered and sore from his season-long exertions, but the Yanks were playing the Athletics in front of 72,000 ardent supporters. Team trainer Doc Painter told Ruth not to play in the doubleheader, but he wouldn't hear of it. It would make a great story if Babe won the day with amazing deeds, but it didn't happen this time. This is a good tale anyway. How many modern athletes would drag themselves out on display under these circumstances? The man was in severe back pain in a situation where New York trailed Philadelphia by thirteen games with only one month left. Why was he playing? Entering the ninth inning of the first game, Ruth had gone 2 for 4 with two singles. Batting this time with a 3-2 deficit, Ruth watched as Connie Mack specifically called in Lefty Grove to pitch to him. As the two ultimate warriors eyed another, Babe dug in at the plate. This would be another classic confrontation of primal force against brute strength.
Facing some of the fastest fastballs ever thrown, Ruth went down swinging. Players in the infield and dugouts declared that they could actually hear the sound of both ball and bat speeding through the air. Babe Ruth had struck out, and the Yankees lost. Some might regard this as a defeat for Ruth, but not those who know best. They see the similarities between these events and those of the last game of the 1926 World Series. Why was he playing? He was playing for pride and because he was not afraid to fail. It was his sense of self, recognizing his role as America's greatest ballplayer. It drove him this day and every other day. No negative thoughts ever deterred him. He never took a backward step on the baseball field. Yes, he was a great natural athlete, but he was a whole lot more than that. He was Babe Ruth.
By the end of September, Ruth was feeling much better. He was back at Shibe Park against the same Athletics, where the season had started seemingly ages ago. Babe pounded a hard drive into right center field, and nobody thought much about it. Another home run for Ruth? Who cares? The season is over; the A's have already clinched the pennant. Then bang! The ball hit the exact loudspeaker that had been hit on opening day. The odds of this occurrence are off the charts. It had never happened before, and the Athletics, who thought it would never happen again, hadn't bothered to change the ground rules. Ruth was held to another double that should have been a home run. He wound up the year with forty-nine homers. With either a little luck or a little responsibility on the part of the A's, he would have reached fifty for the fifth time.
Undaunted, Babe took the mound two days later on September 28 in Boston to pitch the last game of the season. He hadn't pitched in a Big League game in nine years, and this was a rare opportunity to relive his athletic youth. The chances of defeat and embarrassment were extremely high. But Ruth took the ball and marched onto the mound in front of the same people who remembered him as one of the best left-handed pitchers of that era. And he pitched wonderfully. Entering the eighth inning, he had been practically unhittable. Ruth tired in the ninth, but still managed to hurl a complete game 9-3 victory.
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Btw his SA would have been .739 instead of .732 if he had those four total bases he lost out on.Last edited by Sultan_1895-1948; 09-21-2016, 03:24 PM.Comment
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Awesome post, Sultan. I have heard about Ruth being robbed of his 5th 50 HR season. But I didn't realize that he was having such a monstrous year until he got hurt. I think that contract gave him his last boost of energy. Who knows how he would have finished had he been healthy. It seemed like he was as motivated in 1930 as he was in 1923. Ruth said that his 1923 season was his best. Ironically, that is the year that he set the WAR record that might not ever be broken.
Anyway, thanks for the info, Amigo.Comment
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Originally posted by pheasant View Post
Posted this one long ago.
Not only did Ruth lose another 50 or more home run season.
One of those lost home runs was hit off of Lefty Grove, would have given Babe 10 career home runs off of Grove, the most.
So he tied with Greenberg and Gehrig with 9 career home runs. Consider this, the Bam never faced Lefty until his (Babe's) 12th season.
He also has the most career home runs off of a pretty good right hander, Walter Johnson, 10 career.
Researching this guy for decades and he still amazes me.Comment
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Posted by: SABR MattOriginally posted by Sultan_1895-1948
Ask and you shall receive.
We'll start with some commentary on his hitting, cover his fielding, and then his pitching...and then I'll make a summary statement about Ruth's place in history.
To demostrate how truly phenominal Ruth's career was, let's show his offensive record using PCA adjusted Wins and PCA-BA:His career Offensive PCA-BA of .385 is best in baseball history among players with at least 2500 PA. Just try to imagine what people would say about a player who had a .385 career batting average (!)...when you put offensive production on the scale of batting average it really helps put things into perspective. Note that Ruth bests Ted Williams by 4 points and the third place hitter (in terms of career production rate, that's Barry Bonds) by SIXTEEN points.Code:PlayerID Yr PA Wins PCA-BA ruthba01 1914 10 0.00 0.233 ruthba01 1915 103 1.98 0.349 ruthba01 1916 150 1.46 0.291 ruthba01 1917 142 1.62 0.301 ruthba01 1918 380 9.31 0.382 ruthba01 1919 542 16.14 0.415 ruthba01 1920 616 22.36 0.455 ruthba01 1921 693 23.23 0.438 ruthba01 1922 495 11.11 0.369 ruthba01 1923 699 20.60 0.413 ruthba01 1924 681 21.03 0.421 ruthba01 1925 426 4.53 0.297 ruthba01 1926 652 19.46 0.415 ruthba01 1927 691 16.29 0.376 ruthba01 1928 684 17.82 0.392 ruthba01 1929 587 13.86 0.377 ruthba01 1930 676 15.65 0.374 ruthba01 1931 663 16.48 0.384 ruthba01 1932 589 15.36 0.392 ruthba01 1933 575 8.37 0.321 ruthba01 1934 471 7.09 0.324 ruthba01 1935 92 0.77 0.283
6 Seasons Over .400
8 More Seasons Over .350
Aside from when he was injured or a pitcher, he NEVER finished below .300 (and bear in mind, the adjusted wins and PCA-BA are normalized to account for the standard deviation of performance which during Ruth's time was rather large).
Check this out...here are the the top 25 seasons in major league history where the player recorded at least 500 PA in offensive PCA-BA...count the times Ruth appears:Out of the top 25 hitting seasons of all time by PCA, six of them were Babe Ruth.Code:PlayerID Yr PA Wins PCA-BA [B]Babe Ruth 1920 616 22.36 0.455[/B] R. Henderson 1990 594 20.74 0.446 Barry Bonds 2004 617 21.55 0.446 Barry Bonds 2002 612 20.72 0.44 [B]Babe Ruth 1921 693 23.23 0.438[/B] Ty Cobb 1910 590 19.09 0.431 George Brett 1980 515 16.68 0.431 Honus Wagner 1908 641 20.55 0.429 Ty Cobb 1917 669 21.27 0.427 Nap Lajoie 1901 582 17.89 0.421 [B]Babe Ruth 1924 681 21.03 0.421[/B] Honus Wagner 1904 558 17.18 0.421 Mickey Mantle 1956 652 19.94 0.42 Ted Williams 1957 546 16.72 0.42 Mickey Mantle 1962 502 15.28 0.419 Mickey Mantle 1957 623 18.81 0.417 Jim Thome 2002 613 18.51 0.417 Ted Williams 1941 606 18.25 0.417 [B]Babe Ruth 1919 542 16.14 0.415 Base Ruth 1926 652 19.46 0.415[/B] Ted Williams 1948 638 19.04 0.415 Jason Giambi 2001 671 19.88 0.414 Barry Bonds 2001 664 19.61 0.413 [B]Babe Ruth 1923 699 20.6 0.413[/B] Nap Lajoie 1904 594 17.41 0.412 Jason Giambi 2000 664 19.34 0.411
When you break his marvelous career into the three components that make up the GI method, (career wins or LONGEVITY, wins prorated to a standard career length or EFFICIENCY, and performance above the 90th percentile along with a career half-life projection, which when combined together form a DOMINANCE term), You get a good picture of how Ruth compares to the other great offensive players.
In terms of career offensive wins, here are the top five:Cobb ekes out an extremely slim victory over Ruth here but does so in about 2400 extra plate appearances.Code:First Last LONGEVITY Ps Ty Cobb 265.2 CF Babe Ruth 264.52 RF Barry Bonds 258.57 LF Ted Williams 238.52 LF Rickey Henderson 237.42 LF
Other than Barry Bonds, no one else comes even close to Ruth.
Here's are the top five most efficiency offensive players of all time:Neat...same five players, but now Ruth dominates the field being the only player with a relatively short career in this grouping (even Ted Williams had more PA despite having to fight in two different wars).Code:First Last EFFICIENCY Ps Babe Ruth 260.61 RF Barry Bonds 248.54 LF Ty Cobb 245.74 CF Ted Williams 239.84 LF Rickey Henderson 216.23 LF
When we look at how much the best players dominated over their field, Ruth again lands squarely on top:The new player in this list is the Mick...and this makes sense given his impressive string of league-leads in PCA wins created. But notice how big the drop-off is between Ruth and the next three...and again to the third tier oif players (led by Mantle). No one dominated the game anything like Ruth offensively.Code:First Last MASTERY Ps Babe Ruth 245.05 RF Ted Williams 221.95 LF Barry Bonds 216.34 LF Ty Cobb 201.09 CF Mickey Mantle 179.45 CF
His offensive rating, when you add those three fields together reflects this:Ruth blows away the field, fellas. This will be important later when I talk about defense in the next post.Code:First Last TOTAL Ps Babe Ruth 770.18 RF Barry Bonds 723.45 LF Ty Cobb 712.03 CF Ted Williams 700.31 LF Rickey Henderson 627.82 LF
With the available data, though, I will stick to my belief that Ruth is the best hitter of all time.
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Thanks to Matt for the data. Here's a line-chart to give a different visual perspective of offensive PCA-BA and how these players performed throughout their careers.
Bonds ('86-'04), Ruth ('18-'35), Mays ('51-'73; no '53 of course), Williams ('39-'60; no '43-'45, and no '52 - only 12 PA)
PCABAchart.jpgComment
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Thanks for sharing Sabr Matt's work. He used standard deviations, which is great. I am sure that he was a great fan of Michael Schell, just like I am, along with BigRon and Floyd are.
Anyway, there are couple of hidden gems in there. Using this method, Cobb shines quite brightly. He leads in career wins, although he needed 2400 more PA than Ruth to claim that trophy. It will depend on whether or not a person is a cumulative fan vs a peak fan. But this study gives Cobb a good argument for being the best ever, especially when favoriting his positional importance at CF. Secondly, Mantle is way up on the list. Is way higher than most people have him. I believe I had him at exactly 6th in my rankings. And thirdly, notice how clean-Bonds line in the very bottom chart holds its own pretty well. This boosts him way up there. And here is the kicker: players in 1990s we're taking steroids to fatten up the actual length of the standard deviations. If you take steroids out of the mix, then Bonds probably dominates that chart. As a matter of fact, the fact that he was clean(up through 1998) and still scoring this high(solidly above Mays) despite throwing all of those juicers into the mix gives him a really strong case for best ever.
Of course, I would draft Wagner first. I have already posted my standings.
Anyway, another great post, Sultan.Comment
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