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27th Greatest Hitter

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  • #1

    27th Greatest Hitter

    Congratulations to Johnny Mize, the Cardinals' slugging 1st baseman, who piled up 26 points with 2 first place vote. Slugging Johnny beat out Eddie Collins, the A's/White Sox' 2nd baseman, who finished with 21 points and 1 first place vote.

    Third place money went to Tony Gwynn, the Padres' hefty, but sweet-swinging high BA hitter, who tied with Mike Piazza, the Dodgers'/Mets' heavy-hitting catcher. They both received 12 points, with Tony not getting a first place vote and Mike getting only 1.

    This round for our 27th Greatest Hitter of All Time is now open! Let the Games Begin! Round 27 will end when AstrosFan calls it. How bout helpin' him out with lots of full 5 person ballots and 5 person Honorable Mentions to work with!

    Red = Negro Leagues = 1
    Blue = 19th Century = 0
    Bold = active = 1

    1. Babe Ruth
    2. Ted Williams
    3. Ty Cobb
    4. Lou Gehrig
    5. Rogers Hornsby
    6. Mickey Mantle
    7. Stan Musial
    8. Barry Bonds
    9. Hank Aaron
    10. Honus Wagner
    11. Willie Mays
    12. Jimmie Foxx
    13. Tris Speaker
    14. Joe DiMaggio
    15. Josh Gibson
    16. Frank Robinson
    17. Frank Thomas
    18. Nap Lajoie
    19. Mel Ott
    20. Albert Pujols
    21. Mike Schmidt
    22. Joe Jackson
    23. Alex Rodriquez
    24. Hank Greenberg
    25. Dan Brouthers
    26. Johnny Mize
    27.

    As per our usual, please consider everything. Relative stats, counting totals, peak, longevity, special skills, home/away splits, etc. If anyone wants to show the relative stats, home/away breakdowns for the leading candidates, that would be great. Can't hurt, always helps.

    We are now ONLY voting for the 27th Greatest Hitter. So, please submit your list of your next Top 5 Hitters along with your next set of 5 Honorable Mentions, if you would be so kind. As the winner of Round 26, Johnny Mize is now eliminated from our further consideration.
    Code:
    [COLOR="RoyalBlue"]Round 1.---23 voters

[B]-------------------1st pl.-----------2nd------3rd------4th----5th--Total [/B]
1. Babe Ruth------70 pts.(14)------28(7)----3(1)------0-----1(1)----101 
2. Ted Williams-----30(6)------------48(12)---9(3)-----2(1)---1(1)----90
3. Ty Cobb---------15(3)-------------8(2)--30(10)-----6(3)-----0-----59
4. Lou Gehrig--------0----------------4(1)---15(5)----10(5)---5(5)----34
5. Rogers Hornsby---0-----------------0-------6(2)----12(6)---6(6)---24
6. Stan Musial-------0-----------------4(1)-----0-------2(1)---2(2)----8
7. Hank Aaron-------0-----------------0--------3(1)----2(1)---2(2)----7
7. Mickey Mantle----0-----------------0---------0------6(3)---1(1)----7
9. Barry Bonds------0-----------------0---------3(1)----0------2(2)---5
10. Frank Thomas---0-----------------0---------0-------4(2)----0-----4
11. Tony Gwynn----0-----------------0---------0--------2(1)----0-----2
12. Alex Rodriguez--0-----------------0---------0---------0------1(1)--1
13. Joe DiMaggio---0-----------------0---------0---------0------1(1)--1
14. Jimmy Foxx-----0-----------------0---------0---------0------1(1)--1[/COLOR]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[COLOR="Red"]Round 2.---21 voters

1. Ted Williams - 101(17)
2. Ty Cobb - 73(4)
3. Lou Gehrig - 37
4. Rogers Hornsby - 35
5. Hank Aaron - 19
6. Stan Musial - 13
7. Willie Mays - 8
8. Josh Gibson - 6
9. Mickey Mantle - 5
10. Barry Bonds - 4
11. Tony Gwynn - 2
12. Honus Wagner - 1
12. Jimmy Foxx - 1
12. Alexander Rodriguez - 1

Here is the breakdown.

[B]---------------------1st place------2nd--------3rd----------4th---------5th[/B]
1. Ted Williams--------85(17)-------16(4)-------0------------0-----------0
2. Ty Cobb-----------20(4)--------44(11)------6(2)--------2(1)---------1(1)
3. Lou Gehrig----------0------------4(1)-------6(2)--------6(3)---------4(4)
4. Rogers Hornsby-----0------------8(2)-------18(6)-------6(3)---------3(3)
5. Hank Aaron---------0------------4(1)-------6(2)--------6(3)---------4(4)
6. Stan Musial---------0------------4(1)-------3(1)--------4(2)---------2(2)
7. Willie Mays---------0--------------0----------0---------6(3)---------2(2)
8. Josh Gibson--------0--------------0---------6(2)---------0-----------0
9. Mickey Mantle------0--------------0---------3(1)--------0-----------2(2)
10. Barry Bonds-------0-------------4(1)--------0----------0------------0
11. Honus Wagner-----0--------------0---------0-----------0-----------1(1)
12. Jimmy Foxx--------0--------------0---------0-----------0-----------1(1)
13. Tony Gwynn-------0--------------0---------0-----------0-----------1(1)[/COLOR]
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[COLOR="RoyalBlue"]Round 3.---20 voters

1. Ty Cobb - 85(12)
2. Lou Gehrig - 54(3)
3. Rogers Hornsby - 45(1)
4. Hank Aaron - 28(2)
5. Mickey Mantle - 18
6. Stan Musial - 15
7. Barry Bonds - 13(2)
8. Willie Mays - 11
9. Josh Gibson - 8
10. Honus Wagner - 7
10. Frank Thomas - 7
12. Jimmy Foxx - 4
13. Alexander Rodriguez - 1

Here's the fine breakdown.

---------------------[B]1st-----2nd---3rd----4th----5th[/B]
1. Ty Cobb--------60(12)---12(3)--12(4)---0-----1(1)
2. Lou Gehrig-------5(3)-----8(2)---21(7)--8(4)---2(2)
3. Rogers Hornsby--5(1)----24(6)----9(3)--4(2)---3(3)
4. Hank Aaron-----10(2)------0------6(2)-10(5)---2(2)
5. Mickey Mantle----0-------8(2)----0------8(3)---2(2)
6. Stan Musial-------0-------4(1)---3(1)----2(1)---6(6)
7. Barry Bonds------10(2)----0-----3(1)-----0------0
8. Willie Mays--------0-------8(2)--3(1)-----0------0
9. Josh Gibson-------0-------4(1)----0-----4(2)----0
10. Honus Wagner---0-------4(1)----0-----2(1)----1(1) 
10. Frank Thomas---0-------4(1)----3(1)----0------0
12. Jimmy Foxx-----0---------0-------0-----2(1)---2(2)
13. Alexander Rodriguez-0----0--------0------0-----1(1)[/COLOR]
----------------------------------------------------------------------
[COLOR="Red"]Round 4.  ---21 voters.

1. Lou Gehrig - 85(9)
2. Rogers Hornsby - 82(9)
3. Mickey Mantle - 32(1)
4. Hank Aaron - 27(1)
5. Stan Musial - 17
6. Honus Wagner - 16
7. Josh Gibson - 15
8. Willie Mays - 11
9. Barry Bonds - 8
10. Jimmy Foxx - 6
11. Frank Thomas - 5
12. Alexander Rodriguez - 3
13. Chino Smith - 2
14. Joe DiMaggio - 1
14. Rod Carew - 1
14. Tris Speaker - 1

Fine Breakdown:

---------------------------1st---2nd----3rd----4th---5th
1. Lou Gehrig-------------45(9)--24(6)--12(4)--4(2)---0
2. Rogers Hornsby--------45(9)--24(6)---9(3)---4(2)---0
3. Mickey Mantle----------5(1)---4(1)--15(5)---8(4)---0
4. Hank Aaron-------------5(1)---4(1)---9(3)---4(2)--5(5)
5. Stan Musial--------------0-----4(1)---6(2)---6(3)--1(1)
6. Honus Wagner-----------0-----8(2)---3(1)----0----5(5) 
6. Josh Gibson-------------0-----4(1)---9(3)----2(1)---0 
8. Willie Mays--------------0-----4(1)----0------6(3)--1(1)
9. Barry Bonds-------------0-----4(1)----0------2(1)--2(2) 
10. Frank Thomas----------0-----4(1)----0------0-----1(1) 
11. Jimmy Foxx------------0-------0------0-----4(2)--2(2) 
12. Alexander Rodriguez----0-------0------0-----2(1)--1(1) 
13. Chino Smith------------0-------0------0-----2(1)---0
14. Joe DiMaggio-----------0-------0------0------0----1(1)
14. Rod Carew-------------0-------0------0------0----1(1)
14. Tris Speaker[/COLOR]
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
[COLOR="RoyalBlue"]Round 5.---21 voters.---[url=http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=76917]last round[/url]

1. Rogers Hornsby - 92(17)
2. Mickey Mantle - 38(1)
3. Barry Bonds - 32(1)
4. Honus Wagner - 30
5. Stan Musial - 28
6. Hank Aaron - 24(1)
7. Willie Mays - 17
8. Josh Gibson - 11
9. Joe DiMaggio - 6
10. Dan Brouthers - 5(1)
11. Jimmy Foxx - 4
12. Frank Thomas - 3
12. Ichiro Suzuki - 3
14. Alexander Rodriguez - 2
14. Chino Smith - 2
16. Joe Jackson - 1
16. Buck Leonard - 1
16. Tris Speaker - 1

The fine breakdown.
---------------------1st------2nd----3rd-----4th-----5th---Totals
1. Rogers Hornsby----85(17)---4(1)--3(1)------0------0------92
2. Mickey Mantle-------5(1)--16(4)---12(4)---2(1)---3(3)----38
3. Barry Bonds----------5(1)---8(2)----3(1)--14(7)---2(2)----32
4. Honus Wagner---------0----24(6)---6(2)----0------0------30
5. Stan Musial------------0-----4(1)--12(4)---2(1)---3(2)----28
6. Hank Aaron-----------5(1)----4(1---9(3)---4(2)---2(1)----24
7. Willie Mays-------------0-----4(1)---6(2)---4(2)---3(3)----17
8. Josh Gibson------------0-----8(2)---3(1)-----0-----0------11
9. Joe DiMaggio-----------0-------0----3(3)---2(1)---1(1)-----6
10. Dan Brouthers--------5(1)-----0-----0------0------0------5
11. Jimmy Foxx-----------0-------0------0-----0------4(4)----4
12. Frank Thomas--------0--------0----3(1)----0------0-------3
12. Ichiro Suzuki---------0--------0----3(1)----0------0-------3
14. Alexander Rodriquez--0--------0-----0------2(1)---0-------2
14. Chino Smith----------0--------0-----0------2(1)---0-------2
16. Joe Jackson----------0--------0-----0------0------1(1)----1
16. Buck Leonard----------0--------0-----0------0-----1(1)----1
16. Tris Speaker-----------0--------0-----0------0-----1(1)----1[/COLOR]
    Round 6
    Code:
    Fname	Lname		First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Mickey	Mantle		6	5	3	1	1	62
Stan	Musial		4	4	5	0	4	55
Barry	Bonds		5	2	3	3	2	50
Honus	Wagner		5	1	2	1	4	41
Willie	Mays		0	3	3	5	0	31
Hank	Aaron		0	2	1	5	2	23
Tris	Speaker		0	1	1	1	2	11
Josh	Gibson		0	1	1	1	0	9
Joe	DiMaggio	0	0	1	1	0	5
Alex	Rodriguez	0	1	0	0	1	5
Frank	Thomas		0	0	0	0	4	4
    Round 7
    Code:
    Fname	Lname		First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Stan	Musial		4	9	3	1	2	69
Barry	Bonds		9	2	3	2	2	68
Hank	Aaron		0	3	5	4	3	38
Honus	Wagner		4	1	0	4	2	34
Willie	Mays		0	1	3	3	3	22
Jimmie	Foxx		1	1	3	0	0	18
Josh	Gibson		1	1	1	1	1	15
Tris	Speaker		0	1	2	0	4	14
Albert	Pujols		1	0	0	1	1	8
Joe	DiMaggio	0	1	0	1	1	7
Dan	Brouthers	0	0	1	1	0	5
Frank	Thomas		0	0	0	1	1	3
Roger	Connor		0	0	0	1	0	2
Alex	Rodriguez	0	0	0	0	0	0
    Round 8.
    Code:
    Fname	Lname		First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Barry	Bonds		5	4	3	2	0	54
Hank	Aaron		3	1	8	1	4	49
Honus	Wagner		5	1	3	2	2	44
Willie	Mays		1	4	3	5	1	41
Jimmie	Foxx		2	4	1	1	6	37
Josh	Gibson		3	1	0	0	1	20
Tris	Speaker		0	1	1	2	2	13
Joe	DiMaggio	0	1	0	2	0	8
Frank	Thomas		0	1	0	2	0	8
Hank	Greenberg	0	1	1	0	0	7
Tony	Gwynn		1	0	0	0	0	5
Wade	Boggs		0	1	0	0	0	4
Joe	Jackson		0	0	0	1	1	3
Dan	Brouthers	0	0	0	1	0	2
Nap	Lajoie		0	0	0	1	0	2
Mel	Ott		0	0	0	0	1	1
Manny	Ramirez		0	0	0	0	1	1
Al	Simmons		0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 9.
    Code:
    Fname	Lname		First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Hank	Aaron		5	5	5	1	2	64
Willie	Mays		2	5	6	2	0	52
Honus	Wagner		5	3	2	2	3	50
Jimmie	Foxx		1	3	1	5	5	35
Tris	Speaker		1	1	1	1	4	18
Frank	Thomas		1	1	1	2	0	16
Josh	Gibson		2	0	0	1	0	12
Shoeless Joe	Jackson	1	0	0	1	0	7
Albert	Pujols		1	0	0	0	0	5
Joe	DiMaggio	0	0	1	0	1	4
Hank	Greenberg	0	1		0	0	4
Dan	Brouthers	0	0	1	0	0	3
Mel	Ott		0	0	0	1	1	3
Frank	Robinson	0	0	1	0	0	3
Nap	Lajoie		0	0	0	1	0	2
Manny	Ramirez		0	0	0	1	0	2
Sam	Thompson	0	0	0	1	0	2
Oscar	Charleston	0	0	0	0	1	1
Willie	McCovey		0	0	0	0	1	1
Alex	Rodriguez	0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 10
    Code:
    Fname		Lname		First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Honus		Wagner		8	2	2	3	0	60
Willie		Mays		3	6	4	2	2	57
Jimmie		Foxx		1	6	6	1	3	52
Frank		Thomas		2	3	3	1	1	34
Tris		Speaker		2	1	1	4	0	25
Shoeless Joe	Jackson		2	0	1	0	2	15
Josh		Gibson		1	1	0	1	1	12
Albert		Pujols		0	0	1	2	1	8
Frank		Robinson	0	1	0	1	1	7
Joe		DiMaggio	0	0	1	1	1	6
Dan		Brouthers	0	0	1	0	2	5
Alex		Rodriguez	1	0	0	0	0	5
Nap		Lajoie		0	0	0	1	1	3
Mel		Ott		0	0	0	1	1	3
Hank		Greenberg	0	0	0	1	0	2
Pop		Lloyd		0	0	0	1	0	2
Manny		Ramirez		0	0	0	0	2	2
Mike		Schmidt		0	0	0	0	1	1
Sam		Thompson	0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 11
    Code:
    Fname	Lname		First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Willie	Mays		12	3	0	3	0	78
Jimmie	Foxx		4	9	4	2	0	72
Tris	Speaker		0	2	4	2	3	27
Josh	Gibson		2	0	2	1	2	20
Frank	Thomas		1	0	3	2	0	18
Joe	DiMaggio	0	2	1	1	1	14
Frank	Robinson	0	0	1	3	2	11
Mel	Ott		0	1	1	1	1	10
Nap	Lajoie		0	0	1	2	2	9
Mike	Schmidt		0	0	0	2	3	7
Dan	Brouthers	0	1	0	0	2	6
Ken	Griffey Jr.	0	1	0	0	0	4
Hank	Greenberg	0	0	1	0	0	3
Alex	Rodriguez	0	0	1	0	0	3
Albert	Pujols		0	0	0	0	2	2
Ed	Delahanty	0	0	0	0	1	1
    [/code]
    Round 12
    Code:
    Fname	Lname		First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Jimmie	Foxx		9	2	1	0	1	57
Tris	Speaker		0	4	0	7	0	30
Josh	Gibson		1	3	2	0	2	25
Joe	DiMaggio	2	2	0	1	4	24
Nap	Lajoie		0	1	3	0	0	13
Frank	Thomas		0	1	3	0	0	13
Mike	Schmidt		0	0	2	2	2	12
Frank	Robinson	0	0	2	1	2	10
Mel	Ott		0	0	1	2	0	7
Dan	Brouthers	1	0	0	0	1	6
Ken	Griffey Jr.	1	0	0	0	0	5
Hank	Greenberg	0	1	0	0	0	4
Ichiro	Suzuki		0	0	0	1	0	2
Mark	McGwire		0	0	0	0	1	1
Albert	Pujols		0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 13
    Code:
    Fname		Lname		First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Tris		Speaker		2	4	4	2	0	42
Josh		Gibson		5	2	0	2	0	37
Nap		Lajoie		2	2	2	0	1	25
Joe		DiMaggio	2	0	0	2	5	19
Mike		Schmidt		0	2	2	2	0	18
Frank		Robinson	0	1	1	3	1	14
Frank		Thomas		0	1	1	0	1	8
Dan		Brouthers	1	0	0	1	0	7
Hank		Greenberg	0	1	0	0	1	5
Ken		Griffey Jr.	1	0	0	0	0	5
Mel		Ott		0	0	1	0	1	4
Sam		Crawford	0	0	1	0	0	3
Shoeless Joe	Jackson		0	0	1	0	0	3
Lefty		O'Doul		0	0	0	1	0	2
Ed		Delahanty	0	0	0	0	1	1
Harry		Heilmann	0	0	0	0	1	1
Alex		Rodriguez	0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 14
    Code:
    Fname		Lname		First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Joe		DiMaggio	3	1	1	6	0	34
Josh		Gibson		3	2	3	0	1	33
Nap		Lajoie		3	1	2	1	2	29
Frank		Robinson	1	2	2	1	1	22
Mike		Schmidt		0	3	3	0	0	21
Frank		Thomas		0	2	1	0	2	13
Hank		Greenberg	1	0	0	1	4	11
Dan		Brouthers	1	0	1	0	0	8
Mel		Ott		0	1	1	0	0	7
Alex		Rodriguez	1	0	0	1	0	7
Ken		Griffey Jr.	1	0	0	0	0	5
Sam		Crawford	0	1	0	0	0	4
Shoeless Joe	Jackson		0	1	0	0	0	4
Ed		Delahanty	0	0	0	1	0	2
Harry		Heilmann	0	0	0	1	0	2
Johnny		Mize		0	0	0	1	0	2
Albert		Pujols		0	0	0	0	2	2
Chino		Smith		0	0	0	1	0	2
Mark		McGwire		0	0	0	0	1	1
Lefty		O'Doul		0	0	0	0	1	1
    15th Greatest Hitter
    Code:
    Fname		Lname		First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Josh		Gibson		6	3	3	1	1	54
Nap		Lajoie		3	2	3	2	0	36
Frank		Robinson	2	3	2	2	4	36
Mike		Schmidt		1	2	5	1	2	32
Frank		Thomas		0	6	0	2	0	28
Hank		Greenberg	2	0	1	4	0	21
Albert		Pujols		2	0	0	1	2	14
Mel		Ott		0	1	1	1	0	9
Alex		Rodriguez	1	0	1	0	1	9
Dan		Brouthers	1	0	1	0	0	8
Shoeless Joe	Jackson		0	1	0	1	1	7
Ken		Griffey Jr.	1	0	0	0	0	5
Sam		Crawford	0	1	0	0	0	4
Johnny		Mize		0	0	1	0	1	4
Chino		Smith		0	0	1	0	0	3
Ed		Delahanty	0	0	0	1	0	2
Harry		Heilmann	0	0	0	1	0	2
Eddie		Collins		0	0	0	1	0	2
Mark		McGwire		0	0	0	1	0	2
Lefty		O'Doul		0	0	0	0	1	1
Al		Simmons		0	0	0	0	1	1
Mike		Piazza		0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 16.
    Code:
    FirstName	LastName	First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Frank		Robinson	3	5	5	7	6	70
Frank		Thomas		4	3	7	5	5	68
Nap		Lajoie		4	1	4	4	1	45
Mike		Schmidt		0	4	2	7	4	40
Mel		Ott		1	2	4	1	8	35
Albert		Pujols		2	2	0	5	4	32
Hank		Greenberg	1	3	1	2	2	26
Joe		Jackson		0	1	3	4	4	25
Dan		Brouthers	2	1	1	0	3	20
Alex		Rodriguez	0	1	3	1	0	15
Eddie		Collins		0	0	0	1	2	4
Sam		Crawford	0	1	0	0	0	4
Ken		Griffey Jr.	0	1	0	0	0	4
Tony		Gwynn		0	0	0	2	0	4
Mark		McGwire		0	1	0	0	0	4
Harry		Heilmann	0	0	1	0	0	3
Johnny		Mize		0	0	0	0	2	2
Al		Simmons		0	0	0	0	2	2
Sam		Thompson	0	0	0	1	0	2
Wade		Boggs		0	0	0	0	1	1
George		Brett		0	0	0	0	1	1
Oscar		Charleston	0	0	0	0	1	1
Mike		Piazza		0	0	0	0	1	1
Ichiro		Suzuki		0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 17.
    Code:
    FirstName	LastName	First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Frank		Thomas		3	2	5	10	4	62
Nap		Lajoie		4	2	3	3	2	45
Mel		Ott		1	4	1	4	7	39
Mike		Schmidt		0	3	3	5	8	39
Albert		Pujols		1	2	3	3	6	34
Hank		Greenberg	2	2	1	2	3	28
Joe		Jackson		0	0	5	3	4	25
Dan		Brouthers	2	1	1	2	1	22
Alex		Rodriguez	0	2	2	1	0	16
Tony		Gwynn		0	0	1	1	1	6
Eddie		Collins		0	0	0	2	1	5
Sam		Crawford	0	1	0	0	0	4
Mark		McGwire		0	1	0	0	0	4
George		Brett		0	0	0	1	1	3
Ken		Griffey Jr.	0	0	1	0	0	3
Harry		Heilmann	0	0	1	0	0	3
Johnny		Mize		0	0	0	0	2	2
Al		Simmons		0	0	0	0	2	2
Sam		Thompson	0	0	0	1	0	2
Wade		Boggs		0	0	0	0	1	1
Oscar		Charleston	0	0	0	0	1	1
Ed		Delahanty	0	0	0	0	1	1
Pop		Lloyd		0	0	0	0	1	1
Mike		Piazza		0	0	0	0	1	1
Ichiro		Suzuki		0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 18
    Code:
    FirstName	LastName	First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Nap		Lajoie		4	3	2	3	3	47
Mel		Ott		2	3	3	4	6	45
Mike		Schmidt		1	3	3	4	10	44
Albert		Pujols		2	2	3	3	5	38
Hank		Greenberg	2	2	1	4	2	31
Joe		Jackson		1	0	2	5	4	25
Dan		Brouthers	2	1	3	0	1	24
Alex		Rodriguez	0	1	3	1	1	16
Tony		Gwynn		0	1	0	1	1	7
Eddie		Collins		0	0	0	2	2	6
George		Brett		0	0	1	1	0	5
Mark		McGwire		1	0	0	0	0	5
Sam		Crawford	0	1	0	0	0	4
Harry		Heilmann	0	0	1	0	0	3
Johnny		Mize		0	0	0	0	3	3
Al		Simmons		0	0	0	0	3	3
Ed		Delahanty	0	0	0	1	0	2
Ken		Griffey Jr.	0	0	0	1	0	2
Mike		Piazza		0	0	0	0	2	2
Sam		Thompson	0	0	0	1	0	2
Wade		Boggs		0	0	0	0	1	1
Oscar		Charleston	0	0	0	0	1	1
Pop		Lloyd		0	0	0	0	1	1
Ichiro		Suzuki		0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 19.
    Code:
    FirstName	LastName	First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Mel		Ott		3	2	6	2	7	52
Mike		Schmidt		3	2	1	7	8	48
Albert		Pujols		2	3	3	4	5	44
Hank		Greenberg	2	2	3	2	3	34
Joe		Jackson		1	0	3	6	7	33
Dan		Brouthers	2	2	2	0	1	25
Alex		Rodriguez	0	3	1	1	2	19
Eddie		Collins		1	0	1	2	1	13
Tony		Gwynn		0	1	0	2	0	8
George		Brett		0	0	2	0	1	7
Sam		Crawford	1	0	0	0	0	5
Mark		McGwire		1	0	0	0	0	5
Al		Simmons		0	0	0	2	1	5
Harry		Heilmann	0	1	0	0	0	4
Rickey		Henderson	0	1	0	0	0	4
Johnny		Mize		0	0	0	0	3	3
Ed		Delahanty	0	0	0	1	0	2
Joe		Morgan		0	0	0	1	0	2
Mike		Piazza		0	0	0	0	2	2
Sam		Thompson	0	0	0	1	0	2
Wade		Boggs		0	0	0	0	1	1
Oscar		Charleston	0	0	0	0	1	1
Ken		Griffey Jr.	0	0	0	0	1	1
Pop		Lloyd		0	0	0	0	1	1
Pete		Rose		0	0	0	0	1	1
Ichiro		Suzuki		0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 20.
    Code:
    FirstName	LastName	First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Albert		Pujols		3	3	4	2	6	49
Mike		Schmidt		1	3	3	5	10	46
Joe		Jackson		1	0	3	9	5	37
Hank		Greenberg	2	2	3	3	2	35
Dan		Brouthers	2	3	1	0	1	26
Alex		Rodriguez	0	3	1	3	2	23
Eddie		Collins		1	1	1	2	0	16
Tony		Gwynn		0	0	1	2	0	7
George		Brett		0	0	1	1	1	6
Mark		McGwire		1	0	0	0	1	6
Johnny		Mize		0	0	0	0	5	5
Sam		Crawford	0	1	0	0	0	4
Rickey		Henderson	0	1	0	0	0	4
Al		Simmons		0	0	0	1	2	4
Ed		Delahanty	0	0	1	0	0	3
Harry		Heilmann	0	0	1	0	0	3
Joe		Morgan		0	0	1	0	0	3
Mike		Piazza		0	0	0	0	2	2
Pete		Rose		0	0	0	1	0	2
Sam		Thompson	0	0	0	1	0	2
Wade		Boggs		0	0	0	0	1	1
Oscar		Charleston	0	0	0	0	1	1
Ken		Griffey Jr.	0	0	0	0	1	1
Pop		Lloyd		0	0	0	0	1	1
Ichiro		Suzuki		0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 21.
    Code:
    FirstName	LastName	First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Mike		Schmidt		1	4	2	5	13	50
Joe		Jackson		1	1	5	5	6	40
Hank		Greenberg	2	3	2	4	2	38
Dan		Brouthers	4	1	1	0	2	29
Alex		Rodriguez	1	1	4	3	2	29
Eddie		Collins		1	1	2	1	0	17
Tony		Gwynn		0	0	1	2	0	7
Johnny		Mize		0	0	0	2	3	7
George		Brett		0	0	1	1	1	6
Mark		McGwire		0	1	0	1	0	6
Sam		Crawford	0	1	0	0	0	4
Ed		Delahanty	0	1	0	0	0	4
Rickey		Henderson	0	1	0	0	0	4
Harry		Heilmann	0	0	1	0	0	3
Joe		Morgan		0	0	1	0	0	3
Mike		Piazza		0	0	0	0	3	3
Al		Simmons		0	0	0	0	3	3
Oscar		Charleston	0	0	0	0	2	2
Pete		Rose		0	0	0	1	0	2
Sam		Thompson	0	0	0	1	0	2
Wade		Boggs		0	0	0	0	1	1
Ken		Griffey Jr.	0	0	0	0	1	1
Pop		Lloyd		0	0	0	0	1	1
Ichiro		Suzuki		0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 22.
    Code:
    FirstName	LastName	First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Joe		Jackson		1	3	3	5	6	42
Hank		Greenberg	2	2	4	4	1	39
Alex		Rodriguez	2	1	4	2	4	34
Dan		Brouthers	4	0	1	1	2	27
Eddie		Collins		1	1	2	0	1	16
Johnny		Mize		0	0	0	2	5	9
Tony		Gwynn		0	0	1	2	0	7
Mark		McGwire		0	1	0	1	0	6
George		Brett		0	0	0	2	1	5
Sam		Crawford	0	1	0	0	0	4
Ed		Delahanty	0	1	0	0	0	4
Rickey		Henderson	0	1	0	0	0	4
Joe		Morgan		0	0	1	0	1	4
Oscar		Charleston	0	0	0	1	1	3
Harry		Heilmann	0	0	1	0	0	3
Mike		Piazza		0	0	0	0	3	3
Al		Simmons		0	0	0	0	3	3
Pete		Rose		0	0	0	1	0	2
Sam		Thompson	0	0	0	1	0	2
Jeff		Bagwell		0	0	0	0	1	1
Wade		Boggs		0	0	0	0	1	1
Ken		Griffey Jr.	0	0	0	0	1	1
Pop		Lloyd		0	0	0	0	1	1
Manny		Ramirez		0	0	0	0	1	1
Ichiro		Suzuki		0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 23.
    Code:
    FirstName	LastName	First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Alex		Rodriguez	3	3	3	2	3	43
Hank		Greenberg	1	4	2	5	2	39
Dan		Brouthers	3	2	3	2	2	38
Eddie		Collins		1	1	2	1	1	18
Johnny		Mize		0	1	0	3	4	14
Tony		Gwynn		0	0	1	3	0	9
Mark		McGwire		0	1	1	0	0	7
Jeff		Bagwell		0	0	1	1	0	5
Ed		Delahanty	0	1	0	0	1	5
George		Brett		0	0	0	1	2	4
Oscar		Charleston	0	0	1	0	1	4
Sam		Crawford	0	1	0	0	0	4
Rickey		Henderson	0	1	0	0	0	4
Joe		Morgan		0	0	1	0	1	4
Mike		Piazza		0	0	0	1	2	4
Harry		Heilmann	0	0	1	0	0	3
Al		Simmons		0	0	0	0	3	3
Ken		Griffey Jr.	0	0	0	0	2	2
Manny		Ramirez		0	0	0	0	2	2
Pete		Rose		0	0	0	1	0	2
Wade		Boggs		0	0	0	0	1	1
Pop		Lloyd		0	0	0	0	1	1
Eddie		Mathews		0	0	0	0	1	1
Ichiro		Suzuki		0	0	0	0	1	1
Sam		Thompson	0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 24.
    Code:
    FirstName	LastName	First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Hank		Greenberg	2	2	3	5	2	39
Dan		Brouthers	3	0	3	4	1	33
Eddie		Collins		1	1	1	1	4	18
Johnny		Mize		1	0	1	3	4	18
Tony		Gwynn		0	0	2	2	0	10
Oscar		Charleston	0	1	0	0	2	6
Jeff		Bagwell		0	1	1	0	0	7
Mark		McGwire		0	1	1	0	0	7
Ed		Delahanty	0	1	0	0	1	5
Mike		Piazza		0	0	1	0	2	5
George		Brett		0	0	0	1	2	4
Sam		Crawford	0	1	0	0	0	4
Rickey		Henderson	0	1	0	0	0	4
Eddie		Mathews		0	0	1	0	1	4
Joe		Morgan		0	0	1	0	1	4
Ken		Griffey Jr.	0	0	0	1	1	3
Harry		Heilmann	0	0	1	0	0	3
Manny		Ramirez		0	0	0	1	1	3
Al		Simmons		0	0	0	0	3	3
Pete		Rose		0	0	0	1	0	2
Cap		Anson		0	0	0	0	1	1
Wade		Boggs		0	0	0	0	1	1
Roger		Connor		0	0	0	0	1	1
Pop		Lloyd		0	0	0	0	1	1
Edgar		Martinez	0	0	0	0	1	1
Ichiro		Suzuki		0	0	0	0	1	1
Sam		Thompson	0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 25.
    Code:
    FirstName	LastName	First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Dan		Brouthers	3	0	2	5	1	32
Johnny		Mize		1	1	1	2	4	20
Eddie		Collins		1	0	2	3	2	19
Tony		Gwynn		0	1	1	2	0	11
Jeff		Bagwell		0	2	0	0	0	8
Oscar		Charleston	1	0	0	0	2	7
Ed		Delahanty	0	1	0	0	3	7
Mike		Piazza		0	0	1	1	2	7
Mark		McGwire		0	1	0	1	0	6
George		Brett		0	0	0	1	2	4
Sam		Crawford	0	1	0	0	0	4
Harry		Heilmann	0	0	1	0	1	4
Rickey		Henderson	0	1	0	0	0	4
Eddie		Mathews		0	0	1	0	1	4
Joe		Morgan		0	0	1	0	1	4
Roger		Connor		0	0	1	0	0	3
Manny		Ramirez		0	0	0	1	1	3
Al		Simmons		0	0	0	0	3	3
Pete		Rose		0	0	0	1	0	2
Cap		Anson		0	0	0	0	1	1
Wade		Boggs		0	0	0	0	1	1
Ken		Griffey Jr.	0	0	0	0	1	1
Pop		Lloyd		0	0	0	0	1	1
Edgar		Martinez	0	0	0	0	1	1
Ichiro		Suzuki		0	0	0	0	1	1
Sam		Thompson	0	0	0	0	1	1
    Round 26.
    Code:
    FirstName	LastName	First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth	Total
Johnny		Mize		2	2	0	2	4	26
Eddie		Collins		1	0	3	2	3	21
Tony		Gwynn		0	1	1	2	1	12
Mike		Piazza		1	0	2	0	1	12
Jeff		Bagwell		1	1	0	1	0	11
Ed		Delahanty	0	1	0	2	2	10
Oscar		Charleston	1	0	0	1	1	8
Mark		McGwire		0	1	0	1	0	6
George		Brett		0	0	0	1	3	5
Sam		Crawford	0	1	0	0	1	5
Harry		Heilmann	0	0	1	1	0	5
Roger		Connor		0	1	0	0	0	4
Rickey		Henderson	0	1	0	0	0	4
Eddie		Mathews		0	0	1	0	1	4
Joe		Morgan		0	0	1	0	1	4
Manny		Ramirez		0	0	0	1	1	3
Al		Simmons		0	0	0	0	3	3
Pete		Rose		0	0	0	1	0	2
Cap		Anson		0	0	0	0	1	1
Wade		Boggs		0	0	0	0	1	1
Ken		Griffey Jr.	0	0	0	0	1	1
Pop		Lloyd		0	0	0	0	1	1
Edgar		Martinez	0	0	0	0	1	1
Ichiro		Suzuki		0	0	0	0	1	1
Sam		Thompson	0	0	0	0	1	1
    Tags: None
  • #2
    Reference Resources:

    Relative SLG. Ave. is the 1st number, and serves as presumption unless I note mitigating factors.

    1. Babe Ruth - 172.5 - 13 SLG. titles - 10,504 PA - 207 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 303. Need I say more? Nuff said.

    2. Ted Williams - 154.9 - 9 SLG. titles - 9786 PA - 185 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 220. Takes 2nd nicely. Missing war yrs.? Offset by Babe's "missing pitching yrs."

    3. Ty Cobb - 141.4 - 8 SLG. titles - 12,777 PA- 167 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 159. Ranks above others with higher SLG. AVE., due to more titles, over a much longer career, higher PA, extended decline phase. Differences in PA with Hornsby equals 7 full seasons of decline.

    4. Rogers Hornsby - 147.3. - 9 titles - 9259 PA - 175 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 203. High SLG. Ave./titles earn high ranking.

    5. Lou Gehrig - 154.0 - 2 SLG. titles - 9954 PA - 179 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 230. Ave. held up well, of course due to lack of decline phase, hence low PA. Only won 2 titles.

    6. Barry Bonds - 148.0 - 7 SLG. titles - 12,606 PA - 182 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 213. I had him ranked 2nd, but his admitted steroid usage drops him IMHO. Had too great an advantage over his peers.

    7. Honus Wagner - 132.9 - 6 SLG. Titles - 11,731 PA - 150 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 167

    8. Willie Mays - 139.2 - 5 SLG. titles - 12,480 PA - 156 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 186.

    9. Mickey Mantle - 143.8 - 4 SLG. titles - 9895 PA - 172 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 198. Too few titles over relatively weak sluggers.

    10. Hank Aaron - 140.6 - 4 SLG. titles - 13,919 PA - 155 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 187. Too few titles over long career.

    11. Jimmy Foxx - 143.7 - 5 SLG. titles - 9,599 PA - 163 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 214. Too few PA relative to Aaron/Mays.

    12. Joe Jackson - 1.45.2 - 1 SLG. title - 5690 PA - 170 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 187. Too few PA to rank higher - Placed in top 5 SLG. all his 9 yrs.; 2nd 3 times, once 3rd, 2 4ths, 2 5ths.

    13. Stan Musial- 137.1 - 6 SLG. Titles - 12,712 PA - 159 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 168.

    14. Tris Speaker - 134.3 - 1 SLG. Title - 11,988 PA - 158 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 163.

    15. Nap Lajoie - 133.9 - 4 SLG. Titles - 10,460 PA - 150 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 159

    16. Mike Schmidt - 133.6 - 5 SLG. Titles - 10, 062 PA - 147 OPS+ - Rel. ISO - 205.

    17. Hank Greenberg - 1.44.3 - 1 SLG. Title - 6,096 - 158 OPS+. Lost 4.5 seasons to WWII. Age 30-34. Out of game by age 36 spared him his decline phase.

    18. Joe DiMaggio - 142.9 - 2 SLG. Titles - 7,671 PA - 155 OPS+. His numbers appear worse due to Yankee Stadium, but better due to lack of decline phase. Lost 3 prime seasons to WWII.

    19. Dan Brouthers - 1.40.6 - 7 SLG. Titles - 7,658 PA - 170 OPS+. Too few PA to rank higher.

    20. Ed Delahanty - 1.33.5 - 5 SLB. Titles - 8,389 PA - 152 OPS+. Too few PA to rank higher.

    Sluggers such as Greenberg, McGwire, DiMaggio, Mize and Brouthers all had PA fewer than 7,700. Honorable Mentions to Richie Allen, Frank Thomas.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Code:
    [B][COLOR=Red]My Candidates for Most Impressive Hitting Peak Ever:[/COLOR][/B]

1. Barry Bonds - 2001-2004,---------244 OPS+

2. Babe Ruth - 1920-1924,-----------221 OPS+

3. Ted Williams - 1942-1949,--------209 OPS+

4. Rogers Hornsby - 1921-1925,------202 OPS+

5. Ty Cobb - 1909-1913,-------------197 OPS+

6. Lou Gehrig - 1927-1934,----------193 OPS+

7. Mickey Mantle - 1956-1962,-------191 OPS+

8. Honus Wagner - 1905-1909,--------187 OPS+

9. Stan Musial - 1943-1948,---------174 OPS+
--------------------------------------------------------------------
[B][COLOR="Red"]Win Shares:[/COLOR][/B]
as compiled by Chris (538280)

Wagner 1905-1909: 237
Ruth 1920-1924: 233
Bonds 2000-2004: 227
Williams 1941-1949: 220
Cobb 1909-1913: 207
Mantle 1956-1960: 205
Morgan 1972-1976: 197
Gehrig 1927-1931: 193
Musial 1943-1948: 192 
Hornsby 1921-1925: 188

[B][COLOR="red"]WARP3[/COLOR][/B]-this has a LQ adjustment and it adjusted for the 162 game vs. 154 game schedule in case you don't know

Bonds 2000-2004: 71.7
Ruth 1920-1924: 71.5
Williams: 1941-1948: 69.0
Morgan 1972-1976: 66.3
Hornsby 1921-1925: 63.6
Wagner 1905-1909: 62.8
Musial 1943-1948: 61.3
Mantle 1956-1960: 61.1
Gehrig 1927-1931: 57.3
Cobb 1909-1913: 54.4
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Relative Stats: courtesy of David Kent:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Rel Rel Through 2003, over 5,000 PA, indexed and park adjusted.
    Code:
    Pro+  OBA  Slg                                      Rel     Rel
Rank Rank Rank  Player               PA    Pro+     OBA     Slg
----------------------------------------------------------------

  1    2    1   Babe Ruth          10504   207.0   134.5   172.5 
  2    1    2   Ted Williams        9786   189.5   134.6   154.9
  3   11    3   Lou Gehrig          9554   180.4   126.4   154.0
  4    3    4   Barry Bonds        10963   180.0   131.6   148.4
  5    8    5   Rogers Hornsby      9259   174.7   127.4   147.3
  8   16    6   Joe Jackson         5559   168.7   123.9   144.8
 16  102    7   Hank Greenberg      6061   157.3   113.5   143.9
  6    5    8   Mickey Mantle       9895   172.1   128.3   143.8
 11   40    9   Mark McGwire        7657   162.8   119.0   143.8
 13   43   10   Jimmie Foxx         9599   161.6   117.9   143.7
 21  122   11   Joe DiMaggio        7657   155.6   112.7   142.9
 17   78   12   Johnny Mize         7351   157.0   114.9   142.1
  7    4   13   Dan Brouthers       7656   170.9   129.4   141.4
  9   10   14   Ty Cobb            12777   168.4   127.0   141.4
 22   83   15   Hank Aaron         13919   155.2   114.6   140.6
 18   54   16   Dick Allen          7295   156.7   116.8   140.0
 20   53   17   Willie Mays        12480   156.0   116.8   139.2
 25   52   18   Mike Piazza         6007   154.7   117.0   137.7
 14   24   19   Stan Musial        12677   158.2   121.1   137.1
 38  192   20   Willie Stargell     9017   147.1   110.0   137.1
 19   36   21   Manny Ramirez       5910   156.5   119.8   136.7
 26   41   22   Frank Robinson     11726   154.0   118.5   135.5
 12    9   23   Frank Thomas        8167   162.6   127.3   135.3
 10    6   24   Pete Browning       5315   163.2   128.0   135.3
 15   18   25   Tris Speaker       11679   157.4   123.0   134.3
 23   25   26   Mel Ott            11228   155.0   120.9   134.1
 48  215   27   Albert Belle        6669   142.9   108.9   134.0
 33   60   28   Nap Lajoie         10239   150.0   116.1   133.9
 35   86   29   Ralph Kiner         6247   148.0   114.4   133.7
 40  111   30   Mike Schmidt       10046   146.8   113.2   133.6
 41  131   31   Sam Thompson        6497   145.4   111.9   133.5
 29   42   32   Ed Delahanty        8340   151.5   118.1   133.4
 42  159   33   Ken Griffey Jr.     8161   144.0   110.9   133.1
 32   48   34   Honus Wagner       11518   150.4   117.6   132.9
 36   77   35   Willie McCovey      9681   147.7   114.9   132.9
 43  153   36   Alex Rodriguez      5671   143.9   111.1   132.7
 24   21   37   Roger Connor        8834   154.9   122.2   132.6
 46  158   38   Sam Crawford       10353   143.5   110.9   132.5
 93  514   39   Juan Gonzalez       7014   133.3   100.8   132.5
 49  163   40   Frank Howard        7346   142.8   110.7   132.2
 57  226   41   Jeff Heath          5540   140.4   108.6   131.8
 64  272   42   Wally Berger        5636   138.8   107.2   131.6
 39   66   43   Harry Heilmann      8683   147.0   115.7   131.2
 30   35   44   Jim Thome           6420   150.9   119.8   131.0
 27   20   45   Jeff Bagwell        8626   153.4   122.3   131.0
 44  118   46   Hack Wilson         5454   143.7   112.8   130.9
 50  125   47   Harry Stovey        6832   142.8   112.5   130.3
 58  165   48   Babe Herman         6134   140.2   110.6   129.6
 66  205   49   Darryl Strawberry   6325   138.6   109.3   129.3
102  419   50   Sammy Sosa          8462   132.4   103.1   129.3



      Rel  Rel
Pro+  OBA  Slg                                      Rel     Rel
Rank Rank Rank  Player               PA    Pro+     OBA     Slg
----------------------------------------------------------------
  2    1    2   Ted Williams        9786   189.5   134.6   154.9
  1    2    1   Babe Ruth          10504   207.0   134.5   172.5
  4    3    4   Barry Bonds        10963   180.0   131.6   148.4
  7    4   13   Dan Brouthers       7656   170.9   129.4   141.4
  6    5    8   Mickey Mantle       9895   172.1   128.3   143.8
 10    6   24   Pete Browning       5315   163.2   128.0   135.3
 59    7  267   Billy Hamilton      7544   140.0   127.6   112.4
  5    8    5   Rogers Hornsby      9259   174.7   127.4   147.3
 12    9   23   Frank Thomas        8167   162.6   127.3   135.3
  9   10   14   Ty Cobb            12777   168.4   127.0   141.4
  3   11    3   Lou Gehrig          9554   180.4   126.4   154.0
192   12  582   Roy Thomas          6409   123.6   126.3    97.3
 31   13   74   Edgar Martinez      8113   150.7   125.7   125.1
 52   14  156   Eddie Collins      11525   142.4   124.4   118.1
 28   15   53   Jason Giambi        5460   152.7   123.9   128.8
  8   16    6   Joe Jackson         5559   168.7   123.9   144.8
140   17  420   Rickey Henderson   13316   128.6   123.4   105.2
 15   18   25   Tris Speaker       11679   157.4   123.0   134.3
126   19  372   Wade Boggs         10711   130.0   123.0   107.0
 27   20   45   Jeff Bagwell        8626   153.4   122.3   131.0
 24   21   37   Roger Connor        8834   154.9   122.2   132.6
 82   22  246   George Gore         6104   135.0   122.0   113.1
 76   23  208   Gene Tenace         5504   136.3   121.2   115.0
 14   24   19   Stan Musial        12677   158.2   121.1   137.1
 23   25   26   Mel Ott            11228   155.0   120.9   134.1
232   26  531   Mike Hargrove       6649   121.0   120.8   100.2
105   27  285   Joe Morgan         11278   132.1   120.5   111.6
 34   28   54   Elmer Flick         6293   149.2   120.5   128.7
 56   29  118   Cap Anson          11292   140.9   120.4   120.5
 60   30  137   Jesse Burkett       9525   139.5   120.3   119.2
 37   31   60   Gary Sheffield      8026   147.5   120.1   127.4
419   32  705   Eddie Stanky        5332   109.0   120.0    88.9
143   33  351   Topsy Hartsel       5697   127.9   119.9   108.0
120   34  300   Rod Carew          10422   131.0   119.9   111.1
 30   35   44   Jim Thome           6420   150.9   119.8   131.0
 19   36   21   Manny Ramirez       5910   156.5   119.8   136.7
103   37  260   John Olerud         8360   132.3   119.6   112.7
 81   38  194   Arky Vaughan        7605   135.4   119.5   115.9
107   39  254   Ken Singleton       8529   132.1   119.2   112.9
 11   40    9   Mark McGwire        7657   162.8   119.0   143.8
 26   41   22   Frank Robinson     11726   154.0   118.5   135.5
 29   42   32   Ed Delahanty        8340   151.5   118.1   133.4
 13   43   10   Jimmie Foxx         9599   161.6   117.9   143.7
 99   44  209   Tony Gwynn         10187   132.6   117.8   114.8
 47   45   71   Chipper Jones       6064   143.2   117.8   125.4
388   46  649   Richie Ashburn      9624   110.9   117.8    93.1
111   47  226   Jackie Robinson     5698   131.7   117.7   114.0
 32   48   34   Honus Wagner       11518   150.4   117.6   132.9
167   49  345   Roger Bresnahan     5262   126.0   117.5   108.5
118   50  229   Ross Youngs         5214   131.3   117.4   113.9
    __________________
    Dave Kent
    Code:
    Relative BA, after 2005:

BA+   Player (thru '05) baseball-reference.com
[COLOR="Red"]Currently active players are high-lighted in RED.[/COLOR]

1. 134.8 Cobb      CF
2. 133.1 JJackson
3. 130.8 Browning
5. 128.1 TWilliams LF
6. 127.8 Dan Brouthers 
7. 127.7 Gwynn     RF
8. 127.4 Lajoie    2B
9. [COLOR="Red"]127.2 Ichiro[/COLOR]
10. 127.0 Carew
11. 126.2 Hornsby
12. 125.4 Speaker
13. [COLOR="red"]125.3 Pujols[/COLOR]
14. 124.4 Tip O'Neill
15. 124.4 Keeler
16. 123.9 Musial    1B
17. 123.7 Boggs     3B
18. 123.6 Donlin
19. 123.1 Wagner    SS
20. 122.8 Anson
21. 122.7 Hamilton
22. 122.6 Delahanty
23. 121.8 ECollins
24. 121.6 Burkett
25. 121.0 Puckett 
26. 120.7 Clemente
27. 120.4 Oliva
28. 120.3 SThompson
29. 119.4 Heilmann
30. 119.2 Ruth
31. 118.9 Sisler
32. 118.8 Crawford 
33. 118.5 KKelly
34. 118.1 Connor
35. 117.9 MoAlou
36. [COLOR="red"]117.8 Piazza   C[/COLOR]
37. 117.8 Medwick
38. 117.8 PWaner
39. 117.7 O'Rourke
40. 117.4 Flick
41. 117.3 BTerry
42. 117.2 Gehrig
43. 117.1 JDiMaggio
44. 117.0 Beaumont
45. 116.9 EMartinez
46. 116.9 Mattingly
47. 116.7 Garr
48. 116.4 Mota
49. 116.3 Brett
50. 116.3 DMitchell
51. 116.2 JMcGraw
52. 116.2 LWalker v
53. 116.0 Aaron 
57. 115.6 Rose 
59. 115.4 Al Simmons
60. 115.4 Frank Baker 

[COLOR="red"]66. 115.0 Mantle [/COLOR]
67. 115.0 Johnny Mize
71. 114.9 Wheat 
82. 114.3 Mays 
75. [COLOR="red"]114.6 FThomas[/COLOR]
90. 113.8 Foxx 
92. 113.8 Roush 
99. 113.4 Frank Robinson

    Comment

    • #3
      My Slate of Candidates for 25th Greatest Hitter:

      1. Oscar Charleston
      2. Tony Gwynn
      3. Eddie Collins
      4. Ed Delahanty
      5. Sam Crawford

      Honorable Mentions:
      Cap Anson

      Might I persuade any of you guys to consider voting in our other polls?

      62th Greatest Player

      30th Greatest Pitcher

      Wagner/Mays?

      I would consider it a great favor if you did.

      Comment

      • #4
        1. Ed Delahanty
        2. Mark McGwire
        3. Wade Boggs
        4. Eddie Collins
        5. Al Simmons
        My top 10 players:

        1. Babe Ruth
        2. Barry Bonds
        3. Ty Cobb
        4. Ted Williams
        5. Willie Mays
        6. Alex Rodriguez
        7. Hank Aaron
        8. Honus Wagner
        9. Lou Gehrig
        10. Mickey Mantle

        Comment

        • #5
          Roger Connor
          Mike Piazza
          Harry Heilmann
          Brett
          Gwynn

          Delahanty
          Ken Griffey Jr.
          Oscar Charleston
          Eddie Collins
          Wade Boggs
          Last edited by PVNICK; 03-07-2012, 03:54 AM. Reason: add Boggs after brain fart noted

          Comment

          • #6
            This is an interesting phenomenon. We've gone through 62 rounds of greatest position player, now working on round 63. As it looks now, Tony Gwynn may end up somewhere around number 70 alltime among position players.

            We've finished 26 rounds of greatest hitter, working on round 27. Tony Gwynn finished 3rd in round 26, and is on 2 of the 3 ballots cast so far for round 27. Seems like there's a good chance that Gwynn will get the nod as the 28th or 29th greatest hitter of all time.

            Now let me get this straight. Gwynn was a very good defensive rightfielder for most of his career. He was a very good baserunner for most of his career. And, those who've voted for greatest player certainly had to be thinking about Gwynn's hitting when they consider him, since that's what he's best known for. BUT, he looks like he's going to come in around number 70.

            If he's a good defensive RFer, a very good baserunner- no demerits there- and he's going to be around the number 70 alltime position player- why is he looking good to be the 28th or 29th or so greatest hitter? This doesn't compute.

            The other way of looking at it is, if Gwynn is the 28th or 29th greatest hitter, AND a plus defender at his position, AND a plus baserunner- why isn't he considerably higher in the greatest player ranking? After all, hitting makes up the largest value component of any position player, except for a handful of weak hitting defensive specialists at critical positions.

            Actually, I think the player ranking is reasonable- I might have Gwynn a little higher as a player, but not a lot. However, I think Gwynn is overplaced in the high 20s as a hitter. A great hitter, yes- but not as high as he's getting credit for here. I see Gwynn as a top 50 hitter, but not much higher than that. And, number 50 as a hitter would reconcile much better with the votes he's getting as a position player.
            Last edited by BigRon; 03-06-2012, 06:33 PM.

            Comment

            • #7
              I agree that Gwynn is getting overplaced as a hitter and it baffles me that so many are ranking him at least 5 spots ahead of Boggs, who was clearly a much better offensive player at his peak, despite the baserunning disadvantage.
              My top 10 players:

              1. Babe Ruth
              2. Barry Bonds
              3. Ty Cobb
              4. Ted Williams
              5. Willie Mays
              6. Alex Rodriguez
              7. Hank Aaron
              8. Honus Wagner
              9. Lou Gehrig
              10. Mickey Mantle

              Comment

              • #8
                Originally posted by GiambiJuice View Post
                I agree that Gwynn is getting overplaced as a hitter and it baffles me that so many are ranking him at least 5 spots ahead of Boggs, who was clearly a much better offensive player at his peak, despite the baserunning disadvantage.
                hahaha there's only about three people listing ballots so I wonder who you might be referencing. I edited to put him up on my ballot, admittedly only at 10.

                Comment

                • #9
                  Originally posted by PVNICK View Post
                  hahaha there's only about three people listing ballots so I wonder who you might be referencing. I edited to put him up on my ballot, admittedly only at 10.
                  I was just responding to BigRon's post. Based on the voting in past few rounds it looks like Gwynn will be selected this round or next.
                  My top 10 players:

                  1. Babe Ruth
                  2. Barry Bonds
                  3. Ty Cobb
                  4. Ted Williams
                  5. Willie Mays
                  6. Alex Rodriguez
                  7. Hank Aaron
                  8. Honus Wagner
                  9. Lou Gehrig
                  10. Mickey Mantle

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    Originally posted by PVNICK View Post
                    hahaha there's only about three people listing ballots so I wonder who you might be referencing. I edited to put him up on my ballot, admittedly only at 10.
                    If you go back and look at the last couple of rounds you'll see he's near the top. That's usually an indicator that he'll win soon.

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      It appears that Gwynn will be ranked too high as a hitter or too low as a player. Or somewhere in the middle. Perhaps somewhat lower as a hitter and higher as a player.

                      The other possibility is that Fever is going on a very tiny sampling of members who are actually voting. With 5 voters, these crude rankings happen.

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        I'll post my votes later today.

                        Comment

                        • #13
                          Okay- better late than never.

                          1. Jeff Bagwell
                          2. Oscar Charleston- who knows?
                          3. Manny ramirez
                          4. Eddie Mathews
                          5. Ed Delahanty

                          6. Mark McGwire
                          7. Dan Brouthers- I hate rating the ultra- old timers
                          8. Mike Piazza
                          9. Harmon killebrew
                          10. George Brett

                          Comment

                          • #14
                            Mike Piazza
                            Manny Ramirez
                            Jeff Bagwell
                            Eddie Collins
                            Gary Sheffield

                            Comment

                            • #15
                              Mike Piazza
                              Manny Ramirez
                              Jim Thome
                              Harry Heilmann
                              Jeff bagwell

                              Comment

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