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Name some players that weren't good in the minors, but took off once promoted?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules View Post
    The Royals lit lots of doubles during their glory years. The home park was built for doubles and triples. Here is their rank in doubles from 1975-85,

    1975-2nd
    1976- 1st
    1977- 1st
    1978- 1st
    1979- 4th
    1980- 3rd
    1981- 3rd
    1982- 1st
    1983- 6th
    1984- 3rd
    1985- 6th

    Just glancing at Brett's 1978 splits he hit an incredible 31 doubles in just 67 home games. He hit 14 doubles in 61 road games.
    Yea, to be clear, my point was that Brett's "emergence" may have been somewhat of an illusion. He was trained and built to excell in a certain ballpark which made his first few years stats look like he took off, but we don't know if he "could" have hit .300 on the road until about 1980, and then '82 on where he stopped benefitting from R.S. as he hit it in the air more, took more walks, and ran less.

    For his career, Brett had 97 triples at home and 40 on the road and most of that disparity came through '79, but he ended up with 181 road HRs and 136 at home (because RS was fairly expansive).

    Check out the BA splits though:

    Home/Road
    '74: .310/.257
    '75: .362/.255
    '76: .367/.301
    '77: .337/.287 (did hit 12 home runs on the road)
    '78: .352/.233
    '79: .373/.283 (12 home runs on the road though)
    line
    Only '76, '77 and '79 would have been all star type years based on his road stats (plus given a usual 4-5% rate boost at home). Clearly, the Charlie Lau Approach, R.S. and George Brett's hard grounder/line drive hitting and aggressive running approach meshed in those years and also probably hurt him on the road where grounders were more likely to turn into outs. What really was Brett through '79? He probably was a .285 hitter with 25 home run power given a normal approach in a normal park which is a lot more in line with his minor league numbers that show pretty good power but not a .300 hitter. He still hit .290 on the road for his career which is in line with about a .300 overall average especially with a different earlt approach.
    Last edited by brett; 06-12-2012, 08:33 AM.

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    • #17
      Robinson Cano was nothing special in the minors, but has been a .300+ hitter since being called up to the majors.
      My top 10 players:

      1. Babe Ruth
      2. Barry Bonds
      3. Ty Cobb
      4. Ted Williams
      5. Willie Mays
      6. Alex Rodriguez
      7. Hank Aaron
      8. Honus Wagner
      9. Lou Gehrig
      10. Mickey Mantle

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Jobu Voodoo View Post
        Was that a serious question or were you making a joke?
        No, it was serious

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Cap78 View Post
          how can they get to the majors if they weren't good in the minors?
          The easiest way is to get called up because someone is injured.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Cap78 View Post
            No, it was serious
            OK. Like Ed said, the most common reason would be due to an injury. Additionally, sometimes if a player is deemed to be a future star, he might be called up even if he isn't doing that great in the minors to give him a kick in the ass by means of a trial by fire. Not to mention, they might also do it just to fill a certain need. A player might not be doing that great offensively, but he could exhibit stellar defense, and perhaps the team needs the defense so they call him up. I mean, there are various reasons.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
              They tried to hide Clemente by playing him infrequently and other sabotage efforts check out his games played and plate appearances

              it didnt work
              Yeah, I see that. He should have about 3 times as many AB. Why would they try to hide Clemente (or did I miss something earlier in the post)?

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Jobu Voodoo View Post
                Yeah, I see that. He should have about 3 times as many AB. Why would they try to hide Clemente (or did I miss something earlier in the post)?
                According to this article because of Clemente's large signing bonus he had to be exposed to some kind of draft. I don't know what draft this was and the rules for player eligibilty for it? The Pirates selected Clemente. Can you imagine Clemente on the Dodgers?!! He would have been part of the Dodger World Series clubs in '55, '59, 63, '65, and '66.

                http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...lemente/page/7
                Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

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                • #23
                  hoping nobody would draft him

                  it did not work

                  there is some good info on this on clemente's bio by marannis

                  http://www.amazon.com/Clemente-Passi.../dp/0743217810



                  Originally posted by Jobu Voodoo View Post
                  Yeah, I see that. He should have about 3 times as many AB. Why would they try to hide Clemente (or did I miss something earlier in the post)?
                  1. The more I learn, the more convinced I am that many players are over-rated due to inflated stats from offensive home parks (and eras)
                  2. Strat-O-Matic Baseball Player, Collector and Hobbyist since 1969, visit my strat site: http://forums.delphiforums.com/GamersParadise
                  3. My table top gaming blog: http://cary333.blogspot.com/

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                  • #24
                    If Clemente had stayed with the Dodgers would he be viewed today as an even greater player? Would he have blocked Frank Howard in right field?
                    Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
                      hoping nobody would draft him

                      it did not work

                      there is some good info on this on clemente's bio by marannis

                      http://www.amazon.com/Clemente-Passi.../dp/0743217810
                      Sorry, I'm still a little confused as I am not that familiar with the 60's considering my age. Who was trying to prevent him from being drafted???

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                      • #26
                        it was the fifties

                        Clemente was property of the Dodgers (minor leagues) and they tried to hide him by not playing him much


                        there is a winter draft for players not on the main rosters and the Dodgers hoped by not playing him no one would draft him

                        the Pirates (I believe with the first pick) drafted him

                        The talent-laden Dodger organization of the mid-1950s knew it would be difficult for the teenager to break into the majors with the Dodgers, so they tried to hide him in the minors. They were fearful that another team would draft him after the 1954 season. (There was a rule stating that any player who received a bonus of at least $4,000 had to be placed on the major league roster within a year or he could be drafted for $4,000.) Though Clemente batted only 148 times for the Montreal Royals, the Dodgers' top farm team, and hit just .257 with two homers and 12 RBI, their fears proved justified. The Pirates drafted him that November.



                        Roberto Clemente was not drafted (the MLB draft began in 1965) but instead was signed as a free agent by the Brooklyn Dodgers prior to the 1952 season.

                        He subsequently went to the Pirates as a Rule 5 draftee after the 1954 season


                        Read more: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Was_Robert...#ixzz1xeHG7k00


                        http://pabook.libraries.psu.edu/pali...__Roberto.html

                        Fifteen months after Campanis scouted Clemente, the Brooklyn Dodgers drafted him. He was assigned to play for the Dodgers minor league team, the Montreal Royals. In the past, Major League Baseball had practice called a bonus player salary. If a player in the minors was paid less than $6,000, he would become a free agent the next year and anyone could draft him. Brooklyn decided to keep Clemente in the minors so that he would gain some experience, but they made the mistake of keeping his salary below the $6,000 mark. The next year, on November 22, 1954, the Pittsburgh Pirates had the privilege of the #1 pick and they picked Roberto Clemente.



                        Originally posted by Jobu Voodoo View Post
                        Sorry, I'm still a little confused as I am not that familiar with the 60's considering my age. Who was trying to prevent him from being drafted???
                        Last edited by 9RoyHobbsRF; 06-12-2012, 10:41 PM.
                        1. The more I learn, the more convinced I am that many players are over-rated due to inflated stats from offensive home parks (and eras)
                        2. Strat-O-Matic Baseball Player, Collector and Hobbyist since 1969, visit my strat site: http://forums.delphiforums.com/GamersParadise
                        3. My table top gaming blog: http://cary333.blogspot.com/

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Clemente's AAA numbers are very good for a 19 year old, indicative of a player who's probably going to make the majors and stick around for a while.
                          "If I drink whiskey, I'll never get worms!" - Hack Wilson

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                          • #28
                            Wow. I wonder if they just didn't want to pay the extra money or if they were unaware of the rule.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Jobu Voodoo View Post
                              Wow. I wonder if they just didn't want to pay the extra money or if they were unaware of the rule.
                              If the Dodgers paid Clemente a bigger bonus, he would have been a Bonus Bay and woud have had to spend two years on the Dodgers bench. The Dodgers were very aware of what they were doing. If Landis were the Commissioner at this time, he may have made Clemente a free agent. This kind of hiding players in the Minor Leagues was common before the player draft started.

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                              • #30
                                Vinny Castilla

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