Hey, I was wondering if anyone could list off some players that weren't that good in the minors, but were promoted based on need and then took off the moment they hit the majors? It seems like it'd take quite a bit of searching to actually find the players, but maybe some of you know of some players off the top of your head.
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Name some players that weren't good in the minors, but took off once promoted?
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I'm gonna guess they never thought Geogre Brett was going to be a player to challenge .400 or win 3 battling crowns.
He was an OK batter in the Minors...
Code:Year Age Tm Lg Lev Aff G PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB BA OBP SLG OPS 1971 18 Billings PION Rk KCR 68 258 75 8 5 5 .291 .419 1972 19 SanJose CALL A KCR 117 484 431 66 118 13 5 10 68 53 .274 .353 .397 .750 1973 20 Omaha AA AAA KCR 117 405 115 16 4 8 .284 .402 1974 21 Omaha AA AAA KCR 16 70 64 9 17 2 0 2 14 6 .266 .329 .391 .719 4 Seasons 318 1217 1158 75 325 39 14 25 82 59 .281 .316 .403 .719 AAA (2 seasons) AAA 133 475 469 9 132 18 4 10 14 6 .281 .291 .401 .691 A (1 season) A 117 484 431 66 118 13 5 10 68 53 .274 .353 .397 .750 Rk (1 season) Rk 68 258 258 75 8 5 5 .291 .291 .419 .709
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Roberto Clemente
Code:Year Age Tm Lg Lev Aff G PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB 1954 19 Montreal IL AAA BRO 87 155 148 27 38 5 3 2 12 1 6 17 .257 .286 .372 .657 55 0 1 0 1 Season 87 155 148 27 38 5 3 2 12 1 6 17 .257 .286 .372 .657 55 0 1 0
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I don't think we can just look at stats without any context and decide on the quality of a hitter. Yes, Brett's minor league stats are pedestrian on the surface but how scouts viewed his baseball tools is also an important factor. Brett was always young for his leagues. It seems plausible that the Royals thought highly of him. In the past few years I've spent quite a bit of time reading scouting reports by baseball scouts and learning the methodology of scouting. Often scouts will rate a player highly even if his stats are mediocre especially when a player is young for his league and/or he plays in a pitching dominated league. To baseball scouts age and "tools" are the major factors in "projecting" what kind of major leaguer a young prospect will be. I suspect Brett displayed great baseball tools in the minors despite his average minor league stats. Brett reached AAA at age 20. That is very young for AAA. Brett debuted in the majors later that same year (1973). Reaching the majors at age 20 is very uncommon even today. So the Royals must have seen something in Brett to promote him to the majors at such a young age. Brett struggled in the first part of the 1974 season and sought help from Charlie Lau. Lau is credited in helping Brett become an elite major league hitter.
A side story. In 1990 I worked during the summer in college cleaning dorm rooms. My supervisor played against George Brett many times in high school. He told me that Brett could really rake in high school and he was scouted heavily.Last edited by Honus Wagner Rules; 06-08-2012, 05:48 PM.Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis
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Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules View PostI don't think we can just look at stats without any context and decide on the quality of a hitter. Yes, Brett's minor league stats are pedestrian on the surface but how scouts viewed his baseball tools is also an important factor.
But I've been looking at other batters of Brett's ilk, and it's hard to find one who DIDN'T hit .300 in the minors at least once. I'm sure the scouts saw something in Brett, but you have to admit that it's more than fair to say he "took off" once in the majors.
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Tom Glavine's (pre-MLB) AA + AAA ERA was higher than his MLB ERA, despite pitching in a high-offensive environment in his MLB career in comparison. And I bet at some point in about 1988 or so, Glavine started second-guessing his choice to play baseball instead of the LA Kings.1885 1886 1926 1931 1934 1942 1944 1946 1964 1967 1982 2006 2011
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The Top 100 Pitchers In MLB History
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They tried to hide Clemente by playing him infrequently and other sabotage efforts check out his games played and plate appearances
it didnt work
Originally posted by dgarza View PostRoberto Clemente
Code:Year Age Tm Lg Lev Aff G PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB 1954 19 Montreal IL AAA BRO 87 155 148 27 38 5 3 2 12 1 6 17 .257 .286 .372 .657 55 0 1 0 1 Season 87 155 148 27 38 5 3 2 12 1 6 17 .257 .286 .372 .657 55 0 1 0
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Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules View PostI don't think we can just look at stats without any context and decide on the quality of a hitter. Yes, Brett's minor league stats are pedestrian on the surface but how scouts viewed his baseball tools is also an important factor. Brett was always young for his leagues. It seems plausible that the Royals thought highly of him. In the past few years I've spent quite a bit of time reading scouting reports by baseball scouts and learning the methodology of scouting. Often scouts will rate a player highly even if his stats are mediocre especially when a player is young for his league and/or he plays in a pitching dominated league. To baseball scouts age and "tools" are the major factors in "projecting" what kind of major leaguer a young prospect will be. I suspect Brett displayed great baseball tools in the minors despite his average minor league stats. Brett reached AAA at age 20. That is very young for AAA. Brett debuted in the majors later that same year (1973). Reaching the majors at age 20 is very uncommon even today. So the Royals must have seen something in Brett to promote him to the majors at such a young age. Brett struggled in the first part of the 1974 season and sought help from Charlie Lau. Lau is credited in helping Brett become an elite major league hitter.
A side story. In 1990 I worked during the summer in college cleaning dorm rooms. My supervisor played against George Brett many times in high school. He told me that Brett could really rake in high school and he was scouted heavily.
When Brett hit the minors at age 18, my recall from what I've read is that they really wanted to see if he could be a shortstop, and he might have even pitched his senior year in HS too, and I seem to recall reading that he was an all-state football wide receiver, so you have a shortstop/pitcher/wide receiver fresh out of highschool stepping into the minors and trying to figure out just what his baseball calling was. I also notice from the stats that his minor league power looked pretty good. He then went to the majors and from '74-'76 and they basically trained him to keep the ball out of the air. KC's turf turned grounders into hits and triples, and his home/road splits were radical in '76, as well and '77-'79 and '81. I mean his road numbers are not really all star level but that's 'cause the Royals worked on launching grounders through the turf. From '82-'93 he hit the ball in the air more and actually hit better on the road than at home. Probably his early road numbers would have been better if the Royals didn't practice to use the turf to their advantage.
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Originally posted by dgarza View PostLooking at minor league stats are further complicated by the fact that players move up and down levels quite often. And looking at fielding stats... forget about it...
But I've been looking at other batters of Brett's ilk, and it's hard to find one who DIDN'T hit .300 in the minors at least once. I'm sure the scouts saw something in Brett, but you have to admit that it's more than fair to say he "took off" once in the majors.
Again, his road numbers were not great through '79 and he may have benefitted from learning how to use the turf and his speed. When he lost some speed and gained some power he went to hitting it in the air more and proved he could hit on the road with a typical approach, but look at his '76 or '79 splits.
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I was also going to mention Wade Boggs who I seem to remember hit only in the low 300s, like .305, .312, etc in the minors and then suddenly in '82/'83 was going .349 and .361. He also learned how to use his ballpark. A lot of his opposite field "mis-hits" turned into green monster doubles.
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The Royals lit lots of doubles during their glory years. The home park was built for doubles and triples. Here is their rank in doubles from 1975-85,
1975-2nd
1976- 1st
1977- 1st
1978- 1st
1979- 4th
1980- 3rd
1981- 3rd
1982- 1st
1983- 6th
1984- 3rd
1985- 6th
Just glancing at Brett's 1978 splits he hit an incredible 31 doubles in just 67 home games. He hit 14 doubles in 61 road games.Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis
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Wow. Clemente only played ONE season in the minors before getting called up? The must have REALLY needed him.Originally posted by dgarza View PostRoberto Clemente
Code:Year Age Tm Lg Lev Aff G PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB 1954 19 Montreal IL AAA BRO 87 155 148 27 38 5 3 2 12 1 6 17 .257 .286 .372 .657 55 0 1 0 1 Season 87 155 148 27 38 5 3 2 12 1 6 17 .257 .286 .372 .657 55 0 1 0
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