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The 10 biggest errors in baseball history

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  • #31
    Originally posted by ipitch View Post
    It's preposterous to say that with certainty. That is simply your opinion. Did you see my last post (#25)? It appears to me that Mookie was right at the start of the 45-foot 1st base running lane when the ball reached Buckner, and Buckner was about 15' to 20' from 1st base. Do you disagree with those numbers? If so, please post your numbers.

    Watching the video, if you didn't know who the fielder was, would you say that the 1st baseman looked very slow? He doesn't look slow to me. He moves to the ball pretty quickly, no matter how much he may have hobbled at other times.
    It appeared to me, when I first saw the play all those years ago repeated ad nauseum, that Wilson had the play beat.

    And now, looking at the video posted above, what I see is that Wilson is gaining speed as he progresses toward first, as a batter-runner typically does. Buckner, on the other hand, is moving backwards as he attempts to make the play. He would have had to reverse his impetus, settle himself to push off toward the bag, and get there on his iced, ultrasounded, hydrotherapied, heavily taped ankles before Wilson, who had outstanding footspeed. I do not believe he could have done it: look, not at Wilson's first few steps, but at where he is and how fast he is moving when the ball is muffed.
    Last edited by westsidegrounds; 09-17-2012, 02:44 PM.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by westsidegrounds View Post
      By that time in his career he really was. His ankles were seriously messed up, plus he sprained an achilles tendon in the playoffs against the Angels. He had all the guts in the world, and he was terribly mistreated by the Boston fans, but he wasn't going to beat Wilson to the bag.
      I believe John McNamara replaced Buckner with Dave Stapleton often for defensive. He forgot to do that in this instance however.
      Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

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      • #33
        Originally posted by SavoyBG View Post
        Mickey Owen's play was not an error, it was a passed ball.
        It was scored as an error.

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        • #34
          Darrell Porter's PB in 85 was huge. No one remembers Don Denkinger withouit Porter's PB.
          This week's Giant

          #5 in games played as a Giant with 1721 , Bill Terry

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          • #35
            Originally posted by JR Hart View Post
            Darrell Porter's PB in 85 was huge. No one remembers Don Denkinger withouit Porter's PB.
            And no one remembers that Jorge Orta, the base runner called safe by Don Denkinger, didn't score.
            Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

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            • #36
              Originally posted by westsidegrounds View Post
              And now, looking at the video posted above, what I see is that Wilson is gaining speed as he progresses toward first, as a batter-runner typically does. Buckner, on the other hand, is moving backwards as he attempts to make the play. He would have had to reverse his impetus, settle himself to push off toward the bag,
              Backwards?!? After he misses the ball, his next steps are forward. Maybe not straight forward, but certainly not backwards. He
              doesn't move backward until he briefly starts to go after the ball behind him. We are clearly not watching the same video.

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              • #37
                I read about the 1912 WS in the book First Fall Classic. It's one of my favorites because it really paints the picture well and has great character development, something every nonfiction book needs. Though they won the WS, the Red Sox were a divided team due to geographical upbringings. John McGraw, of course, drove his players into the ground. Smoky Joe threw a WS game and player-manager Jake Stahl, who came out of retirement and left his comfortable banking job, nearly quit in the middle of the postseason. Author Mike Vaccaro wrote about Snodgrass' error (paraphrasing because I don't have it with me):

                No matter what level you play, from tee ball to Little League, from high school to college, from the minors to the big leagues, there's always that odd chance that you'll simply drop the ball.

                Snodgrass did just that. Asked later about it, he said, "I don't know what happened. I just dropped it."


                In game 8, the Giants made another deadly mistake. I forget the exact details, but I promise to edit this post when I get my hands on my book (I'm at school until Friday). Trying to get a crucial out, one batter popped up in foul territory. A nervous Christy Mathewson saw Merkle going for it. Visions of Merkle's Boner flashed, and he called off Merkle in favor of the second baseman, Larry Doyle. It wasn't in time for Doyle to reach. The ball fell right between them. A few pitches later, the batter got a hit.

                Snodgrass evacuated Game 8 by motor vehicle to dodge angry fans. Later he would say that despite that catastrophe, his time playing for the Giants were the best years of his life.
                "Allen Sutton Sothoron pitched his initials off today."--1920s article

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                • #38
                  Didn't Roger Peckinpaugh make some crucial errors in the 1925 series?
                  "Allen Sutton Sothoron pitched his initials off today."--1920s article

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules View Post
                    And no one remembers that Jorge Orta, the base runner called safe by Don Denkinger, didn't score.
                    But the bad call did give them a baserunner, even he he was forced
                    This week's Giant

                    #5 in games played as a Giant with 1721 , Bill Terry

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                    • #40
                      if they're going to include Mickey Owen's PB (not officially an "error") then they should have made room for Chesbro's WP in the 9th inning of the 1904 season finale, which cost his team the pennant.

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                      • #41
                        Peckinpaugh made 8 errors altogether, inclluding 2 in the late innings of game 7 that led to Pirates' unearned runs and come-from -behind win.
                        Indeed the first step toward finding out is to acknowledge you do not satisfactorily know already; so that no blight can so surely arrest all intellectual growth as the blight of cocksureness.--CS Peirce

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules View Post
                          I believe John McNamara replaced Buckner with Dave Stapleton often for defensive. He forgot to do that in this instance however.
                          At one point McNamara said he left Billy Buck in because he thought he should be on the field when the Bosox won, but later on he changed his tune and said he thought Stapleton was too unreliable for such a critical situation.
                          "If I drink whiskey, I'll never get worms!" - Hack Wilson

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Brooklyn View Post
                            No it didn't.

                            Buckner gets way too much blame for this. Most casual fans don't remember that the game was already tied when Wilson hit the ground ball, thanks to a Bob Stanley wild pitch that also put Knight in scoring position. I never understood why Schiraldi never had more blame on him for that game for getting into trouble, or Stanley for throwing a wild pitch to allow the tying run to score.

                            And of course there are those that believe Wilson would have beaten it out for an infield single even if Buckner had come up with the ball, prolonging the inning for another batter.


                            While what you say is true, my read is this...ball hit towards Buckner, goes through his legs, Knight scores, game over. Obviously Schiraldi and Stanley deserve some blame too for getting the Sox into that situation, but clearly Buckner's error allowed Knight to score. As to the speculation as to whether Mookie beats the play anyway (Mookie insists he would have) it's irrelevant to the discussion. The fact is the error allowed the winning run to score.
                            “Well, I like to say I’m completely focused, right? I mean, the game’s on the line. It’s not like I’m thinking about what does barbecue Pop Chips and Cholula taste like. Because I already know that answer — it tastes friggin’ awesome!"--Brian Wilson

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                            • #44
                              Marquis Grissom dropping a fly ball in Game 5 of the 1996 World Series was very costly for the Braves.

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Jackaroo Dave View Post
                                Oh, and Zimmerman chasing Collins home in Game 7, if that was scored an error. I know he got an error that game, but I don't know if on that play. Actually, I think not, but on a throwing error that led to a baserunner. Well, in that case, that one.
                                Zimmerman wasn't (according to several sources, but specifically here Arthur Daley) the actual goat.

                                Just found it digging through the library- quote from Daley:

                                "The Giants trapped (Eddie) Collins between third and home. He jockeyed back and forth on the baselines to give the other runners a chance to advance. Catcher Bill rariden of the Giants, the actual goat in this most peculiar drama, wandered away from the plate, leaving it uncovered. Since Collins' mind worked with the rapidity of his twinkling feet, he set out for home at full speed, the lumbering Zimmerman pursuing him vainly but valiantly, the ball clutched in one large paw.

                                Zimmerman justifiably became quite irked by the critical barbs which immediately began to bounce off his innocent noggin. In one beautifully compact sentence he summed up the situation precisely. Said he:

                                "Who the hell was I gonna throw the ball to- the umpire?""
                                "Here's a crazy thought I've always had: if they cut three fingers off each hand, I'd really be a great hitter because then I could level off better." Paul Waner (lifetime .333 hitter, 3,152 lifetime hits.

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