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  • Goose Goslin

    Goslin is becoming one of my favorite historical players...mainly because he is almost totally forgotten today, even on historical boards like this. Perhaps it is because he was a direct contemporary of Ruth and Gehrig, and Simmons and Greenberg and Foxx. He was not quite as good as these guys, nor was he on the great teams that they were on. But the guy did bat .316 in over 2200 games, and had 11 100 RBI seasons. Can you name all the other men who have had that many? I'll give you a hint, their first names are Alex, Babe, Lou, Jimmie, Al, Barry, Manny, Hank , and Frank. Oh, and he also had another season at 99 RBI.

    For some reason I relate him to a 1920s version of Vlad Guerrero..but he was not elected into the HOF until 30 years after his final game. It took Simmons only 9 years to make the Hall. Even WAR, which underrates players like him (low walk power guys who play in high offense eras) gives him a HOF quality 61 for his career. What gives?
    Last edited by willshad; 11-05-2012, 10:58 PM.

  • #2
    I never understood why he's not considered as a better hofer either. I guess because he played for the Senators. I never realized he played on all three of Washingtons pennant winners and then played on two pennant winners in Detroit.
    "(Shoeless Joe Jackson's fall from grace is one of the real tragedies of baseball. I always thought he was more sinned against than sinning." -- Connie Mack

    "I have the ultimate respect for Whitesox fans. They were as miserable as the Cubs and Redsox fans ever were but always had the good decency to keep it to themselves. And when they finally won the World Series, they celebrated without annoying every other fan in the country."--Jim Caple, ESPN (Jan. 12, 2011)

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    • #3
      Maybe because he was kind of a 'tweener'?....not a true power hitter, but also not really a super special batting average guy for his era, either. He sure could drive in those runs, though.

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      • #4
        I was just looking at the Senators teams and it took Same Rice and Heine Manush a long time to get inducted too. Joe Judge and Cecil Travis would probably be in had they been Yankees to.
        "(Shoeless Joe Jackson's fall from grace is one of the real tragedies of baseball. I always thought he was more sinned against than sinning." -- Connie Mack

        "I have the ultimate respect for Whitesox fans. They were as miserable as the Cubs and Redsox fans ever were but always had the good decency to keep it to themselves. And when they finally won the World Series, they celebrated without annoying every other fan in the country."--Jim Caple, ESPN (Jan. 12, 2011)

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        • #5
          Originally posted by chicagowhitesox1173 View Post
          I was just looking at the Senators teams and it took Same Rice and Heine Manush a long time to get inducted too. Joe Judge and Cecil Travis would probably be in had they been Yankees to.
          Rice and Manush are kind of borderline picks, though. Goslin to me seems like a solid HOFer,, certainly not a Veteran's Committee guy.

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          • #6
            I just think it's just because there are a lot of other guys at that time with records that look similar who weren't as good as they looked. Jeff Bagwell might be in a comparable situation.
            Indeed the first step toward finding out is to acknowledge you do not satisfactorily know already; so that no blight can so surely arrest all intellectual growth as the blight of cocksureness.--CS Peirce

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            • #7
              Originally posted by willshad View Post
              Rice and Manush are kind of borderline picks, though. Goslin to me seems like a solid HOFer,, certainly not a Veteran's Committee guy.
              But back then wouldn't you think voters would appreciate those types of careers more.

              I'm not saying Cecil Travis belongs in the hof although I wish he would get more support but I would think he should have gotten at least one vote.
              "(Shoeless Joe Jackson's fall from grace is one of the real tragedies of baseball. I always thought he was more sinned against than sinning." -- Connie Mack

              "I have the ultimate respect for Whitesox fans. They were as miserable as the Cubs and Redsox fans ever were but always had the good decency to keep it to themselves. And when they finally won the World Series, they celebrated without annoying every other fan in the country."--Jim Caple, ESPN (Jan. 12, 2011)

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              • #8
                "The Goose" with his stripped bat.
                Opening Day April 13, 1932. Umps toss out bat, never used.
                Attached Files

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by willshad View Post
                  Rice and Manush are kind of borderline picks, though. Goslin to me seems like a solid HOFer,, certainly not a Veteran's Committee guy.
                  Close one, AL batting title 1928.
                  Browns and Washington face off, last game of the season, Goslin and Manush only a point difference going into the game, Goslin up.
                  Manush 2 for 4, Goslin in his very last at bat, needs a hit or he loses title. He does get the hit 2 for 5 in that game.
                  Goslin------ .3793
                  Manush-----.3777
                  Goslin fails to hit in that last at bat he's at .3771

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by willshad View Post
                    Rice and Manush are kind of borderline picks, though. Goslin to me seems like a solid HOFer,, certainly not a Veteran's Committee guy.
                    It took his inclusion in the classic The Glory Of Their Times to even get the Veteran`s Committees`attention.He is very deserving.I read that Goose was very emotional at the ceremony-lots of tears.Goose is the only hitter ever to be thrown at by a pitcher WHILE KNEELING IN THE ON DECK CIRCLE!Seems Burleigh Grimes was still angry about Goslin`s homer in his previous at bat and wheeled around a threw the ball at Goose who was waiting in the on deck circle.
                    Last edited by Nimrod; 11-06-2012, 06:01 AM.

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                    • #11
                      --Goslin is not quite an inner circle type Hall of Famer, but you would have thought he would have made it pretty easily and not needed such a long wait. Its not even that he didn't play for great teams. He was on all three of the pennant winners in Senator history and then played for back to back winners for the Tigers. He was the best hitter on the 24-25 Senators and, while no longer a great player, still batted in the middle of the order and played pretty much everyday for the 34-35 Tigers. He was a World Series hero too, hitting 3 HR in both the 24 and 25 series and drivig home the winning run in game 7 in 1935to win the Tigers first ever championship.
                      --Goslin was not a popular player. He was regarded as a guy who didn't work as hard at the game as was expected at the time and who cared - a little too openly - about his numbers. Still he DID put up the numbers and he WAS an integral part of the the best teams in two different franchises histories. That is a pretty obvious Hall of Famer in my book.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by chicagowhitesox1173 View Post
                        I was just looking at the Senators teams and it took Same Rice and Heine Manush a long time to get inducted too. Joe Judge and Cecil Travis would probably be in had they been Yankees to.
                        I'm not sure about Travis, unless he was a Veteran's Committee pick. Until about 1940 or 1941 Travis was considered more of an underachiever than anything else in the baseball community.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by EdTarbusz View Post
                          I'm not sure about Travis, unless he was a Veteran's Committee pick. Until about 1940 or 1941 Travis was considered more of an underachiever than anything else in the baseball community.
                          I never heard that before but why did they feel he underachieved? 1940 and 1941 he was still pretty young, I woulda thought the Senators would be happy with the way he was progressing. I know he made alot of errors but he seemed to have pretty good range and I wouldn't think a under achiever would join the military before he was drafted like he did. I think he was one of the first guys to join.

                          If he was gonna get in, I do think it would have to be through the Veterans committee but still I would think he would have gotten at least one vote in his year he was eligable. I hate to sound like a over played record by saying this but he deff would have gotten some support if he had played elsewhere. I think all these Senators would have gotten more support had they played elsewhere.
                          "(Shoeless Joe Jackson's fall from grace is one of the real tragedies of baseball. I always thought he was more sinned against than sinning." -- Connie Mack

                          "I have the ultimate respect for Whitesox fans. They were as miserable as the Cubs and Redsox fans ever were but always had the good decency to keep it to themselves. And when they finally won the World Series, they celebrated without annoying every other fan in the country."--Jim Caple, ESPN (Jan. 12, 2011)

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by chicagowhitesox1173 View Post
                            I never heard that before but why did they feel he underachieved? 1940 and 1941 he was still pretty young, I woulda thought the Senators would be happy with the way he was progressing. I know he made alot of errors but he seemed to have pretty good range and I wouldn't think a under achiever would join the military before he was drafted like he did. I think he was one of the first guys to join.

                            If he was gonna get in, I do think it would have to be through the Veterans committee but still I would think he would have gotten at least one vote in his year he was eligable. I hate to sound like a over played record by saying this but he deff would have gotten some support if he had played elsewhere. I think all these Senators would have gotten more ewas support had they played elsewhere.
                            I've seen several reports from the early 40s (mainly from The Sporting News) that reference Travis's reputation as an underachiever. He had a reputation for fading in the latter parts of the season. 1941 was generally considered to be his breakout season. His MVP votes weren't that impressive and despite his numbers he was only picked for the All Star Game three times. In my opinion, he has a better reputation now than he did as an active player.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by chicagowhitesox1173 View Post
                              I wouldn't think a under achiever would join the military before he was drafted like he did. I think he was one of the first guys to join.

                              .
                              I'm not sure if Travis was drafted or not. All through the 1941 season there were reports that he and Buddy Lewis were going to be drafted. Travis entered the army after Pearl Harbor. I think at that point he may have thought that his baseball career was secondary to joing the war effort. He and Lewis were both out for the duration and were often mentioned together when baseball players in the services were written about.

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