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Carl Yastrzemski's odd career

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  • Jackaroo Dave
    replied
    Originally posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
    Williams was as good or nbetter than Yaz no matter what he did with Fenway as a home park compared to both on the road
    Not afraid of controversy, are you, Roy?
    saying yaz adapted better by going to left while WIlliams did not belies the numbers
    But saying that Yaz adapted by going to left while Williams did not jibes with the numbers.
    the only thing that matters for this thread is Yaz was helped immensely by playing in a bandbox, and it inflates his value
    Clearly that's the only thing that matters to you. Those who can cope with stats that take park effects into account can see how much (roughly) they distort his value. In fact, they are the ones who have pointed out that Yaz was unusually able to take advantage of his home park.

    Leave a comment:


  • Jackaroo Dave
    replied
    Originally posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
    power hitters all lol
    Why do you think I chose them, Roy? Yankee Stadium is death on right-handers; these right-handers are half dead already; yet they managed to "adapt" better to their home field than DiMaggio. ( . . . . maybe if I used a bigger font?)

    Leave a comment:


  • filihok
    replied
    Originally posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
    I am not a big fan of WAR
    Why not?

    It's quite accurate.
    http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/ar...-war-good-for/

    WARvs.Wins_.jpg

    Leave a comment:


  • 9RoyHobbsRF
    replied
    I am not a big fan of WAR

    Originally posted by filihok View Post
    His value, as measured by WAR, adjusts his home park.

    Leave a comment:


  • filihok
    replied
    Originally posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
    Williams was as good or nbetter than Yaz no matter what he did with Fenway as a home park compared to both on the road

    saying yaz adapted better by going to left while WIlliams did not belies the numbers

    the only thing that matters for this thread is Yaz was helped immensely by playing in a bandbox, and it inflates his value
    His value, as measured by WAR, adjusts his home park.

    Leave a comment:


  • 9RoyHobbsRF
    replied
    power hitters all lol

    Originally posted by Jackaroo Dave View Post
    Joe, Bobby Richardson, Horace Clark, and Frankie Crosetti all had better home/away splits than the Clipper.
    Edit: For Roy's benefit, by "better" I meant their home production was higher relative to their road production than Joe's.

    Leave a comment:


  • 9RoyHobbsRF
    replied
    Williams was as good or nbetter than Yaz no matter what he did with Fenway as a home park compared to both on the road

    saying yaz adapted better by going to left while WIlliams did not belies the numbers

    the only thing that matters for this thread is Yaz was helped immensely by playing in a bandbox, and it inflates his value

    Originally posted by Jackaroo Dave View Post
    Roy, Yaz got fat in Fenway by going the other way. Williams was well-known for not doing so.

    Leave a comment:


  • Jackaroo Dave
    replied
    Originally posted by SHOELESSJOE3 View Post
    Two different worlds.
    Asking one player to take advantage of a hitters park
    Asking another player to adapt or make the most out of a park death on RH hitters.

    Not only that how difficult was it for Yaz to get the most out of his park. Look at some of the Bosox hitters home and away, some of the splits are unbelievable. How do we know he did anything that different at home, so many feasted there.

    Then look at some RH Yankee hitters at home, especially the long ball, most way, way lower at home.
    Joe, Bobby Richardson, Horace Clark, and Frankie Crosetti all had better home/away splits than the Clipper.
    Edit: For Roy's benefit, by "better" I meant their home production was higher relative to their road production than Joe's.
    Last edited by Jackaroo Dave; 01-06-2013, 09:41 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Jackaroo Dave
    replied
    Originally posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
    right

    and Ted WIlliams hit .361 at home and .328 on the road

    how is it that Yaz with almost identical splits adapted and Williams didn't

    it's pure jibberish
    Roy, Yaz got fat in Fenway by going the other way. Williams was well-known for not doing so.

    Leave a comment:


  • SHOELESSJOE3
    replied
    Looks like Joe liked Fenway.
    Career .334/.410/.605.
    Career home runs 29, only Ruth, Mantle, Killebrew and Kaline hit more there, most by visitors.
    Not to mention missed 33 more games at Fenway, prime year in the service.
    Ted Williams, I think hit .309 in Yankee Stadium, good but not Williams like.
    Teds own words, did not like hitting at Yankee Stadium, the high stands, all the smoke rising.

    Leave a comment:


  • GiambiJuice
    replied
    Originally posted by Jackaroo Dave View Post
    Roy, are you unable to understand what I wrote, or are you deliberately misinterpreting it? It makes a difference to me.
    It's a usually a bit of both.

    Leave a comment:


  • 9RoyHobbsRF
    replied
    Originally posted by SHOELESSJOE3 View Post
    Two different worlds.
    Asking one player to take advantage of a hitters park
    Asking another player to adapt or make the most out of a park death on RH hitters.


    Not only that how difficult was it for Yaz to get the most out of his park. Look at some of the Bosox hitters home and away, some of the splits are unbelievable. How do we know he did anything that different at home, so many feasted there.

    Then look at some RH Yankee hitters at home, especially the long ball, most way, way lower at home.
    right

    and Ted WIlliams hit .361 at home and .328 on the road

    how is it that Yaz with almost identical splits adapted and Williams didn't

    it's pure jibberish
    Last edited by 9RoyHobbsRF; 01-06-2013, 08:18 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • SHOELESSJOE3
    replied
    Originally posted by filihok View Post
    DiMaggio had a .938 OPS at Yankee Stadium
    DiMaggio had a 1.015 OPS otherwise.

    If, according to your hypothesis, a player's true talent is reflected by his away stats then DiMaggio certainly did not adapt to Yankee Stadium because he hit much worse there.
    Two different worlds.
    Asking one player to take advantage of a hitters park
    Asking another player to adapt or make the most out of a park death on RH hitters.

    Not only that how difficult was it for Yaz to get the most out of his park. Look at some of the Bosox hitters home and away, some of the splits are unbelievable. How do we know he did anything that different at home, so many feasted there.

    Then look at some RH Yankee hitters at home, especially the long ball, most way, way lower at home.

    Leave a comment:


  • Jackaroo Dave
    replied
    Originally posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
    DiMaggio never adapted to Yankee Stadium. These guys weren't dumb but they couldn't do what Yaz had to.
    this is just crazy
    Yaz did not adapt to anything other than play in a bandbox and any attempt to say otherwise is just baloney
    and for what it's worth
    DiMag hit .315 and slugged .546 in YS
    Yaz hit .306 and slugged .503 in Fenway
    and Yaz did not miss 3 prime years to a war
    I would say DiMag adapted pretty well
    and DiMag hit .334 and slugged .605 in Fenway
    Yaz hit .278 and slugged .434 in YS
    Roy, are you unable to understand what I wrote, or are you deliberately misinterpreting it? It makes a difference to me.
    Last edited by Jackaroo Dave; 01-06-2013, 07:08 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • filihok
    replied
    Originally posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
    DiMaggio never adapted to Yankee Stadium. These guys weren't dumb but they couldn't do what Yaz had to.


    this is just crazy

    Yaz did not adapt to anything other than play in a bandbox and any attempt to say otherwise is just baloney

    and for what it's worth

    DiMag hit .315 and slugged .546 in YS
    Yaz hit .306 and slugged .503 in Fenway

    and Yaz did not miss 3 prime years to a war

    I would say DiMag adapted pretty well
    DiMaggio had a .938 OPS at Yankee Stadium
    DiMaggio had a 1.015 OPS otherwise.

    If, according to your hypothesis, a player's true talent is reflected by his away stats then DiMaggio certainly did not adapt to Yankee Stadium because he hit much worse there.

    Leave a comment:

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