which were the driving forces for integration and who were against it?

[dominik]

this is not meant to be thread like "my team integrated earlier then yours". Baseball was seggregated and we have to accept that now.
but I wonder what happenend behind the scenes (not just at the dodgers who hired the first black player).

what happened that finally caused the long overdue decision to integrate in baseball? and which guys were against integration? can anyone share some stories or recommend a good read? do you know when the first thoughts of integration came up?

[Sultan_1895-1948]

this is not meant to be thread like "my team integrated earlier then yours". Baseball was seggregated and we have to accept that now.
but I wonder what happenend behind the scenes (not just at the dodgers who hired the first black player).

what happened that finally caused the long overdue decision to integrate in baseball? and which guys were against integration? can anyone share some stories or recommend a good read? do you know when the first thoughts of integration came up?

Interesting topic. I don't think it was one thing in particular but rather a building up of water and the dam finally broke. If you look at some African American timelines, some important events took place leading up to Jackie.

The NAACP was founded in New York in 1909. Not sure if anyone involved in that had ties to baseball.

The Great Migration in 1910.

1914 Marcus Garvey started the Universal Negro Improvement Association

1920 the Harlem Renaissance started up.

1930 Nation of Islam is formed

1936 Jesse Owens won 4 gold medals

1937 Joe Louis became heavyweight champ

1939 first African American actor to win Academy Award

1940 first African American general in the US Army

1941 role of African Americans in the military increases

1942 Congress of Racial Equality is formed in Chicago

1945 the magazine Ebony is founded

From the pure baseball side of it, I think exhibition games against Negro Leaguers opened a lot of eyes.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

The Pittsburgh Pirates had interest in signing Josh Gibson in 1943. I'm not sure how serious the Pirates were or if Gibson even received a formal contract offer but Commissioner Landis squashed it.

[VIBaseball]

Paul Dickson's biography of Bill Veeck gets into this. There was much talk over the years about how Veeck wanted to buy the Phillies in 1942 and stock them with black players. The deal didn't go through but was an important step.

Dickson also discusses (in an appendix) the 1998 "debunking" of the Veeck story in a SABR annual publication. This stirred controversy and a backlash to "debunk the debunkers." Dickson concluded from his own research that he believed the Veeck story was true.

[ol' aches and pains]

this is not meant to be thread like "my team integrated earlier then yours". Baseball was seggregated and we have to accept that now.
but I wonder what happenend behind the scenes (not just at the dodgers who hired the first black player).

what happened that finally caused the long overdue decision to integrate in baseball? and which guys were against integration? can anyone share some stories or recommend a good read? do you know when the first thoughts of integration came up?

As to which guys were against integration, Commisioner Landis and 15 of the 16 owners, for starters. It's no coincidence that Jackie Robinson was signed almost immediately after Landis' death.

As to a "good read" I suggest Baseballs' Great Experiment by Jules Tygeil. I consider this the definitive work on the subject.

[dominik]

Interesting topic. I don't think it was one thing in particular but rather a building up of water and the dam finally broke. If you look at some African American timelines, some important events took place leading up to Jackie.

The NAACP was founded in New York in 1909. Not sure if anyone involved in that had ties to baseball.

The Great Migration in 1910.

1914 Marcus Garvey started the Universal Negro Improvement Association

1920 the Harlem Renaissance started up.

1930 Nation of Islam is formed

1936 Jesse Owens won 4 gold medals

1937 Joe Louis became heavyweight champ

1939 first African American actor to win Academy Award

1940 first African American general in the US Army

1941 role of African Americans in the military increases

1942 Congress of Racial Equality is formed in Chicago

1945 the magazine Ebony is founded

From the pure baseball side of it, I think exhibition games against Negro Leaguers opened a lot of eyes.

good list. I think Jack Johnson as the first black heavyweight boxing champion in 1915 also has to be mentioned. he faced a lot of adversity because a lot of white men did not like a black man beating up white men.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

good list. I think Jack Johnson as the first black heavyweight boxing champion in 1915 also has to be mentioned. he faced a lot of adversity because a lot of white men did not like a black man beating up white men.

Well, that and Jack Johnson's fondness for white women.

[Captain Cold Nose]

Well, that and Jack Johnson's fondness for white women.

If anything, Johnson's title reign (actually starting in 1908) drew a heavier color barrier for African-American fighters for a while. He himself was not allowed to defent the title against the great black fighters he took on coming up, and often had to leave the country to fight. White champions were established. It was either Sam Langford or Harry Wills who begged Jack Dempsey's manager for a title shot years after Johnson was "knocked out" by Jess Willard but the rules of the day would not allow it. Only when Joe Louis was coming up the ranks were black fighters starting to gain acceptance.

Jack Johnson may be seen as an experiment that failed, or was too soon. Another watershed moment, though, would be when Benny Goodman brought out Duke Eliington and some of his orchestra with him at Carnegie Hall in 1938.

[NJRob65]

If anything, Johnson's title reign (actually starting in 1908) drew a heavier color barrier for African-American fighters for a while. He himself was not allowed to defent the title against the great black fighters he took on coming up, and often had to leave the country to fight. White champions were established. It was either Sam Langford or Harry Wills who begged Jack Dempsey's manager for a title shot years after Johnson was "knocked out" by Jess Willard but the rules of the day would not allow it. Only when Joe Louis was coming up the ranks were black fighters starting to gain acceptance.

Jack Johnson may be seen as an experiment that failed, or was too soon. Another watershed moment, though, would be when Benny Goodman brought out Duke Eliington and some of his orchestra with him at Carnegie Hall in 1938.

Dempsey sporadically defended the heavyweight title. FWIW, Harry Wills did actually sign a contract to fight Jack Dempsey. I've seen photos of the contract signing in Ring magazine. Also:en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harry_Wills

[NJRob65]

Branch Rickey was an obvious driving force behind integration. His signing of Jackie Robinson was opposed by 15 of the 16 owners and Commissioner A.B. "Happy" Chandler. Chandler relented and integration began.

[BigRon]

I imagine most Major League (and Minor League) players were also opposed to integration. In addition to widespread racial prejudice, most professional players also did not want to deal with an additional set of competitors for their jobs.