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Ernie Shore Perfect Game?

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  • Ernie Shore Perfect Game?

    Was Ernie Shore's 9 innings of perfect relief for Babe Ruth, a perfect game?
    33
    Yes
    27.27%
    9
    No, just a no-hitter
    72.73%
    24
    Unlike most other team sports, in which teams usually have an equivalent number of players on the field at any given time, in baseball the hitting team is at a numerical disadvantage, with a maximum of 5 players and 2 base coaches on the field at any time, compared to the fielding team's 9 players. For this reason, leaving the dugout to join a fight is generally considered acceptable in that it results in numerical equivalence on the field, and a fairer fight.

  • #2
    No Baserunners Allowed, ergo a perfecto.

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    • #3
      --Offically Shore and Ruth share the no hitter, even though Ruth contributed nothing and Shore was perfect in relief.

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      • #4
        im unfamiliar with this game, how did Ruth do before being ejected and how long had he been in there?

        and who threw the walk, Ruth?

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        • #5
          i think i read somewhere that ruth walked the first batter then argued the call and got tossed, then shore came in and pitched

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          • #6
            Here is what my 1981 official Baseball Record Book says about this game played in Boston on June 23, 1917:

            " *Shore's performance is classified as a perfect game even though he did not start the game. George (Babe) Ruth, Boston's starting pitcher, was removed by umpire Clarence (Brick) Owens after giving up a base on balls to Ray Morgan, the first batter. Shore, without warming up, took Ruth's place. Morgan was retired trying to steal second. From then on, Shore faced 26 batters, with none reaching base."

            I'm sure this ruling as a "perfect game" was later reversed -- even though Shore gave up no baserunners and was on the mound for all 27 outs. The game was clearly a "combined no hitter" -- but with no less honor and respect due to Ernie Shore for tossing a truly magnificent game.

            BTW: this book lists MLB "No-Hitters" as well as Perfect games, but the no-hitters are divided into three groups:
            * No-Hit Games -- Ten or more innings
            * No-hit games -- Nine Innings
            * Less than Nine Innings

            If a game is called after five innings, the pitcher can be given credit for a 5-inning no-hitter. (Doesn't seem fair, does it?)
            Luke

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            • #7
              Westsidegrounds:
              "No, he gets credit for the pickoff too. He retired 27 straight, at which point the game ended with his team victorious. That's a perfect game."

              But he did not retire 27 straight batters. A perfect game is 27 men up, 27 men down without reaching base. There is no dispute that Shore pitched 9 innings. Great outing. He just didn't pitch a perfect game.
              Last edited by Macker; 05-07-2005, 04:02 PM.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by westsidegrounds
                No, he gets credit for the pickoff too.

                He retired 27 straight, at which point the game ended with his team victorious.

                That's a perfect game.
                NO, no, no. A pitcher must pitch a complete game. Shore came on in RELIEF. A relief pitcher CANNOT pitch a complete game, only a starter can.

                Bob

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                • #9
                  It's not a perfect game because Shore did not retire 27 batters. Seems obvious, really.

                  Harvey Haddix and Pedro Martinez have much more reason to complain.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by nascarfn5
                    I tried to find this boxscore but have had no-luck. Anyone have link?
                    Here's the box score.

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                    • #11
                      The perfect game was over when Babe Ruth walked the leadoff man. Shore did get all 27 outs, but he did not throw the first pitch.
                      SOUVENEZ-VOUS LES EXPOS!!!
                      "The future's uncertain and the end is always near" - Jim Morrison

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                      • #12
                        He didn't retire all 27 men, so it is not a perfect game.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by baseball79
                          He didn't retire all 27 men, so it is not a perfect game.
                          Actually he did. He just didn't retire 27 BATTERS.

                          Bob

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                          • #14
                            Someone reached first, it was not a perfect game.

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                            • #15
                              It was a combined no hitter. That is all.
                              Buck O'Neil: The Monarch of Baseball

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