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2021 World Baseball Classic

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  • #91
    If I may, my guess for WBC first round host would be PR DR US(LA or Texas but my money is on LA with Texas hosting the Championship Round while LA host both first and second round) Japan. Reason being as I don't think they would go with two Asian host again for a while. With the potential grouping going like this
    PR: PR Venezuela Colombia
    DR: DR NL Italy
    US: US Cuba Australia
    Japan: Japan SK Israel

    Not going to lie, not a huge fan of this grouping because PR and Venezuela would potentially play each other again in the first round for the third straight classic. Though it's nice to see NL and Italy finally playing against each other in the WBC if this group were to happen. Israel would make more sense in the US pool then Australia because well politics plus they would get more fan supporters in America rather then in Asia.

    I think a dark horse candidate to host would be Colombia because 1. They will have a brand new stadium up to international and MLB standards 2. Colombia is a growing baseball nation with more players being sign to contracts then ever 3. Their performance in the last WBC helps. Plus you could potentially get a South American group if Brazil makes it back along with Venezuela and Netherlands because of Curacao and Aruba.(Though I think they want to pair Brazil and Italy in the same group for the football rivalry). It would also help boost baseball over there and give MLB more popularity with a growing market for baseball.

    PR: PR DR Italy
    Colombia: NL Venezuela Colombia
    US: US Cuba Australia
    Japan: Japan SK Israel

    Comment


    • #92
      Originally posted by Jak View Post
      If I may, my guess for WBC first round host would be PR DR US(LA or Texas but my money is on LA with Texas hosting the Championship Round while LA host both first and second round) Japan. Reason being as I don't think they would go with two Asian host again for a while. With the potential grouping going like this
      PR: PR Venezuela Colombia
      DR: DR NL Italy
      US: US Cuba Australia
      Japan: Japan SK Israel

      Not going to lie, not a huge fan of this grouping because PR and Venezuela would potentially play each other again in the first round for the third straight classic. Though it's nice to see NL and Italy finally playing against each other in the WBC if this group were to happen. Israel would make more sense in the US pool then Australia because well politics plus they would get more fan supporters in America rather then in Asia.

      I think a dark horse candidate to host would be Colombia because 1. They will have a brand new stadium up to international and MLB standards 2. Colombia is a growing baseball nation with more players being sign to contracts then ever 3. Their performance in the last WBC helps. Plus you could potentially get a South American group if Brazil makes it back along with Venezuela and Netherlands because of Curacao and Aruba.(Though I think they want to pair Brazil and Italy in the same group for the football rivalry). It would also help boost baseball over there and give MLB more popularity with a growing market for baseball.

      PR: PR DR Italy
      Colombia: NL Venezuela Colombia
      US: US Cuba Australia
      Japan: Japan SK Israel
      I would be surprised if the Steering Committee goes this route; meaning a geographically unbalanced bracket. They have used a geographically balanced bracket in the last two editions of the WBC. Based on their past decisions, I expect the Steering Committee to place two of the first four groups in Asia and the other two in the Americas, and then split the second round groups between the Eastern and Western hemispheres; much like it was done in 2013 and 2017. However, there is a very small possibility that the Steering Committee would consider having a single Region host the Main Event; it seems like next natural step in the evolution of the WBC.
      Last edited by SouthwestAmAZins; 03-20-2018, 12:49 AM.

      Comment


      • #93
        Originally posted by SouthwestAmAZins View Post
        However, there is a very small possibility that the Steering Committee would consider having a single Region host the Main Event; it seems like next natural step in the evolution of the WBC.
        When you say single Region you mean one country or one continent? If it's one continent, I can see that for example the Americas host 2021 with PR DR US and other while Asia host 2025 WBC with Japan, SK, Taiwan and other. Then switching back and forth. Or more specifically a North American host(Mexico,Canada, US and other),Caribbean host( PR,DR, Cuba, and other),Central and South American host(Venezuela if politics get sorted out,Colombia,Nicaragua,Panama if WBC expands), Asia(Japan, SK, Taiwan and other)

        FIFA is slowly doing this if the North American region host the 2026 World Cup and the confirmed joint bid from Argentina,Uruguay and Paraguay for the 2030 World Cup. Though if Asia host, will MLB, WBSC and WBC steering risk near empty stadiums for non Asian teams(especially in Taiwan which is basically an empty stadium between non-asian teams). Also besides the big three in Asian, most of the best baseball talent and popularity comes from the Americas, how will ratings play a factor since it be hard for fans from lets say DR to watch games in Japan because of time zone differences. Or US fans in the east coast to watch. Not against the idea, just some concerns for an Asian Region WBC.

        Comment


        • #94
          Originally posted by SouthwestAmAZins View Post

          I would be surprised if the Steering Committee goes this route; meaning a geographically unbalanced bracket. They have used a geographically balanced bracket in the last two editions of the WBC. Based on their past decisions, I expect the Steering Committee to place two of the first four groups in Asia and the other two in the Americas, and then split the second round groups between the Eastern and Western hemispheres; much like it was done in 2013 and 2017.
          As for geographically unbalanced bracket, I don't care for it. I care more for competitive balance bracket then a geographically one anyway though geography should still be taken into consideration. The last two Asian pools in the past two WBC essentially had the same teams facing each other again in the first round.If SK or Taiwan host again, I can't see them putting Cuba in either pool except Japan since the Cuban government probably wants to limit defections and travel.

          2013:
          Taiwan:CT SK NL Australia.
          Japan: Japan Cuba China Brazil
          2017:
          Japan: Japan Cuba Australia China
          SK: NL Israel SK CT
          2021:?
          Japan: Japan Cuba Australia Qualifier Team
          SK/CT: SK NL Israel Qualifier Team

          I also like to mention that I THINK as much as I personally don't mind two Asian pools and I'm pretty sure MLB doesn't mind, attendance is a dud between two non Asian teams which might play a factor. They should still do two Asian pools, just not every four years.

          If WBC Steering Committee does what you mentioned, which would not surprise me,
          then the pools would look like this IMO:

          PR/DR(either or)PR DR Italy Qualifier Team
          US(WBC Champions): US Venezuela Colombia Qualifier Team
          Japan: Japan Cuba Australia Qualifier Team
          SK/CT: SK NL Israel Qualifier Team

          or this:
          PR: PR Venezuela Colombia Qualifier Team
          DR: DR US Italy Qualifier Team
          Japan: Japan Cuba Australia Qualifier Team
          SK/CT: SK NL Israel Qualifier Team



          Comment


          • #95
            Originally posted by Jak View Post

            When you say single Region you mean one country or one continent? If it's one continent, I can see that for example the Americas host 2021 with PR DR US and other while Asia host 2025 WBC with Japan, SK, Taiwan and other. Then switching back and forth. Or more specifically a North American host(Mexico,Canada, US and other),Caribbean host( PR,DR, Cuba, and other),Central and South American host(Venezuela if politics get sorted out,Colombia,Nicaragua,Panama if WBC expands), Asia(Japan, SK, Taiwan and other)

            FIFA is slowly doing this if the North American region host the 2026 World Cup and the confirmed joint bid from Argentina,Uruguay and Paraguay for the 2030 World Cup. Though if Asia host, will MLB, WBSC and WBC steering risk near empty stadiums for non Asian teams(especially in Taiwan which is basically an empty stadium between non-asian teams). Also besides the big three in Asian, most of the best baseball talent and popularity comes from the Americas, how will ratings play a factor since it be hard for fans from lets say DR to watch games in Japan because of time zone differences. Or US fans in the east coast to watch. Not against the idea, just some concerns for an Asian Region WBC.
            It could be either a country or a continent, depending on what the Steering Committee wants. But, I would prefer it if the whole event were held in about four venues that are no more than a few hours of travel away from each other. If it were to be held entirely in Asia, prime time ratings would definitely take a hit in the Americas. International baseball fans in the Western Hemisphere would have to get up early to watch baseball; Taiwan 7PM = Tokyo 8PM = Santo Domingo 7AM = Los Angeles 4AM. In regards to the lousy attendance in Asia when the host nation is not playing; the WBC Steering Committee reaps what they sow. If the WBCSC announces the hosts for the WBC six months ahead of time, then they do not give many International baseball fans enough time to prepare their travel plans. A WBC entirely held in Asia would need to be announced about seven or eight years ahead to maximize the amount of non-Asian spectators that would attend.

            Comment


            • #96
              Our WBC Expansion poll results share six teams with the top WBSC 12 non-WBC nations; legend red is for Americas, blue is for Europe, black is for Asia & green is for Africa.
              WBSC TOP 12 Non WBC Top 12 Baseball-Fever
              01 Argentina Argentina
              02 Austria Russia
              03 Russia Belgium
              04 Belgium Croatia
              05 Croatia Sweden
              06 Sweden Sri Lanka
              07 Slovakia Hong Kong
              08 Lithuania Indonesia
              09 Peru Ireland
              10 Ukraine Thailand
              11 Belarus Uganda
              12 Sri Lanka Bahamas
              Last edited by SouthwestAmAZins; 06-18-2018, 02:35 AM.

              Comment


              • #97
                Here is an interesting article about the 2020 WBC Qualifiers; I just hope they are wrong about expansion: https://extrainningsbaseball.wordpre.../12/2020-wbcq/

                Comment


                • #98
                  Current WBSC Rank > 20 27 29 31 30 40 41 56 NR 42 33 51 NR 24 38 NR 32 34 37 60 64 50 51 51 54 57 59 65 NR
                  ARG RUS BEL SWE CRO SRI HKG THA UGA INA LTU IRL BAH AUT UKR NGR SVK POL PER GUM ECU GRE ESA HON CHI GUA IND CUW HAI Total
                  SouthwestAmAZins X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                  PLowry X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                  Nutt X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                  island slugger X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                  cutchemist42 X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                  Rally Monkey X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                  Lime X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                  gianc006 X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                  Jak X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                  Percentage 100.0 100.0 88.9 88.9 66.7 66.7 66.7 66.7 66.7 55.6 44.4 44.4 44.4 33.3 33.3 33.3 22.2 22.2 22.2 22.2 22.2 11.1 11.1 11.1 11.1 11.1 11.1 11.1 11.1

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    So how do we cast a vote in this poll? And, is the vote only for the teams we think ought to be added or for the 12 most likely teams to be added?

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by ExtraInningsUK View Post
                      So how do we cast a vote in this poll? And, is the vote only for the teams we think ought to be added or for the 12 most likely teams to be added?
                      Vote for the 12 most likely to get invited in your opinion. Thanks, for participating.

                      Comment


                      • Here is our vote, but to be clear, most of these teams have no chance of being included in 2020 or are not ready organisationally. If we could, we would vote only for the top four teams to be added and the pools increased from four to five teams as no one below that grouping has even the smallest chance of being selected. The list is roughly in order of probability of joining at any point in the next two editions, with notes on each country:

                        Thailand: Talent has not progressed since WBC inclusion and even if they are the closest to the teams in the qualifiers are still a long way off.
                        Indonesia: See Thailand.
                        Argentina: The third-tier nation we expect to grow the most in the next decade.
                        Bahamas: The talent is there and they are ready, but will have to get GB to let go.

                        Russia: Tricky because of political issues with the WBC being so dominated by U.S. interests.
                        Sri Lanka: Making a lot of effort, but the talent is a long way off.
                        Uganda: Getting much stronger at the youth level, but with no adult team.
                        Ireland: Has a chance solely for the Irish-American connexion, though momentum is very slowly building. [Greece also falls into this category for the former reason, but has no infrastructure.]
                        Guatemala: With some investment, could potentially be a source of prospects.
                        CuraƧao: KNBSB would not relinquish its rights and is a stronger federation than GB Baseball, which is why the Bahamas has a chance to field its own team.

                        The last two are harder and fall into two groups: 1) Interchangeable countries that MLB would love to see organise better themselves, but have virtually no developped talent or structure [Nigeria,
                        India, Haiti] and 2) European countries that no one outside Europe would seriously consider [Belgium, Sweden, Croatia, Austria, Ukraine, Poland]. Of this incredibly unlikely group, we'll say Nigeria and Sweden.

                        Places that MLB will never consider because the market is too small: Hong Kong, El Salvador, Guam.

                        To conclude: THA, INA, ARG, BAH, RUS, SRI, UGA, IRE, GUA, CUW, NGR, SWE.

                        Comment


                        • Thank you ExtraInningsUK for your votes & analysis. Here is the updated table:
                          Current WBSC Rank > 20 27 31 29 40 56 NR 30 41 42 51 NR NR 24 33 38 32 34 37 57 60 64 65 50 51 51 54 59 NR
                          ARG RUS SWE BEL SRI THA UGA CRO HKG INA IRL BAH NGR AUT LTU UKR SVK POL PER GUA GUM ECU CUW GRE ESA HON CHI IND HAI Total
                          SouthwestAmAZins X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                          PLowry X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                          Nutt X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                          island slugger X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                          cutchemist42 X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                          Rally Monkey X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                          Lime X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                          gianc006 X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                          Jak X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                          ExtraInningsUK X X X X X X X X X X X X 12
                          Percentage 100.0 100.0 90.0 80.0 70.0 70.0 70.0 60.0 60.0 60.0 50.0 50.0 50.0 30.0 30.0 30.0 20.0 20.0 20.0 20.0 20.0 20.0 20.0 10.0 10.0 10.0 10.0 10.0 10.0
                          Last edited by SouthwestAmAZins; 09-09-2018, 10:18 AM.

                          Comment


                          • I exchanged Lithuania for Nigeria to balance out my selections. The original 2012 expansion class had 6 European. 3 Americas & 3 Asia-Pacific . My selections are 6 European, 3 Asia & 3 Americas/Africa. I am not quite ready to break up any existing WBC participants by adding Curazao or the Bahamas. Just based on the eye test, I believe that Europe's 2nd tier, (Belgium, Sweden, Croatia) is better than Asia's 2nd tier (Sri Lanka, Indonesia, Thailand). Argentina kind of sits alone in the Americas third tier and Europe's 2nd tier is better organized than the Americas fourth tier. Nigeria's latest initiative in youth baseball with their Baseball Tomorrow Academy, their population size and geography earned my vote; along with Uganda making it two African nations from different regions. I would wager that Uganda's U18 team would give Pakistan's senior team and the other 2nd tier Asian teams all they could handle and more. I don't expect Nigeria to be at the same level as Uganda, but they did place 2nd in Africa's Olympic qualifier in 2007 and might be able to field an older version of that team.

                            Comment


                            • It is actually an interesting exercise to use the eye test on these tiers as there is a very good chance that Europe's second tier could beat Asia's second, the Americas' third, and all new African teams. This, however, is part of the problem with expansion as MLB has no desire to expand into European countries with small populations (virtually everyone not already included with the exception of Russia and Ukraine). MLB would much rather stay in Spanish-language markets in the Americas for ease of communication, travel, and similarity.

                              On the other hand, not all hope is lost as WBSC has noticeably stepped up its efforts in Africa and Southeast Asia, leading to the hope that when more realistic expansion comes for the 2025 WBC, there ought to be several African countries to have made the leap, and it's possible that some of Asia's second tier will have made a leap. A big first step: getting baseball on the agenda of African multi-sport events like the All-African Games in 2019 (Morocco, no known baseball) and 2023 (TBD) and the African Youth Games in 2022 (hosted by Lesotho, oddly one of the more active African teams in the non-South Africa division). The new partnership between WBSC and AFBS is also very promising for development in Africa (watch out for Tunisia and Ghana).

                              What else do you all think would make a difference in WBC expansion?

                              Comment


                              • It is unfortunate that MLB would close the door on the rest of Europe. Especially, when they shoehorned Israel into the WBC Qualifiers, obviously, they had enough influential support to overcome their small population & virtually non existent baseball program. What if MLB just allowed every interested federation access to a WBC Pre-qualifier without covering all of the expenses? What if every federation that were seriously interested provided financial proof that they can cover travel, lodging, equipment, uniforms, etc. were allowed to play? What if the hosts only had to get the field up to MiLB standard, arrange airport pickups, arrange practice times, and organize a small ceremony? What if the WBSC set up the competition format, the streaming services, player eligibility and selection of officials? And all MLB had to do is approve the venues and send a few liaisons to make sure the WBC brand is being properly represented? If all of this yielded four new worthy federations with minimal cost to them [MLB], then isn't that more valuable to them [MLB] to promote the game in as many places as possible? Of course for this to occur, MLB would have to give up some control, which I suspect may be just as valuable to them.

                                Comment

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