Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Does Anyone Else Here Think Sabermetrics is a Sham?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by 538280
    He wasn't saying there are enormous similarites between playing baseball and meteorology, just that there are similarities in how you can analyze and study baseball and meteorology. You seem to have completely misunderstood Matt's point. It had nothing to do with how to play the game, just about analyzing and studying it.
    Yeah, i think he just looked for a line he could pick at, didn't look at the context, and rolled with it.

    Comment


    • That is of course precisely what he did...which is why I didn't respond.

      The STUDY of baseball and the STUDY of meteorology are similar in that statistical methods are used to smooth out things that can't fully be quantified and give you as clear a picture as we are capable of giving you. In meteorology, the fluxing of heat, moisture and momentum from the boundary layer (think of the thermals on which birds ride) happen at a scale too small for numerical models to recognize, so they are "parameterized" using statistical averaging methods in order to capture their net large scale impact on the weather. In baseball, the human element of the game...the luck involved in ball meeting bat (a tiny variation in the angle of contact, whether the seem or the flat partt of the ball is the first thing to hit the bat, what kind of spin the ball has, etc will often create a big difference in the flight of the ball...or a small difference that makes a huge difference in the score), the clustering of events...these things get "parameterized" by similar statistical averaging methods to give us as much info as we can get.

      Meteorologists are a lot further along than sabermetricians, but similar methods will come to be applied in both fields.

      Playing baseball isn't like observing the weather...but studying baseball is very much like studying the weather.

      Comment


      • But Matt, apparently, unless you have played the game, or been swept away in a tornado, you can't say anything about either

        Comment


        • I make no pretenses of being an athlete. I'm a geek...that's all there is to it. The jocks in the Mariners' clubhouse would probably give me an atomic wedgy if I started explaining to them why it was important that they take a few more pitches. That doesn't mean I'm wrong.

          Comment


          • Do people really think we analyze the game because we hate baseball, but want to be involved with baseball for some reason?

            We LOVE baseball. Not love. LOVE. Can people not fathom that it is possible to love watching and playing baseball, and, also be able to analyze it too. Or do they think that because we use such newfangled terms like database and event files that we can't love baseball?

            We can actually watch baseball and think at the same time. They are not mutually exclusive, just because they are to those who believe it.
            Author of THE BOOK -- Playing The Percentages In Baseball

            Comment


            • Indeed Tango.

              I don't really get why I have a reputation among some of the non-SABR members of BBF as not truly loving the game when I've spent thousands and thousands of words doing a bad immitation of a poetic writer practically writing love letters to the beauty of the game here at Fever. Not to mention the thousands of hours spent studying the game...you don't do all of that if baseball isn't your greatest passion.

              Comment


              • Yeah, and I'm sure Beethoven was a mathematical genius who wouldn't know music if it him in the face.
                Author of THE BOOK -- Playing The Percentages In Baseball

                Comment


                • When one of these stats guys in the world can actually play baseball as well as Beethoven could play music, I'll accept your argument.

                  What I see are some people who love stats. That doesn't mean they love baseball. The two are different. Now maybe you guys love baseball. I don't know anyone of you so I can't say. But in all my life, I have never heard a human being refer to baseball as being similar to meteorology. It was a bizarre statement to me that's all.

                  Comment


                  • There's a difference between saying
                    baseball = meteorology
                    and
                    analysis of baseball events = analysis of meteorological events

                    And if you've never heard it, maybe you should hang out with more scientists!

                    And yes, people who love stats doesn't mean they love baseball. But, people who love stats don't devote hundreds of hours a year to baseball for 30 years unless they love baseball.

                    I think it's safe to say that anyone who is a regular contributor to Baseball Fever is a defacto baseball lover.
                    Author of THE BOOK -- Playing The Percentages In Baseball

                    Comment


                    • Again...well said Tango.

                      I'm not sure if I just didn't say it very well or if northside didn't read it well, but I never said baseball = meteorology. The study of both is similar...that's all I've ever maintained...that's the great thing about science...you can study a lot of different htings once you develop your ability to use your reason, the scientific method, and statistics.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by northside
                        When one of these stats guys in the world can actually play baseball as well as Beethoven could play music, I'll accept your argument.
                        As if you can
                        Mythical SF Chronicle scouting report: "That Jeff runs like a deer. Unfortunately, he also hits AND throws like one." I am Venus DeMilo - NO ARM! I can play like a big leaguer, I can field like Luzinski, run like Lombardi. The secret to managing is keeping the ones who hate you away from the undecided ones. I am a triumph of quantity over quality. I'm almost useful, every village needs an idiot.
                        Good traders: MadHatter(2), BoofBonser26, StormSurge

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by RuthMayBond
                          As if you can
                          Do you know me? Do you know anyhting about me?

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by SABR Matt
                            Again...well said Tango.

                            I'm not sure if I just didn't say it very well or if northside didn't read it well, but I never said baseball = meteorology. The study of both is similar...that's all I've ever maintained...that's the great thing about science...you can study a lot of different htings once you develop your ability to use your reason, the scientific method, and statistics.
                            Matt, here is your quote,"Actually...there are enormous similarities between baseball and meteorology."

                            That is what I am addressing.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by northside
                              Matt, here is your quote,"Actually...there are enormous similarities between baseball and meteorology."

                              That is what I am addressing.
                              Did you not read the rest of it? That would be like me saying "Albert Pujols sucks...compared to Babe Ruth" But then you address me only saying "pujols sucks"

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by EvanAparra
                                Did you not read the rest of it? That would be like me saying "Albert Pujols sucks...compared to Babe Ruth" But then you address me only saying "pujols sucks"
                                Yes I did read the rest of it. There is a difference between baseball and statistics.

                                Comment

                                Ad Widget

                                Collapse
                                Working...
                                X