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Progressing Toward Better Stats Thread

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  • Just thought these two might make a good matchup. Turns out the results couldn't be more even.

    I thought using 300 PA for a min is fitting. If that's too high or two low, lemme know Brett. Reason I mention that, is Mantle's 1963, his fourth highest SA season, he had 213 PA and I left it out. Didn't look until just now, but his home/road SA split was .681/.580 that year.

    Anyway...............

    EddieMickeyBest5.jpg

    And here's a couple bombers.

    BambinoIronHorseBest5.jpg
    Last edited by Sultan_1895-1948; 05-23-2014, 07:09 PM.

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    • Well I guess I have to put Mathews back into my top 25, and Frank Robinson loses some. And I don't know how to move Gehrig up, but I pretty much have to. This may turn into a request thread similar to Matt's old PCA thread. I'd really like to see how much Yaz falls, and Ott and Brett. I think Brett will lose a little with road based numbers, Ott a little more and Yaz quite a bit, but maybe less than you think.
      Last edited by brett; 05-23-2014, 07:24 PM.

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      • Could you copy your most complete data table to the first post in this thread?

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        • Here you go Layson......

          HankWillieBest5.jpg

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          • Originally posted by brett View Post
            Could you copy your most complete data table to the first post in this thread?
            Just to be clear, do you mean what's in post #125? (minus the incorrect SAeff of course)

            I'm curious to do a few players' OBP, same process as slugging, and see what you were talking about with Rbat or whatever. Would that be a better measure than the bWAA we did...Rbat / (RAR/WAR)?

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            • Originally posted by Sultan_1895-1948 View Post
              Here you go Layson......

              [ATTACH]139007[/ATTACH]
              Thanks!

              And of course it's no big surprise how close they are here. Both are ahead of Mantle, and that is a little surprising.

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              • Originally posted by Sultan_1895-1948 View Post
                Just to be clear, do you mean what's in post #125? (minus the incorrect SAeff of course)

                I'm curious to do a few players' OBP, same process as slugging, and see what you were talking about with Rbat or whatever. Would that be a better measure than the bWAA we did...Rbat / (RAR/WAR)?
                It would neutralize the player IF he got a particular relative boost from his ballpark.

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                • Ha....

                  You thought that low league SA would save Yaz huh?

                  YazBrettBest5.jpg

                  On a positive note, Brett is 2 points higher than Thome. Bet nobody woulda guessed that!
                  Last edited by Sultan_1895-1948; 05-23-2014, 09:26 PM.

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                  • Originally posted by layson27 View Post
                    Thanks!

                    And of course it's no big surprise how close they are here. Both are ahead of Mantle, and that is a little surprising.
                    Yeah, no shocker really, with Aaron and Mays. They are as neck and neck as players get. Which baffles me when people make an argument for Mays #1 and have Aaron around #10. The edges outside the batters box can't possibly carry that much weight. Aaron was an excellent runner and fielder in his own right.

                    Anyway, as for Mantle. It didn't really shock me, only because I know his xBH numbers aren't good at all.

                    It's one of the biggest mysteries in history, imo, why he didn't get more xtra base hits. Okay, that might be over-stating it, but you have a switch hitting power hitter, always platoon edge, with world-class speed, playing in the most spacious gap to gap parks in all of baseball. The only thing I attribute it to, is that he either lacked one or more of the following.

                    1. Ability to study and know fielders arms/tendencies
                    2. Did not bust it out of the box UNLESS it was in the infield.
                    3. Lacked the baseball instincts, which, when tied in with #1, would lead to calculated risks executed by aggression.

                    I have no idea.

                    Mantle AB/xBH
                    H - 8.39
                    R - 8.62

                    Gehrig AB/xBH
                    H - 7.15
                    R - 6.36

                    Meusel AB/xBH
                    H - 8.66
                    R - 8.99

                    DiMaggio AB/xBH
                    H - 8.25
                    A - 7.30

                    All xBH isn't as extreme as subtracting HR would be. Something was up though.
                    Last edited by Sultan_1895-1948; 05-23-2014, 09:07 PM.

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                    • Originally posted by brett View Post
                      It would neutralize the player IF he got a particular relative boost from his ballpark.
                      So that would require a league OBP data base. :atthepc

                      Pick and handful of players from post 125 and we'll see what happens.

                      For that, you said 1.04 instead of 1.02 for overall, right?

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                      • Originally posted by brett View Post
                        You also might want to pick a players top 5 now by expected SA, or road relative OPS+.
                        A next generation of Fever member will have to do that.

                        That would require looking at every year, players year by year splits, multiplying every road number by 1.02 and sorting them? I won't live long enough to do that. Their overall SA is heavily influenced by their top five, so that seems ok.

                        Besides, what really matters is their overall. The best five is a fun little peak window view though.
                        Last edited by Sultan_1895-1948; 05-23-2014, 09:30 PM.

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                        • ----------------------------------
                          Last edited by Sultan_1895-1948; 05-23-2014, 11:12 PM.

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                          • Originally posted by Sultan_1895-1948 View Post
                            So that would require a league OBP data base. :atthepc

                            Pick and handful of players from post 125 and we'll see what happens.

                            For that, you said 1.04 instead of 1.02 for overall, right?

                            No On base% is still 1.02 to find expected. 1.04 would be for slugging efficiency.

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                            • Originally posted by Sultan_1895-1948 View Post
                              Ha....

                              You thought that low league SA would save Yaz huh?

                              [ATTACH]139008[/ATTACH]

                              On a positive note, Brett is 2 points higher than Thome. Bet nobody woulda guessed that!
                              Keep in mind that Yaz league, park adjusted was .400 for those years. So his overall relative would be .552/.400 or 1.38. But if the road rates are a better indication, then he would lose about 5 points off of his career OPS+ at least (to around 124) plus probably a couple more points when OB% is factored in. He also would lose about 11 WAR. Again its not about an offensive park, its that he got more of a boost than the average guy.

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                              • A lot of left handers there?

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