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  • I used this http://www.baseball-almanac.com/hitting/hislug3.shtml to enter into excel.

    Brett said not to use the LGslg listed under the "more stats" at bbref.

    Just as an example, 1920 shows .407 for that one year under Ruth's "more stats" page. But if you actually click on AL, it shows the league slugged .387.

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    • On a side, note I was just looking through some of these guys' actual SA versus their "expected" overall SA. If the difference from expected to actual goes down, they are in red. And obviously if their actual was higher it's in blue.

      Aside from the platoon boost (which I think righties should get something at least), there has to be a way to account for this, beyond just simple park factors.

      Sorted by EXPECTED OVERALL, look at Piazza and Foxx. They're both gonna have leagues with a good SA; they are about dead even, except heading in the opposite direction; like a 75 point gap!

      Or check Mathews sandwiched between Greenberg and Mize. Then look over to how that's impacting his SAeff.

      DIFFbetweenEXPandACTUAL.jpg
      Last edited by Sultan_1895-1948; 05-19-2014, 06:12 PM.

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      • I double checked Mantle's & DiMaggio's league slugging averages and found those previous slugging numbers I posted were wrong! .377 for Mantle & .391 for DiMaggio are the right numbers.
        Glad we got that figured out, lol.

        I was thinking that subtracting player slugging % vs. league is another way to go. And then comparing H/A slugging differences.

        Example: Lou Gehrig
        Home Slugging difference vs. league= .620-.403= .217
        Road Slugging difference vs. league= .644-.403= .241

        Difference between H/A slugging advantage vs. league= +.24
        Or you could just use the difference between road slugging% vs. league= +.241

        There's just so many options in comparing hitters, this is another option.
        Last edited by layson27; 05-19-2014, 07:05 PM.

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        • Originally posted by layson27 View Post
          I double checked Mantle's & DiMaggio's league slugging averages and found those previous slugging numbers I posted were wrong! .377 for Mantle & .391 for DiMaggio are the right numbers.
          Glad we got that figured out, lol.
          All good my brotha!

          Comment


          • Originally posted by layson27 View Post
            I double checked Mantle's & DiMaggio's league slugging averages and found those previous slugging numbers I posted were wrong! .377 for Mantle & .391 for DiMaggio are the right numbers.
            Glad we got that figured out, lol.

            I was thinking that subtracting player slugging % vs. league is another way to go. And then comparing H/A slugging differences.

            Example: Lou Gehrig
            Home Slugging difference vs. league= .620-.403= .217
            Road Slugging difference vs. league= .644-.403= .241

            Difference between H/A slugging advantage vs. league= +.24
            Or you could just use the difference between road slugging% vs. league= +.241

            There's just so many options in comparing hitters, this is another option.
            Thank you for the input Layson. That's interesting.

            I just think there HAS to be another step, other than park factors. I mean, some of these guys benefitted WAY BEYOND the expected norm, and frankly, it shows up huge in SAeff.

            Perhaps that's exactly what's already been accounted for, and I need someone to just come head-slap me.

            Anyway, here's an update to the chart. Not taking it from excel until I figure out what's going on. (sorted by ADJ REL SA)

            Last edited by Sultan_1895-1948; 05-20-2014, 06:31 PM.

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            • Originally posted by Sultan_1895-1948 View Post
              Thank you for the input Layson. That's interesting.

              I just think there HAS to be another step, other than park factors. I mean, some of these guys benefitted WAY BEYOND the expected norm, and frankly, it shows up huge in SAeff.

              Perhaps that's exactly what's already been accounted for, and I need someone to just come head-slap me.

              Anyway, here's an update to the chart. Not taking it from excel until I figure out what's going on. (sorted by ADJ REL SA)
              Very interesting chart, thanks for putting in the hard work and sharing it.
              Definitely reinforces the Bill James suggestion of Clipper being the most screwed over by home park great.
              And I didn't think of Foxx, Kiner, and Frank Thomas as guys who were getting huge home park boosts.
              I don't see him on there, but I'm sure that Banks had a big Wrigley advantage.
              "If I drink whiskey, I'll never get worms!" - Hack Wilson

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              • Originally posted by Dude Paskert View Post
                Very interesting chart, thanks for putting in the hard work and sharing it.
                Definitely reinforces the Bill James suggestion of Clipper being the most screwed over by home park great.
                And I didn't think of Foxx, Kiner, and Frank Thomas as guys who were getting huge home park boosts.
                I don't see him on there, but I'm sure that Banks had a big Wrigley advantage.
                Thanks. Yeah Banks' expected overall is .471 and his actual is .500

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Dude Paskert View Post
                  Very interesting chart, thanks for putting in the hard work and sharing it.
                  Definitely reinforces the Bill James suggestion of Clipper being the most screwed over by home park great.
                  And I didn't think of Foxx, Kiner, and Frank Thomas as guys who were getting huge home park boosts.
                  I don't see him on there, but I'm sure that Banks had a big Wrigley advantage.
                  Any longtime Cub got a huge boost, but if I say that people just think it comes from a deep-seated hatred for anything Cub. That is partially true, I won't lie. However, it is also true that Cubs like Ernie Banks and Billy Williams, any of them actually, had pretty big home/road splits. It is kind of funny, because when I have brought it up, it doesn't go very far. Bring up home/road splits when it concerns any Red Sox players, and pages get reeled off about how much of a boost they enjoyed. Let's nail down these Cubbies too! Get 'em!
                  "It ain't braggin' if you can do it." Dizzy Dean

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                  • Lol Herrsky ur funny

                    They say dont lead the numbers anywhere. Let them lead you.

                    When talking park factors, they tend to take a distinct, blazing, warp speed-like path to a few cities.

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                    • 1st: Any plans to add some more players such as Pujols, McCovey, Stargell, V Guerrero, etc..

                      2nd: How about working on a "slugging prime" list, such as- each players ten best consecutive years?

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                      • Originally posted by layson27 View Post
                        1st: Any plans to add some more players such as Pujols, McCovey, Stargell, V Guerrero, etc..

                        2nd: How about working on a "slugging prime" list, such as- each players ten best consecutive years?
                        Already have Vladdy and several others done, up to the league SA step. Thats the one that takes time. Switching leagues from year to year, and if they played in both leagues the same year, I'm averaging them. I stoppd last night after looking at Kingmans carer lol.

                        Yes, that would be good. Much more time consuming but worth it. A five best and ten best perhaps. Not a big fan of the "consecutive years" approach.

                        Im also interested in what Brett mentioned about weighting for plate appearances but not sure of the process or the validity. Im not necessarily interested in giving compilers a bonus. But if its legit I'm down.

                        Now that I think more about it...what would the process be for looking at best 5 and best 10. Sort by their highest SA years and then look at the road line in each of those years?
                        Last edited by Sultan_1895-1948; 05-21-2014, 04:34 PM.

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                        • Ok, I've looked at Ted and Joe's top five SA seasons and figured their relative. Is this what you meant Layson?


                          Since lefties face a platoon edge about 70% of the time, and righties face a platoon edge about 30% of the time, I'd like to take that 40% difference somehow apply it to righties. If you multiply DiMaggio's 1.72 by 1.04, he ends up at 1.78. If you multiply Ted's 1.83 by .96 he's at 1.75. I have no idea if that is a correct way to account for it.

                          Look at that 1957 road slugging by Ballgame. Not a typo. Dude slugged his guts out that year, at a late age.

                          One thing that helped was Cleveland Stadium.

                          In 1954 it changed dimensions. On the left, is how it looked for DiMaggio's entire career. On the right, how it looked from 1954 on. Williams' slash there in 1957 was .481/.588/1.148 in 34 PA with 6 dingers. He nearly slugged 1.000 and hit 5 dingers in Briggs too (RF 325, LF 340).

                          Not to knock Teddy. He was a stud and a slugging behemoth but the more info the better.

                          Cleveland.jpg
                          Last edited by Sultan_1895-1948; 05-21-2014, 05:49 PM.

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                          • Great work!

                            One thing I would change- replace DiMaggio's 1940 on the list with 1950. He led the league in slugging that year.

                            Now that I think more about it...what would the process be for looking at best 5 and best 10. Sort by their highest SA years and then look at the road line in each of those years?
                            I would think so. You are specifically comparing slugging, not OPS or OPS+, so that's probably the way to go.

                            Btw, love how those pics look fit right into the stats.
                            Last edited by layson27; 05-21-2014, 06:25 PM.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by layson27 View Post
                              Great work!

                              One thing I would change- replace DiMaggio's 1940 on the list with 1950. He led the league in slugging that year.

                              I would think so. You are specifically comparing slugging, not OPS or OPS+, so that's probably the way to go.

                              Btw, love how those pics look fit right into the stats.
                              I know he led in 1950. He did so, while slugging .483 at home and .671 on the road! But, it's his 7th best overall SA season, so I didn't use it. It would take a VERY LONG time, to look through every year of these players' career, and find their top five road SA seasons.

                              Here's Foxx vs Piazza best 5 seasons.

                              Looking back at DiMaggio. He's 11 points ahead of Foxx. Williams is 11 points ahead of DiMaggio without platoon credit.

                              I wonder, in our Fever polls, how many had Foxx ahead of DiMaggio as hitters or as sluggers. I think that 11 points is a pretty big deal, righty vs righty.

                              Are there any two particular players you'd like to see matched up Layson?
                              Last edited by Sultan_1895-1948; 05-21-2014, 06:54 PM.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Sultan_1895-1948 View Post
                                I know he led in 1950. He did so, while slugging .483 at home and .671 on the road! But, it's his 7th best overall SA season, so I didn't use it. It would take a VERY LONG time, to look through every year of these players' career, and find their top five road SA seasons.

                                Here's Foxx vs Piazza best 5 seasons.
                                [ATTACH]138872[/ATTACH]

                                Looking back at DiMaggio. He's 11 points ahead of Foxx. Williams is 11 points ahead of DiMaggio without platoon credit.

                                I wonder, in our Fever polls, how many had Foxx ahead of DiMaggio as hitters or as sluggers. I think that 11 points is a pretty big deal, righty vs righty.
                                I have DiMaggio comfortably ahead of Foxx (about 5-6 spots) , but that's a minority opinion I'm sure.

                                Are there any two particular players you'd like to see matched up Layson?
                                How about Mays vs. Aaron?
                                Can't decide on second choice. Reggie vs. McCovey OR Vlad Guerrero vs. Bagwell or Thome. You choose.

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