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What Negro Leaguer is Still Not Inducted Into the Hall of Fame That Should Be?

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  • What Negro Leaguer is Still Not Inducted Into the Hall of Fame That Should Be?

    17 Negro Leaguers Inducted into Hall of Fame
    Seventeen from Negro Leagues, Pre-Negro leagues Eras inducted to the Hall of Fame

    12 players, five executives, including first woman, inducted in Cooperstown

    June 30, 2006

    COOPERSTOWN, NY: A committee of 12 Negro and pre-Negro leagues baseball historians elected 17 candidates to the National Baseball Hall of Fame today. The inductess joined Bruce Sutter, the lone electee from the Baseball Writers' Association of America election announcement in January.

    The inductees include seven Negro leagues players:

    Ray Brown
    Willard Brown
    Andy Cooper
    Biz Mackey
    Mule Suttles
    Cristobal Torriente
    Jud Wilson;
    And five pre-Negro leagues players:
    Frank Grant
    Pete Hill
    Jose Mendez
    Louis Santop
    Ben Taylor
    And also four Negro leagues executives:
    Effa Manley
    Alex Pompez
    Cum Posey
    J.L. Wilkinson
    And one pre-Negro leagues executive:
    Sol White

    Effa Manley, an owner in the Negro leagues, becomes the first woman elected to the Baseball Hall of Fame.

    Each of the 17 received the necessary 75% of the 12-member voting committee to earn election to the Hall of Fame. The committee reviewed the careers of 39 Negro and pre-Negro leagues candidates over a two-day meeting in Tampa. The list of 39 was pared from a roster of 94 candidates, narrowed by a five-member screening committee in November.

    The voting and screening committees were chaired by Fay Vincent, Major League Baseball's eighth commissioner and an Honorary Director of the National Baseball Hall of Fame and Museum. Vincent, the non-voting chairman, led discussions with committee members. The committee also received counsel from Hall of Famer Frank Robinson.

    The inductess join 18 Hall of Famers from the Negro leagues already enshrined in Cooperstown: Cool Papa Bell, Oscar Charleston, Ray Dandridge, Leon Day, Martin Dihigo, Bill Foster, Rube Foster, Josh Gibson, Monte Irvin, Judy Johnson, Buck Leonard, Pop Lloyd, Satchel Paige, Joe Rogan, Hilton Smith, Turkey Stearnes, Willie Wells and Smokey Joe Williams.
    Bingo DeMoss
    John Beckwith
    Nip Winters
    Spot Poles
    Oliver Marcelle
    Bruce Petway
    Dizzy Dismukes
    C. I. Taylor
    Dick Redding
    Frank Johnson
    Cannonball Jackman
    Buck O'Neil
    Larry Brown
    Frank Duncan
    Ed Bolden (Negro L. team owner/administrator)
    Last edited by Bill Burgess; 03-26-2008, 03:24 PM.

  • #2
    [B][COLOR=Red]Negro Leaguers already enshrined at Cooperstown:[/COLOR][/B]
    1971 - Satchel Paige --------------- Negro L. committee
    1972 - Josh Gibson ----------------- Negro L. committee
    1972 - Buck Leonard ---------------- Negro L. committee
    1973 - Monte Irvin ----------------- Negro L. committee
    1974 - "Cool Papa" Bell ------------ Negro L. committee
    1975 - Judy Johnson ---------------- Negro L. committee
    1976 - Oscar Charleston ------------ Negro L. committee
    1977 - Martin Dihigo --------------- Negro L. committee
    1977 - "Pop" Lloyd ----------------- Negro L. committee
    1981 - Rube Foster ------------------Veterans committee
    1987 - Ray Dandridge --------------- Veterans committee
    1995 - Leon Day -------------------- Veterans committee
    1996 - Willie Foster --------------- Veterans committee
    1997 - Willie Wells ---------------- Veterans committee
    1998 - Bullet Joe Rogan ------------ Veterans committee
    1999 - Smokey Joe Williams --------- Veterans committee
    2000 - Turkey Stearns -------------- Veterans committee
    2001 - Hilton Smith - ---------------Veterans committee
    2006 - Cumberland Willis "Cum" Posey-Special Election 
    2006 - Ben Taylor -------------------Special Election 
    2006 - George "Mule" Suttles---------Special Election 
    2006 - Raleigh Clarence "Biz" Mackay-Special Election 
    2006 - J. Preston "Pete" Hill--------Special Election 
    2006 - Cristobal "Carlos" Torrienti--Special Election 
    2006 - Louis "Santop" Loftin---------Special Election 
    2006 - Ray Brown---------------------Special Election
    2006 - Jud Wilson--------------------Special Election
    2006 - Jose Mendez-------------------Special Election
    2006 - Alex Pompez-------------------Special Election
    2006 - James (J.L.) Wilkinson--------Special Election
    2006 - Willard Brown-----------------Special Election
    2006 - Frank Grant-------------------Special Election
    2006 - Andy Cooper-------------------Special Election
    2006 - Sol White---------------------Special Election
    2006 - Effa Manley-------------------Special Election
    Last edited by Bill Burgess; 03-26-2008, 04:25 PM.


    • #3
      Here's my list.

      Elwood "Bingo" DeMoss, -----------2B,------------ 1910-30
      Oliver "Ghost" Marcelle, ---------3B,------------ 1918-24
      James Jesse "Nip" Winters,------- P,--------------1919-33
      Bruce Petway, --------------------C, Mgr.,------- 1906-25
      William "Dizzy" Dismukes, --------P, Mgr.,--------1909-30's
      Charles Islam "C. I." Taylor, ----Mgr.,-----------1904-22
      John Beckwith, -------------------SS,3B,C,OF,Mgr.-1916-38
      Spottswood "Spot" Poles, ---------OF,-------------1909-23


      • #4
        Besides Bill's List, Grant Johnson and Dick Redding come to mind.
        Dave Bill Tom George Mark Bob Ernie Soupy Dick Alex Sparky
        Joe Gary MCA Emanuel Sonny Dave Earl Stan
        Jonathan Neil Roger Anthony Ray Thomas Art Don
        Gates Philip John Warrior Rik Casey Tony Horace
        Robin Bill Ernie JEDI


        • #5
          C Quincy Trouppe?
          1B Buck O'Neil (most for non-playing contributions)
          2B Bill Monroe?
          3B John Beckwith!
          SS Grat Johnson
          SS Dobie Moore and Dicky Lundy?
          LF Chino Smith (if you REALLY focus on peak)
          CF Spot Poles?
          RF Bill Wright?
          P Dick Redding
          P John Donaldson?
          P Nip Winters?


          • #6
            Here are some background References Resources.

            In 1952, the Pittsburgh Courier polled 31 Negro league players, writers, officials and managers and they
            selected the following team:

            A Team------------------------B Team

            1B - Buck Leonard-----------1B - Ben Taylor
            2B - Jackie Robinson---------2B - Bingo DeMoss
            SS - John Henry Lloyd-------SS - Willie Wells
            3B - Oliver Marcell-----------3B - Judy Johnson
            LF - Monte Irvin-------------LF - Pete Hall
            CF - Oscar Charleston-------CF - Cool Papa Bell
            RF - Christobal Torriente----RF - Chino Smith
            C - Josh Gibson / Biz Mackey-C - Campanella / Bruce Petway
            P - Smokey Joe Williams------P - Dave Brown
            P - Satchel Paige------------P - Cannonball Dick Redding
            P - Bullet Joe Rogan---------P - Nip Winters
            P - John Donaldson ----------P - Dizzy Dismukes
            P - Willie Foster-------------P - Don Newcombe
            Utility OF - Martin Dihigo---Utility 1B - John Beckwith
            Utility IF - Martin Dihigo----Utility 1B - Newt Allen
            Utility IF - Sam Banheart---Utility - Clint Thomas
            Coaches - Dizzy Dismukes--coaches - C. I. Taylor
            Coaches - Danny McClelland--coaches - Dave Malarcher
            Manager = Rube Foster-------Manager - Cum Posey
            The Pittsburgh Courier, a black newspaper, polled its fans in 1952. Their readers listed the following players into 5 teams:

            First team: (1B) Buck Leonard, (2B) Jackie Robinson, (SS) Pop Lloyd, (3B) Oliver Marcelle, (OF) Monte Irvin, (OF) Oscar Charleston, (OF) Cristobel Torriente, (C) Josh Gibson, (C) Biz Mackey, (P) Joe Williams, (P) Satchel Paige, (P) Bullet Rogan, (P) John Dondaldson, (P) Bill Foster, (Utility) Martin Dihigo, (Utility) Sam Bankhead, (Mgr) Rube Foster, (Coach) Dizzy Dismukes, (Coach) Danny McClellan.

            Second Team: (1B) Ben Taylor, (2B) Bingo DeMoss, (SS) Willie Wells, (3B) Judy Johnson, (OF) Pete Hill, (OF) Cool Papa Bell, (OF) Chino Smith, (C) Roy Campanella, (C) Bruce Petway, (P) Dave Brown, (P) Dick Redding, (P) Nip Winters, (P) Dizzy Dismukes, (P) Don Newcombe, (Utility) John Beckwith, (Utility) Newt Allen, (Mgr) Cum Posey, (Coach) C.I. Taylor, (Coach) Dave Malarcher.

            Third Team: (1B) Jud Wilson, (2B) Bill Monroe, (SS) Dick Lundy, (3B) Jud Wilson, (OF) Rap Dixon, (OF) Larry Doby, (OF) Fats Jenkins, (C) Double Duty Radcliffe, (C) Louis Santop, (P) Slim Jones, (P) Bill Holland, (P) Phil Cockrell, (P) Webster McDonald, (P) Bill Byrd, (Utility) Emmett Bowman, (Utility) Dick Wallace, (Mgr) Ed Bolden.

            Fourth Team: (1B) Ed Douglas, (2B) George Scales, (SS) Doby Moore, (3B) Ray Dandridge, (OF) Jimmy Lyons, (OF) Mule Suttles, (OF) Spotswood Poles, (C) Frank Duncan, (C) Bill Perkins, (P) Double Duty Radcliffe, (P) Frank Wickware, (P) Danny McClellan, (P) Leon Day, (P) Bill Jackman, (Utility) Rev Cannady, (Utility) Jose Mendez, (Mgr) Vic Harris.

            Fifth Team: (1B) George Carr, (2B) Bunny Downs, (SS) Pelayo Chacon, (3B) Dave Malarcher, (OF) Frank Duncan, (OF) Turkey Stearnes, (OF) Jelly Gardner, (C) Doc Wiley, (C) Speck Webster, (P) Stringbean Williams, (P) Ray Brown, (P) Rats Henderson, (P) Luis Tiant, (P) Leroy Matlock.

            Others receiving votes: (1B) Leroy Grant, Mule Suttles; (2B) Nate Harris, Sammy T. Hughes, Frank Warfield, Ray Dandridge, George Wright, Harry Williams; (SS) Gerard Williams, Bobby Williams, Morton Clark; (3B) Bill Francis, Jim Taylor; (OF) Minnie Minoso, Jap Payne, Blaine Hall, Ted Strong, Ted Page, Vic Harris; (P) Jose Mendez, Laymon Yokely.

            *Some players that weren't listed but could have been: (1B) Buck O'Neil, Red Moore, Steel Arm Davis, George Giles; (2B) Bonnie Serrell; (SS) Jake Stephens; (3B) Alec Radcliffe, Bobby Robinson; (OF) Jumbo Kimbro, Willard Brown, Bill Wright, Neil Robinson, Ducky Davenport; (C) Quincy Trouppe, Larry Brown, Buck Ewing, Pops Coleman; (P) Chet Brewer, Hilton Smith, Barney Brown, Ted Trent, Max Manning, Sug Cornelius, Harry Salmon, Barney Morris; (Mgr) Buck O'Neil, Double Duty Radcliffe, Quincy Trouppe.
            In my attempt to be useful, I'd like to contribute these profiles, generously provided to us by Jim Albright. May these assist others in the Fever Hall of Fame, our endless polls/surveys.

            Jim has kindly provided these additional Negro League reference resources for our benefit, to guide our selections.
            Negro L. data

            John Beckwith
            An undisciplined, mean, and short-tempered player, Beckwith stands with Josh Gibson as the two greatest right-handed batters to play in the Negro Leagues. A dangerous slugger, he crushed mammoth home runs and gathered hits by the bundle. Beckwith began with Frank Leland's Chicago Giants from 1916-23, when his dead-pull hitting led opponents to shift their defense to the left side of the field. Beckwith played with numerous teams in subsequent years, his malignant personality undoubtedly contributing to his short stay in many cases. A defensive liability as well, Beckwith's value as a hitter ranks him among the greatest right-handed hitters of any color, during any era.

            Christobal Torriente
            C.I. Taylor famously said, "If I should see Torriente walking up the other side of the street, I would say, 'There walks a ballclub.' " Torriente was one of the finest outfielders in Negro League history, and one of the best overall players. A premiere slugger before home-run hitting took off, Torriente scorched line drives to all fields. Thickly built but light afoot, he was one of the finest defensive center fielders ever. Torriente starred with the Chicago American Giants from 1918-25 when the team was consistently among the best in baseball. A moody and sometimes difficult player, he left the American Giants amidst controversy and spent his final years shuttling between teams. One of the greatest Cuban-born players, Torriente was an inaugural member of the Cuban Hall of Fame.

            Pete Hill
            This outfielder began his long association with black baseball in 1899 and starred for the powerhouse Leland Giants and the Chicago American Giants. While existing statistics do not support the claims, many of his contemporaries considered him perhaps the finest hitter, and certainly the finest clutch hitter, of his era. A popular player who served as the team captain with the American Giants, Hill boasted solid defense, tremendous footspeed, and proficiency at the "inside baseball" style of play championed by his manager.

            Grant Johnson
            Nicknamed "Home Run" for his timely-if-infrequent blasts, this middle infielder helped form the Page Fence Giants in 1895 and was still playing nearly 30 years latter. Johnson was a leading hitter and a frequent captain for some of the best teams in the Negro Leagues, including the Brooklyn Royal Giants of the mid-to-late 1900s, the 1910 Leland Giants, and the great New York Lincoln Giants of the early 1910s. A good-natured, paternalistic team player, "Home Run" Johnson was one of the best players of his era.

            John Henry Lloyd
            The Negro Leagues produced a wealth of fine all-around shortstops, strong hitters and fielders both, but none rivaled John Henry Lloyd. "Pop" was the best Negro League player before the Negro National League in 1920. A star defensively who could play any infield position, Lloyd was also a marvelous base runner, a talented and patient hitter, and among the best at applying the "inside baseball" strategies favored in Negro League play. Expert at manufacturing a run, Lloyd competed for more than 10 teams during his storied career, playing for the owner willing to pay him the most. A man of strong moral fiber and particularly wonderful temperament, Pop Lloyd was one of the greatest three position players to play in the Negro Leagues.

            Bill Monroe
            Monroe was the greatest Negro Leaguer of the first decade of the century. Possessing a flare for the dramatic and superior talent, Monroe was particularly valuable in the field, where he flashed great range and avoided costly errors while delighting the fans with his showboating on the easier plays. He was a good contact hitter, on base regularly, with tremendous speed. He started with the Chicago Unions in 1896 and went on to contribute to the success of many of the finest teams of his era: The three-time champion Philadelphia Giants and the Brooklyn Royal Giants of 1907-10, before winding down his career with Rube Foster's first capable Chicago American Giants teams through the mid-1910s. Handsome and popular, Monroe stands with John Henry Lloyd as the finest Negro League players of their generation.

            Bruce Petway
            An intelligent student of the game, "Buddy" possessed numerous skills not typical in the men who have donned the "tools of ignorance" over the years. A switch-hitter, Petway was an excellent bunter, a contact hitter who protected runners well and a frequent threat to steal a base. He had a patient batting eye. However, his greatest strength was his legendary throwing arm. He was best remembered for throwing out Ty Cobb three times in a 1910 Cuban set of games. He spent eight seasons in his prime with the early Chicago American Giants, and seven with the Detroit Stars as a player-manager.

            Spot Poles
            The most prolific leadoff hitter of the early days, Poles was a superior defensive outfielder who hit for high averages, had a sharp batting eye, and ran the bases with singular speed that helped him pilfer many bases and score a lot of runs. Poles spent most of his career with the New York Lincoln Giants, enjoying two extended stints between 1911-23. A World War I hero who was a coach for many years after his playing years, Poles was an intense competitor and an impressive physical specimen and athlete.

            Ted Radcliffe
            Called "Double Duty" for his dual role as starting pitcher and top catcher, Radcliffe is a unique figure in the annals of baseball history. No other pitcher at a Major League level has spent virtually his entire career as a full-time player on his off-days, let alone as a catcher, easily the most demanding position on the diamond. Of course, we can just as easily look at it the opposite way and observe that no starting player, never mind a catcher, has also taken a regular turn in solid pitching rotations for most of a career that spanned past the end of the color line. A superior catcher and solid pitcher, "Duty" played in numerous All-Star contests, as both catcher and a pitcher. He had a steady throwing arm, was quick defensively, and was a solid batter. As a pitcher he enjoyed throwing a variety of illegal pitches to confound the opposition. A ballplayer who always gravitated toward the fattest paycheck, Radcliffe never spent more than two successive seasons with the same team until the very end of his career, retiring as a unique competitor in the rich history of our national pastime.

            George Stovey
            The "oldest" ballplayer in this set, Stovey was among the black ballplayers competing in the white minor leagues when the color line was put into place in 1887. In fact, Stovey is the pitcher who touched off Cap Anson's well-documented refusal to play the Newark club in 1887. A marvelous hurler who reportedly was considered for signing by Major League clubs, the left-hander pitched for the original Cuban Giants teams. Stovey's statistical accomplishments may have been marred by racial prejudices and the record keeping of the time, but he remains one of the most important baseball players of the 19th Century.

            Ben Taylor
            A star hitter on the solid early entries of the Indianapolis ABC's, Taylor stands as the finest all-around first baseman in the first 40 years of black baseball. He was nimble around the sack and hit to all fields, both able to knock home important runs and protect or advance the baserunner if necessary. Beginning in 1910, Taylor played, managed and coached numerous clubs. In the early years he played for powerhouses like the New York Lincoln Giants and Chicago American Giants. Taylor was a member of the largest ballplaying family in the Negro Leagues.

            Frank Wickware
            A fireballing right hander, Wickware spent the better part of 10 seasons between the Leland Giants and Chicago American Giants during his 14-year career. He was among the best hurlers in the 1910s, but Wickware's freewheeling lifestyle, lackadaisical attitude, and uneven demeanor made him a handful for his various managers and contributed as much to his early decline as much as any erosion of talent.
            Coming in March: Josh Gibson and the mighty Homestead Grays.


            • #7
              I guess I would cast a cold eye on any more admissions from the Negro Leagues. That group is well represented in the HoF and while some of the proposed members would be better than some of the members who have been elected let's just call it a day and move on.
              Buck O'Neil: The Monarch of Baseball


              • #8
                --I agree that a group inducting 17 members at once should have been able to close this chapter. Unfortunately they picked some clinkers and missed some fairly obvious choices. Personally I'd never have allowed such a broad net to be cast. Better to do 5 (or even 10) with a followup a few years later to close the books. After there was a chance to review the work the last committee.


                • #9
                  One of the strange voting patterns was the Judy Johnson was voted into the Hall of Fame before Oscar Charleston. Does anyone else find that odd?


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by leecemark View Post
                    --I agree that a group inducting 17 members at once should have been able to close this chapter. Unfortunately they picked some clinkers and missed some fairly obvious choices. Personally I'd never have allowed such a broad net to be cast. Better to do 5 (or even 10) with a followup a few years later to close the books. After there was a chance to review the work the last committee.
                    Quite agree. They should have been able to close this issue out for good. My list represents my final close-out. Wish they'd have gotten it right. Would have made this so much easier. Could and should have been closed out.
                    Last edited by Bill Burgess; 03-26-2008, 02:24 PM.


                    • #11
                      --I find it odd that Judy Johnson was voted in at all. Frankly I would guess that most of us know more about the Negro Leagues (and I'm FAR from an expert) than the people who made the early selections. The last panel should have had some very knowledgable people, but even their choices were puzzling. Who knows what kind of agendas were in play for the various selection processes.


                      • #12
                        Honestly... Chino Smith should be in the HoF... His peak is unheard of basically. I know it was short with 7 years... He would be one of the rare exceptions in the HoF like Addie Joss since he had an untimely death.

                        If for example, Albert Pujols died tomorrow... would you consider him HoF even though he played 7 years with all of them being a peak?

                        Although I would like to see more Negro League players in the HoF, but I would be fine with it is right now if they don't add anymore. We pretty much got the elite players right now in the HoF which is the way it should be. Chino Smith is what I consider "elite" which is why I think he should be in, even with his short career and untimely death.
                        "Back before I injured my hip, I thought going to the gym was for wimps."
                        Bo Jackson

                        Actually, I think they were about the same because I lettered in all sports, and I was a two-time state decathlon champion.
                        Bo Jackson

                        My sophomore year I placed 2nd, and my junior and senior year - I got smart and piled up enough points between myself and second place where I didn't have to run the mile.
                        Bo Jackson


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by leecemark View Post
                          --I find it odd that Judy Johnson was voted in at all. Frankly I would guess that most of us know more about the Negro Leagues (and I'm FAR from an expert) than the people who made the early selections. The last panel should have had some very knowledgable people, but even their choices were puzzling. Who knows what kind of agendas were in play for the various selection processes.
                          I thought Johnson himself was on those committees. Whether or not he held enough influence to get elected is something I have no idea about. The poll results Bill produced showed he was at least well respected.

                          Bill, was there a Buck Ewing in the Negro Leagues, or did you just throw your old favorite's name in there to see who is paying attention?
                          Dave Bill Tom George Mark Bob Ernie Soupy Dick Alex Sparky
                          Joe Gary MCA Emanuel Sonny Dave Earl Stan
                          Jonathan Neil Roger Anthony Ray Thomas Art Don
                          Gates Philip John Warrior Rik Casey Tony Horace
                          Robin Bill Ernie JEDI


                          • #14
                            If more people knew the numbers and name of John Beckwith, there would be a major outcry for the guy. We're talking almost Jimmie Foxx level, and from a 3Bman. OK, so the guy was a Rogers Hornsby level ass...but Rogers is still in


                            • #15
                              Frank Johnson definately deserves to be there.
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