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Leo Mazzone

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  • Extra Innings
    replied
    Originally posted by Steve Jeltz View Post
    I don't think it is a coincedence that when those pitchers left Atlanta, they never performed at the same level as they did under Mazzone.
    Damian Moss. Had a decent 2002 season, but fell apart afterwards. Maybe it had to do with something else though...

    Terrell Wade. Had a good '96 season, but didn't really find a permanent role with the team. Didn't progress too far after that.

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  • chip&smoltz95
    replied
    lowest era and batting average against in the NL. I think roger is doing a fine job. Purebaseball fan is right, they just need to find a way to wake up on the road. Cox needs to do something to shake it up or something.

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  • PureBaseballFan
    replied
    Originally posted by Steve Jeltz View Post
    Kevin Millwood, Jorge Sosa, Steve Avery are a few young pitchers that Mazzone worked well with over his years in Atlanta. I know I am forgetting some others. Remember when Smoltz was somewhere around 2-11 at the 1991 All Star Break? I don't think it is a coincedence that when those pitchers left Atlanta, they never performed at the same level as they did under Mazzone.
    Sosa was a flash in the pan that got lucky for a season nothing more. Millwood has if you really look at it 3 great years and the rest are average to good. (You may disagree but wins are not everything to me)

    I never said Mazzone was the worst with young pitchers just that it isn't his strongest talent, did Mazzone help some pitchers of course but he was also blessed to have a huge amount of talent like Maddux, Glavine and Smoltz among others. Mazzone's strongest trait was taking a somewhat talented older pitcher that was willing to learn and turning him into a different pitcher that attacked the outside corner, and for me there is the problem if you have talented pitchers with great control like Maddux or Glavine that is a good plan (not to mention the wide strikezones of the 90s) it can work but with young guys that usually have control questions it can make their development even more of a challenge. I do remember a story about Jason Marquis just not getting along with Mazzone because Marquis struggled with Mazzone's strategy thus causing problems. Jason was never a control pitcher and to tell him to nibble the corners which took away from his semi-power pitcher stuff was taking away from his strength. (Not a debate about Marquis I know he isn't the best pitcher)

    So looking at the guys you listed the last really talented guy that was with Mazzone was Millwood which was 6 years ago. Looking at his most recent record with young talented pitchers he just doesn't impress me much. Guys like Daniel Cabrera and Adam Loewen both semi-talented guys were busts with Mazzone both having trouble with control. (Loewen was lucky to have a below 4.00 ERA even for a small sampling he gave up more walks then strikeouts and gave up nearly a hit per inning)

    I was never trying to say Mazzone was a bad coach because I don't believe in that statement but in recent years he has struggled to get the most out of what some see as talented young pitchers. I think McDowell has done a fine job with guys like Jo-Jo, (though the stats don't show it) Jair along with olders guys like Hudson. Right now the Braves have one of the better pitching staffs not the best but far from the worst. (top 5 team ERA) Personally if I had to hire a guy right now to be a pitching coach it would be neither of them and would be Guy Hansen who doesn't get nearly the credit he deserves with helping guys with mechanics or coming back from injuries.

    As much as I like Mazzone and think he should get a long look at a potential HOF bid I just don't think he is the right guy to lead a Braves pitching staff into the future.

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  • Steve Jeltz
    replied
    Originally posted by PureBaseballFan View Post
    Not to mention the potential that the Braves could be seeing young pitchers in a year or two and for me that was Mazzone's biggest weakness in that he didn't work with young pitcher to well.
    Kevin Millwood, Jorge Sosa, Steve Avery are a few young pitchers that Mazzone worked well with over his years in Atlanta. I know I am forgetting some others. Remember when Smoltz was somewhere around 2-11 at the 1991 All Star Break? I don't think it is a coincedence that when those pitchers left Atlanta, they never performed at the same level as they did under Mazzone.

    Leave a comment:


  • PureBaseballFan
    replied
    Originally posted by cwu View Post
    OK, Leo is out at Baltimore after only two seasons.. He indicated on national TV last Saturday that he's still interested in coaching. Maybe he's the spark that the Braves need to get their rears in gear. I say MAKE HIM AN OFFER.
    Thats okay he is fine rocking in the booth. Don't get me wrong I liked Mazzone while he was here but McDowell is doing a fine job. Not to mention the potential that the Braves could be seeing young pitchers in a year or two and for me that was Mazzone's biggest weakness in that he didn't work with young pitcher to well.

    The Braves don't need a kick in the butt they need a kick in the head to wake up on the road and play the way like they do at home.

    Leave a comment:


  • cwu
    started a topic Leo Mazzone

    Leo Mazzone

    OK, Leo is out at Baltimore after only two seasons.. He indicated on national TV last Saturday that he's still interested in coaching. Maybe he's the spark that the Braves need to get their rears in gear. I say MAKE HIM AN OFFER.

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