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Matt Murton vs Felix Pie

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  • #31
    It is both.

    The Cubs since the days of Dallas Green have liked to draft toolsy players and ever since Green left they have been unable to get those players to develop. These toolsy players always tend to have a ton of promise early on but never seem to develop into major leaguers. Very very few players the Cubs draft ever make it up the food chain and they tend to be below average.

    Hinske, Patterson, Dunston, Glanville, and others.

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    • #32
      As a cubs fan i would be dissapointed to see them trade Murton because he is great at the plate especially against leftys.

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      • #33
        I think another factor in our lack of position players is that we have tended to draft more pitchers than position players. The fact that many of those pitchers went on to have arm trouble is unfortunate, but we draft alot of pitchers. That seems to have changed recently (Vitter, Corvin, etc). But there were years we had 3 first-round picks and drafted all pitching.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Jeff Pico View Post
          I think another factor in our lack of position players is that we have tended to draft more pitchers than position players. The fact that many of those pitchers went on to have arm trouble is unfortunate, but we draft alot of pitchers. That seems to have changed recently (Vitter, Corvin, etc). But there were years we had 3 first-round picks and drafted all pitching.
          We've concentrated on pitching the last 15 years because it has become one of our mantras, "you can always trade young pitching". And we've done alot of it, in fact since trading away Rafael Palmerio in 88, trading our young arms has been our main bait (also with Lee for Choi in 03).

          Well even with our recent positional player picks in the draft, Colvin, Vitters, Thomas, Donaldson, etc all have serious questions about their success. Colvin has poor plate discipline, Vitters is so young that anything can happen, Thomas has no real defensive position, while Donaldson needs to prove that he can stay as a catcher. With the 2008 draft up coming the Cubs have the 19th and 42nd pick overall, this draft is heavy on power hitting 1B as well as midlevel starters, the rest of the crop is pretty weak.
          What a Batted Ball is Worth (in terms of a run):
          Line Drive: .356
          HBP: .342
          Non-Intentional Walk: .315
          Intentional Walk: .176
          Outfield Fly: .035
          Groundball: -.101
          Bunts: -.103
          Infield Fly: -.243
          Strikeout: -.287
          It's now officially Doctor Bob Sacamento, D.C., C.S.C.S., and working on my D.A.B.C.O. (Diplomate American Board of Chiropractic Orthopedics)

          Comment


          • #35
            Almost don't want to write this and put some sort of jinx on it, but Soto looks to have a decent chance of panning out as our first true blue home grown position talent to someday reach the all-stars in a long time. He was drafted with the 318th pick. You can look at that one of two ways: the Cubs spotted his talent when others missed it, or more likely, the proverbial blind squirrel found its occasional nut.
            To offset some of the pain of being a diehard Cubs fan, I've learned to also be a moderate Yankees fan.

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by Scartissue View Post
              Almost don't want to write this and put some sort of jinx on it, but Soto looks to have a decent chance of panning out as our first true blue home grown position talent to someday reach the all-stars in a long time. He was drafted with the 318th pick.
              Well he's going to have some tough competition if he wants on the All Star roster especially as a starter. Russell Martin is going to start for quite some time and the NL is full of up and coming catchers (McCann, Molina, Towles).
              What a Batted Ball is Worth (in terms of a run):
              Line Drive: .356
              HBP: .342
              Non-Intentional Walk: .315
              Intentional Walk: .176
              Outfield Fly: .035
              Groundball: -.101
              Bunts: -.103
              Infield Fly: -.243
              Strikeout: -.287
              It's now officially Doctor Bob Sacamento, D.C., C.S.C.S., and working on my D.A.B.C.O. (Diplomate American Board of Chiropractic Orthopedics)

              Comment


              • #37
                RE: Soto, I would settle for "Major League Solid Starter". It's really amazing how few have produced over such a long period of time. Since Mark Grace, I don't think anyone has really been a "Solid MLB Starter". That is really a long long long time!

                I am not counting Patterson, Girardi, Glanville, Theriot as "Solid" starters.

                Comment


                • #38
                  I've had reservations about Soto since he first reached the majors. Granted, he's had a tiny sample to draw from (less than 150 PAs), but while some may say that works in his favor, it could very well go the other way. He seems to be overmatched by good power pitchers from what I've seen and with a more developed scouting report, I think more flaws in his game will be exposed. Considering that he's below average defensively, I think he's being a little overhyped. On the flip side, he does have some patience and some power. His success in the minors has been largely acclaimed based on one season (last year) and I'm not buying that as a true measure of his ability.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Bob Sacamento View Post
                    Well he's going to have some tough competition if he wants on the All Star roster especially as a starter. Russell Martin is going to start for quite some time and the NL is full of up and coming catchers (McCann, Molina, Towles).
                    Overall, I expect Martin and McCann to be better next few years. Molina's terrific defensively, but Soto I think could be better overall. Don't know enough about Towles yet.

                    If Soto becomes an all-star, it would probably take the combination of (1) playing for the Cubs (helps with the popularity and attention) and (2) Martin and McCann having an off year (and McCann had an off year last year). When I say he has a decent chance, I'm by no means saying it's more likely than not; I just mean it's a lot better than that of the vast majority of past Cubs players.
                    Last edited by Scartissue; 04-18-2008, 10:31 AM.
                    To offset some of the pain of being a diehard Cubs fan, I've learned to also be a moderate Yankees fan.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      One guy who is impressing early is Reed Johnson. I have mixed feelings about that as I think Pie needs to play. But Reed is doing a nice job.

                      I'm also partial to the high-socks look, I think it's old school. It makes you look slow, but it's cool.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Jeff Pico View Post
                        RE: Soto, I would settle for "Major League Solid Starter". It's really amazing how few have produced over such a long period of time. Since Mark Grace, I don't think anyone has really been a "Solid MLB Starter". That is really a long long long time!

                        I am not counting Patterson, Girardi, Glanville, Theriot as "Solid" starters.
                        Brendan Harris has turned out to be a good infielder definitely better than most were thinking. I thought he was going to go the way of Bobby Hill but last year was a breakout year for him in Tampa. His bat came to life showing the power everyone knew he had along with working walks. He also got alot of press because he was putting up these offensive numbers as a SS albeit a piss poor defensive one. Now that he was traded from Tampa to the Twins, Minnesota has shifted him back to his best position, 2B, with the Wizard Adam Everett at SS.
                        What a Batted Ball is Worth (in terms of a run):
                        Line Drive: .356
                        HBP: .342
                        Non-Intentional Walk: .315
                        Intentional Walk: .176
                        Outfield Fly: .035
                        Groundball: -.101
                        Bunts: -.103
                        Infield Fly: -.243
                        Strikeout: -.287
                        It's now officially Doctor Bob Sacamento, D.C., C.S.C.S., and working on my D.A.B.C.O. (Diplomate American Board of Chiropractic Orthopedics)

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Rapmaster View Post
                          I've had reservations about Soto since he first reached the majors. Granted, he's had a tiny sample to draw from (less than 150 PAs), but while some may say that works in his favor, it could very well go the other way. He seems to be overmatched by good power pitchers from what I've seen and with a more developed scouting report, I think more flaws in his game will be exposed. Considering that he's below average defensively, I think he's being a little overhyped. On the flip side, he does have some patience and some power. His success in the minors has been largely acclaimed based on one season (last year) and I'm not buying that as a true measure of his ability.
                          Below average defensively? The best part of Soto's game is his defensive, he's a great game caller, strong arm, and good blocker. Geo's defensive game has been ready since the beginning of the 2006 season. It's his offensive game that has long lagged mainly his power. Yes, last year was a career minor league year for Geo, he's never going to come close to posting a .353/424/.652/1.076. But throughout his career his been fairly consistent with contact and the ability to draw walks so a .260-.270/.335-.350 line isn't out of the question especially for his first full season. The question is how many extrabases is he going to put up? Before last seasons' huge SLG explosion Geo struggled to slug over .410 in a season doing so only once. With his stroke and eye, a slugging % of .400 or slightly more isn't out of the question for his rookie year. So even on bad projections Geo is looking at a .260/.335/.385/.720 line which is actually decent for a catcher.
                          What a Batted Ball is Worth (in terms of a run):
                          Line Drive: .356
                          HBP: .342
                          Non-Intentional Walk: .315
                          Intentional Walk: .176
                          Outfield Fly: .035
                          Groundball: -.101
                          Bunts: -.103
                          Infield Fly: -.243
                          Strikeout: -.287
                          It's now officially Doctor Bob Sacamento, D.C., C.S.C.S., and working on my D.A.B.C.O. (Diplomate American Board of Chiropractic Orthopedics)

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Looks like the Cubs brought up Murton and sent Patterson down to AAA.

                            Woo!

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Bob Sacamento View Post
                              Brendan Harris has turned out to be a good infielder definitely better than most were thinking. I thought he was going to go the way of Bobby Hill but last year was a breakout year for him in Tampa. His bat came to life showing the power everyone knew he had along with working walks. He also got alot of press because he was putting up these offensive numbers as a SS albeit a piss poor defensive one. Now that he was traded from Tampa to the Twins, Minnesota has shifted him back to his best position, 2B, with the Wizard Adam Everett at SS.
                              Good point, but jury is still out on Harris as a regular. Anyone can have a good year, and a so-so career. Let's see if he strings 3 decent seasons together before calling him a Cub Farm system success.

                              Hinske, Patterson, Glanville, all had at least one very good year....and lots of mediocrity. At least Glanville is funny, I enjoy his writing.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                PS, maybe we should start another thread......

                                Theriot vs. Cedeno

                                I would like Ronny to get more PT. Theriot is a guy I LOVE to have on the bench, but not in the starting lineup.

                                Comment

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