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  • Originally posted by Iowanic View Post
    Agreed: if this year doesn't matter, there's no point of taking risks.
    Like I said, I think it would be the worthy thing for someone in cubs management to come right out and say so.
    "no; this just isn't a season where we're interested in winning. We've got more important things to do with our fans money..."
    So you would jeopardize Tyler Colvin's development on a half baked idea that the Cubs and Colvin haven't prepared for for what exactly? In the hopes that the Cubs can finish the season at .500? In the hopes that the offense explodes and they win 90 games? The Cubs winning this year is an extreme long shot, damaging their prospect in an inept attempt to get him more at bats is much more likely than the Cubs winning 90 games this year.

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    • So that's what the fans are paying for....I see.
      I eagerly await Pinella 'manning-up' and saying so to the people paying his salary...

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      • So again your idea is to throw Colvin into a foreign situation simply because we have to sacrifice everything for this season and this season alone? It is this kind of mentality that keeps the Cubs mediocre year after year and helps keep them from actually developing players. It takes a lot of hard work to develop young players. You can't simply treat them like icons in a video game and expect them to develop. You can't take a "win now" approach with prospects, you have to be patient and help them develop and reach their full potential. If you keep throwing them in the meat grinder and expecting them to survive all you'll end up getting is failed prospects and mediocre or worse teams.

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        • Originally posted by Ubiquitous View Post
          So again your idea is to throw Colvin into a foreign situation simply because we have to sacrifice everything for this season and this season alone? It is this kind of mentality that keeps the Cubs mediocre year after year and helps keep them from actually developing players. It takes a lot of hard work to develop young players. You can't simply treat them like icons in a video game and expect them to develop. You can't take a "win now" approach with prospects, you have to be patient and help them develop and reach their full potential. If you keep throwing them in the meat grinder and expecting them to survive all you'll end up getting is failed prospects and mediocre or worse teams.
          Really? Is that how the Cubs won with Jerome Walton and Dwight Smith 20 years ago? Because you have to baby rookies? I've never heard of a player who developed by sitting on the bench.

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          • Originally posted by The Uncoach View Post
            Really? Is that how the Cubs won with Jerome Walton and Dwight Smith 20 years ago? Because you have to baby rookies?
            How did Jerome Walton and Dwight Smith turn out? Kidding aside, Jerome Walton was asked to play centerfield. A position he was trained to play. Dwight Smith played the corner outfield spots, a position he was trained to play. Dwight Smith started 84 games and Jerome Walton started 114 games. They did not throw them out there in unfamiliar positions and simply forget about them.

            I've never heard of a player who developed by sitting on the bench.
            Jimmie Foxx

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            • http://chicago.cubs.mlb.com/news/art...=.jsp&c_id=chc

              Guess they decided winning might be something the fans wanna see. And it's a bit harder winning with your best players on the bench.

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              • In right field.

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                • Originally posted by Ubiquitous View Post
                  Jimmie Foxx
                  Jimmy Foxx made his ML debut at the age of 17. Other than A-Rod, he's the youngest player to reach 500 home runs. That's hardly an indication of someone who got better by sitting on the bench.

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                  • Sounds to me like he did pretty well for somone who sat on the bench for three years. I can't see how that is "hardly an indication"

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                    • Kiki Cuyler
                      Brooks Robinson
                      Harmon Killebrew
                      Lou Gehrig
                      Charlie Gehringer
                      Joe Cronin
                      Carlton Fisk
                      Tony Perez
                      Billy Williams
                      etc, etc, etc

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                      • Originally posted by Ubiquitous View Post
                        Sounds to me like he did pretty well for somone who sat on the bench for three years. I can't see how that is "hardly an indication"
                        That's what happens when you come into a league at 17 yo to a team that already has a catcher. Not only have you mentioned this 17 yo player in relation to a discussion on a 24 yo player which doesn't make any sense, you simply presented a name without backing a claim up. In Foxx' first year as a full-time first baseman he hit .354. Is there some indication that sitting on the bench aided his muscle development and swing? Oh, yeah. That's right. It can't. Your claim also doesn't make any sense with Starlin Castro inserted into the Cubs' starting lineup, Strasburg being called up for the Nationals, etc. Rookies playing everyday happens all the time in all the major sports. Specifically regarding Colvin, I'll take what Stone said. "you realize that he very well could be the one thing the Cubs have been looking for for six years. That's a left-handed run producer. Colvin could be that one guy. But he can't do it on the bench, so you make a decision that you play the guy." That's right. He can't do that sitting on the bench.

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                        • Originally posted by Ubiquitous View Post
                          Kiki Cuyler
                          Brooks Robinson
                          Harmon Killebrew
                          Lou Gehrig
                          Charlie Gehringer
                          Joe Cronin
                          Carlton Fisk
                          Tony Perez
                          Billy Williams
                          etc, etc, etc
                          I can list all the NL and AL ROY's, too, as an opposite reaction to your strawman. The issue is no one gets better by sitting on the bench, not name players who came to big league teams who already had a good veteran presence at the position. Waiting your turn is not equal to getting better by sitting on the bench. And I'm sure you know this, but Carlton Fisk and Billy Williams are ROY award winners. I never knew this about Piniella, but he won it as a member of the KC Royals. I always thought of him as a Yankee.
                          Last edited by The Uncoach; 06-14-2010, 12:43 PM.

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                          • the issue was never about playing time the issue was abot throwing colvin in at first base without any prep work or thought out plan.

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                            • The issue is about putting a good stick in the lineup, but if you want to address the issue of prep work for 1B, where do you think he played before college? Colvin throws Left. Once a player gets to High School there are only 3 places a LH is going to play. Pitcher (which he was), 1B (which he was) and OF ("Junior outfielder and first baseman who has a "sweet" swing...has added strength since his freshman and sophomore seasons...never played outfield until arriving at Clemson"). Even the slightest bit of research shows Clemson listing him as an OF/1B. How much of a plan does it require for him to play 1B, since he's done it a significant portion of his baseball life? Do you think he has enough prep work from playing that postion for many years that he can make a bad throw to 3rd Base to end a game just like the current backup 1B, too? Maybe the Cubs should just stay with the status quo, because what they are doing right now is simply brilliant and working out very well.
                              Last edited by The Uncoach; 06-15-2010, 12:38 PM. Reason: grammar

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                              • So because Tyler Colvin played 2 games at first base in 2005 and 3 games in 2004 you think the Cubs can simply pencil him in on their major league team as a first basemen without any prepwork whatsoever?

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