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2019-2020 Mets Offseason Thread

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  • Originally posted by brooklynboy View Post

    Mongoose, this one is a good call.. Teams are run by Analytics, which are passed to GM's, who basically make the decisions. Today's manager works with Analytics and the front office to better use those analytics in a game situation. LaRussa started this a couple of decades ago.

    We have the Bug calling the dugout.. 'Nuff Said .
    Not trying to stick up for the evil Wilpon's but I find it funny that Reyes said this in 2018, probably after he found out the team has no plans for him in 2019. Who thinks if he signs a contract to be a utility man in 19 that statement is made?

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    • This is probably a bad time to make this statement but I would take back Alderson and Collins in a minute right now.

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      • This actually worked out perfectly for the Wilpons because everyone is talking about replacing Beltran and no one is talking about the fact that this team still has no pitch framing catcher, center fielder, or back bullpen help.

        Maybe they are really evil geniuses who hired Beltran knowing they'd be firing him all the while dominating NY news and not having to do anything to actually improve the team. Brilliant!

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        • Originally posted by rjsallstars View Post
          This is probably a bad time to make this statement but I would take back Alderson and Collins in a minute right now.
          So would I.

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          • Originally posted by rjsallstars View Post
            This is probably a bad time to make this statement but I would take back Alderson and Collins in a minute right now.
            Sad. That was the post-Madoff period, where Fred was determined to bleed the Mets for all the lost, stolen money he'd thought was his. Alderson was his accomplice, handled the press and dissembled to the fans. Collins was a stooge simply happy to have a job.

            Fred has conditioned the fan base into such low expectations that, instead of longing for Cashen/Johnson, or equal capability, they're nostalgic for a GM/manager who had no mandate to win.

            Aim higher people!


            "The Fightin' Met With Two Heads" - Mike Tyson/Ray Knight!

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Mongoose View Post

              Sad. That was the post-Madoff period, where Fred was determined to bleed the Mets for all the lost, stolen money he'd thought was his. Alderson was his accomplice, handled the press and dissembled to the fans. Collins was a stooge simply happy to have a job.

              Fred has conditioned the fan base into such low expectations that, instead of longing for Cashen/Johnson, or equal capability, they're nostalgic for a GM/manager who had no mandate to win.

              Aim higher people!
              Alderson was responsible for Nimmo, Alonso and McNeil. Are those guys garbage to you? What about getting Syndergaard as a throw in extra for R.A Dickey?

              You are also pretty high on Guillorme and D. Smith. 2 Alderson guys.
              Last edited by jjpm74; 01-19-2020, 04:46 PM.

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              • Originally posted by jjpm74 View Post

                Alderson was responsible for Nimmo, Alonso and McNeil. Are those guys garbage to you? What about getting Syndergaard as a throw in extra for R.A Dickey?

                You are also pretty high on Guillorme and D. Smith. 2 Alderson guys.
                Conforto and Rosario as well. Harvey too, who pitched in the WS.
                It takes a Looong time for the moves of a GM to be evident and measurable.

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                • Originally posted by Mongoose View Post

                  Sad. That was the post-Madoff period, where Fred was determined to bleed the Mets for all the lost, stolen money he'd thought was his. Alderson was his accomplice, handled the press and dissembled to the fans. Collins was a stooge simply happy to have a job.

                  Fred has conditioned the fan base into such low expectations that, instead of longing for Cashen/Johnson, or equal capability, they're nostalgic for a GM/manager who had no mandate to win.

                  Aim higher people!

                  If you weren’t conditioned you would have said Michaels/Torre. Give credit where credit is due. The Alderson/Collins teams were supposed to be laughing stocks according to a lot of local know it alls and they never quit and made it to a World Series. Again, nothing spectacular but they both earned their salaries.



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                  • Originally posted by jjpm74 View Post

                    Alderson was responsible for Nimmo, Alonso and McNeil. Are those guys garbage to you? What about getting Syndergaard as a throw in extra for R.A Dickey?

                    You are also pretty high on Guillorme and D. Smith. 2 Alderson guys.
                    I've already gone on record praising the Maverick regime for that. Unfortunately, he's also the guy who inherited Murphy and Turner, and before cutting them for no return, brought in Brad Emaus to replace them.

                    The ML transactions were horrific. It's Sunday night. I'm relaxing. I don't want to think about them, much less list them.

                    It's a big world. Surely you can hope for better than Alderson and Collins.

                    Originally posted by rjsallstars View Post


                    If you weren’t conditioned you would have said Michaels/Torre. Give credit where credit is due. The Alderson/Collins teams were supposed to be laughing stocks according to a lot of local know it alls and they never quit and made it to a World Series. Again, nothing spectacular but they both earned their salaries.

                    I thought about it. Holding up Torre as an example of a desirable manager doesn't work in Queens.

                    Cashen/Johnson happened in the small market of Flushing. They were proof positive the Mets can be first rate all the way.
                    Last edited by Mongoose; 01-19-2020, 07:36 PM.


                    "The Fightin' Met With Two Heads" - Mike Tyson/Ray Knight!

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Mongoose View Post

                      I've already gone on record praising the Maverick regime for that. Unfortunately, he's also the guy who inherited Murphy and Turner, and before cutting them for no return, brought in Brad Emaus to replace them.
                      You and everyone else here knows Turner had to go. I am glad he found his niche on another team. As for Murphy, extending him a QO that he rejected in favor of a contract that wasn't much more than the QO over 3 seasons says a lot about how much faith Murphy had in himself. That is not cutting!
                      Last edited by jjpm74; 01-19-2020, 08:09 PM.

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                      • Before more of the Murphy crap emerges, here are his WAA numbers from 2008-2019:

                        0.9
                        -0.1
                        1.5
                        -0.3
                        -0.3
                        0.2
                        -0.4
                        2.7
                        0.9
                        -2.0
                        -1.3

                        Not exactly a world beater there. 2011 and 2016 were the only times in his career where his skill set rose to a level where that he could be considered an all star. Most or the rest of the time, he was at or below league average and only slightly above replacement level. The past two seasons, he has been below average and well below replacement level. Murphy has his warts and his flaws and let's be real here. If he was never a Met, he wouldn't even be a topic of conversation as a possible fit for this team since there have been lots of other MLB players who have overlapped his career who were as good or better. The last two seasons, even his hitting has been below league average.
                        Last edited by jjpm74; 01-19-2020, 08:21 PM.

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                        • Originally posted by Mongoose View Post

                          I thought about it. Holding up Torre as an example of a desirable manager doesn't work in Queens.

                          Cashen/Johnson happened in the small market of Flushing. They were proof positive the Mets can be first rate all the way.
                          Good point, since the Mets absolutely sucked during the 5 years Torre managed the team.

                          Originally posted by Mongoose View Post
                          It's a big world. Surely you can hope for better than Alderson and Collins.
                          Over BVW and some random yes man? It is not about hoping for better than. It is hoping ownership changes sooner rather than later and the new ownership starts by getting rid of the absolute disaster that is BVW as the GM and whatever random guy gets roped into the title manager.
                          Last edited by jjpm74; 01-19-2020, 08:19 PM.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by jjpm74 View Post
                            Before more of the Murphy crap emerges, here are his WAA numbers from 2008-2019:

                            0.9
                            -0.1
                            1.5
                            -0.3
                            -0.3
                            0.2
                            -0.4
                            2.7
                            0.9
                            -2.0
                            -1.3

                            Not exactly a world beater there. 2011 and 2016 were the the only times in his career where his skill set rose to a level that he could be considered an all star. Most or the rest of the time, he was at or below league average and only slightly above replacement level. The past two seasons, he has been well below replacement level. Murphy had his warts and his flaws and let's be real here. If he wasn't a Met, he wouldn't even be a topic of conversation since there have been lots of other MLB players who have overlapped his career who were as good or better. The last two seasons, even his hitting has been below league average.
                            1) I predicted Murphy would hit .310-330 with 20+ HR and 40+ doubles in 2016. I posted it. It's what his batted ball numbers suggested. He'd also be out of Coupon Field, which depressed his numbers. It happened.

                            2) I was the only one here who criticized the non-tender of Turner. Why? Because he played 6 positions decently, hit .280 the year before, and had doubles pop. I didn't know he'd become a top 20 player over the past 5 years, but I understood you don't cut him and replace him with Omar Quintanilla. I posted about my dismay.

                            I'm no Monday morning quarterback. If I could see these were bad moves, the celebrated Baseball Maverick should have.

                            What you're doing is posting justifications for past wrong decisions and pretending the wrong decisions were good. It's like somebody posting the Maginot line was clever, or motorcars would never be commercially viable.

                            The verdict is in. The decisions were disasters. What's done is done. There's nothing served by further analysis. Let it go.



                            "The Fightin' Met With Two Heads" - Mike Tyson/Ray Knight!

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                            • No matter what happens in the Super Bowl, it would be nice to see a pitcher from the 20th anniversary pennant winning team, oh I don't know, say Mahomes, throw out the first pitch to a Super Bowl QB like, maybe, Mahomes.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by LI METS FAN View Post
                                No matter what happens in the Super Bowl, it would be nice to see a pitcher from the 20th anniversary pennant winning team, oh I don't know, say Mahomes, throw out the first pitch to a Super Bowl QB like, maybe, Mahomes.
                                Only baseball has "pitches".

                                Pat Mahomes had all the guts in the world. He was an unsung hero of the 1999 team, which I liked better than the 2000 team. I think we're seeing his grit in his son, who has much more ability. It's a formidable combination. I saw Patrick Mahomes wearing a Mets jersey at a press conference. The Mets were his fathers most cherished baseball experience. If anything, I'd suspect Patrick Mahomes is a Mets fan.


                                "The Fightin' Met With Two Heads" - Mike Tyson/Ray Knight!

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