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  • Originally posted by Mongoose View Post


    Seems like she did a quick perusal of stuff other people wrote, and assembled it into an article she was assigned to write. The incident from Pedro's biography was famous. It was JEFF Wilpon who forced Pedro to pitch. This isn't a small slip-up. Jeff's injury management has been a much-discussed problem on this team for a decade and a half. If she doesn't know this, I don't trust her on anything.

    Regarding debt, she apparently sources her info from the link she provides to a 5 year old Amazin' Avenue blog post, which in turn sources their info to Capital NY (a dead link). Field of Schemes published a spread sheet years ago, which documented how almost all Fred's stadium loan payments were reimbursed by either the public, Citicorp, or deductions from MLB revenue sharing. She suggests this is an out-of-pocket expense for poor Fred.

    But there's not enough in the article or source to suggest any methodology for how her numbers were arrived at, so we'll have to use common sense. Total debt was reported, years ago, at $700M. How can Fred be paying $100M a year to service it, without putting a dent in the principal?
    Fair enough. Look, the Daily News dumped most of their credible sportswriters so here we are; at least it wasn't an AP article.

    To be clear, I'll as be glad as anyone to rid ourselves of this steaming pile of crap running the team, something none of us had any realistic expectation of seeing within our lifetime. Maybe the Dolans can be next?

    I would just rather have read glowing praise about the new owner being a man of high principles and integrity, instead of reading about insider trading and a billion dollar fine.

    Sigh. If he gives us a winner, all's well in the world, I guess.
    Last edited by Mister B.; 12-06-2019, 02:52 PM.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Mister B. View Post

      Fair enough. Look, the Daily News dumped most of their credible sportswriters so here we are; at least it wasn't an AP article.

      To be clear, I'll as be glad as anyone to rid ourselves of this steaming pile of crap running the team, something none of us had any realistic expectation of seeing within our lifetime. Maybe the Dolans can be next?

      I would just rather have read glowing praise about the new owner being a man of high principles and integrity, instead of reading about insider trading and a billion dollar fine.

      Sigh. If he gives us a winner, all's well in the world, I guess.
      Mister B I believe if we dig deep enough on anyone with that kind of bank roll we will find something that lacks principle and integrity. It makes you think it is not possible to achieve that level of wealth without doing such. I am sure we have the unicorns but...…..

      I agree it would have been much "nicer" if Cohen didn't have the marks on his record, but as Mongoose has put on here many times the Wilpons were fairly underhanded themselves. The Wilpons don't care a lick about the Mets winning and losing.

      Point is if we are going to have someone own the team with priors let them at least care about putting a winner on the field.

      Of course the jury is out on Cohen we have no clue what he is going to be -- we think we know, but the rubber hasn't hit the road yet.

      Either way getting rid of the these two creates a whole new mindset about the Met future. It has for me anyway.

      Comment


      • The Wilpon Family Chronicles
        https://www.nytimes.com/2019/12/06/s...ale-cohen.html

        A few gems here:

        Fred Wilpon liked to watch pitchers throw their bullpen sessions, and sometimes interacted during the process. “Fred knows just enough to be dangerous,” one former pitching coach said. If a player on the major league roster got injured, Jeff would weigh in on which minor-league affiliate would host the player’s rehabilitation assignment. Jeff liked to be informed about all roster moves, even those in the low minor leagues.
        In an era when front-office employees in the majors are screened extensively for their skills with math and advanced statistics, Fred Wilpon, a friend of Chris Christie, the former New Jersey governor, once asked that Christie’s son, Andrew, be hired as an intern. Andrew, a former Princeton University baseball player, now works in the team’s scouting department.
        Former executives said the team changed philosophies from year to year, and sometimes from month to month.

        “We were never given a clear number for the payroll,” one official said. Recalling how Fred Wilpon handled matters, the official said, “In January, he would say, ‘O.K., you’ve got more money to spend.’ Well, we wished we had known that in November when it counts.”
        The Mets have the best, smartest fans in baseball.

        Comment


        • That whole article is worth posting: The Wilpon Family Chronicles


          December 7, 2019

          The Wilpon family, a wealthy and well-connected New York clan, should have been everything sports fans would want in the owner of a team. They were local, passionate about their game and desperately wanted to win.


          It didn’t work out that way.


          The legacy of this New York real estate family’s stewardship of its beloved team, the New York Mets, ended up reflecting many aspects of the family itself. There were periods of success, but also dysfunction, intense rivalries among relatives and a financial crisis that, for a time, threatened much of what the family had built.


          At their best, the Wilpons, self-made multimillionaires from the city’s outer boroughs, shined as generous philanthropists who occasionally broke the bank for a star player. At their worst, they were a squabbling, disorganized clan with a baseball team that fans saw as inept and thrifty, and functioning as a vanity play for the family scion, Fred Wilpon, and his eldest son, Jeff, who has overseen a team with mostly disappointing results since 2002.


          After Wednesday, when the Wilpons announced they were negotiating to sell controlling interest in the Mets to the hedge fund billionaire Steve Cohen, a minority investor, in a deal that valued the team at more than $2.5 billion, a narrative that had been roiling the family in recent months emerged into public view.


          With Fred Wilpon, 83, and his siblings aging, their children were increasingly wary of having Jeff Wilpon, their aggressive, short-tempered relative, in charge of the family’s most valuable heirloom. That issue will go away with a deal to sell Cohen 80 percent of the franchise that will give the family a huge profit, considering what the Wilpons paid each time they increased their stake in the Mets.



          Tensions between Jeff Wilpon and his relatives have been brewing for years. Many of them work with Sterling Equities, the family’s closely held umbrella company, but the baseball team, which last won a World Series in 1986 — before the family took full control — was largely Jeff’s domain.


          For years, some family members have questioned his choices behind the scenes.


          In 2003, for example, Jeff and his father called on Jeff’s younger brother, Bruce, who is fluent in Japanese, to help pursue the free-agent infielder Kazuo Matsui.


          Soon after Matsui joined the Mets in 2004 and reported to spring training, he injured his finger. Jeff Wilpon was adamant that Matsui play in televised spring training games to build excitement for the season after a last-place finish a year earlier. Bruce was more protective of Matsui and urged caution.


          The disagreement came to a head when Jeff, seeing a promotional opportunity, wanted Matsui on the field. Bruce pushed back. The argument grew heated and ugly, as Jeff dug in. After that, Bruce rarely, if ever, was involved with the team again.


          Such accounts of the family and its decision to sell are based on interviews with more than a dozen people with direct involvement with the Wilpon family and the Mets, nearly all of whom asked not to be identified so as not to damage their relationship with the family. Through a spokesman, Fred and Jeff Wilpon declined to comment.


          From real estate to baseball


          Before they ventured into baseball, the Wilpons were a blip on the New York real estate scene. Fred Wilpon still rode the train from his home on Long Island to his office in Manhattan. He and his family owned and managed a collection of properties but as empires went, their portfolio was tiny compared with those of New York’s more renowned families — the Lauders, the Tisches, the Newhouses.


          Then, in 1980, Wilpon acquired a 1 percent stake in the Mets when Doubleday, the publishing company, bought the team. Six years later, against the wishes of his partner Nelson Doubleday, he exercised a clause in his contract to wrest control of 50 percent of the team. Practically overnight, Wilpon became a major New York figure. His phone started to ring more often with business proposals. There were invitations to serve on the boards of prestigious charities. And his baseball team began to occupy more of his time and interest.


          During the years he controlled the team, Nelson Doubleday had insisted that neither his children nor Wilpon’s have a role within the team. Insiders at the time said it was well known that the purpose of the rule to was exclude Jeff Wilpon, who had played baseball at Palm Beach State College and was even drafted twice by major league organizations.


          “Doubleday was very hard on Jeff,” one executive said.


          But when Fred Wilpon and his relatives bought the remaining 50 percent of the Mets from Doubleday 2002, for about $135 million, he also cleared the way for Jeff to take a more active role in team affairs. Jeff quickly emerged as a dominant figure. Jeff’s siblings, who attended Brown University, never had much interest in sports. For Jeff, though, running the team was a dream job.


          And few would have complained about the Wilpons’ hands-on management style had the team been successful. But since the Wilpons assumed full control of the team nearly two decades ago, the Mets have made the playoffs only three times. They have not won the World Series since 1986, despite the financial advantages of playing in the country’s largest market. During that same period, the Yankees have been to the postseason 14 times and won the 2009 World Series, their fifth championship in 13 years.


          Both Jeff and his father, who played high school baseball and basketball with Sandy Koufax, the Hall of Fame pitcher, fashioned themselves as baseball experts. Their involvement in the operations of the team often had few limits.


          Fred Wilpon liked to watch pitchers throw their bullpen sessions, and sometimes interacted during the process. “Fred knows just enough to be dangerous,” one former pitching coach said. If a player on the major league roster got injured, Fred and Jeff would weigh in on which minor-league affiliate would host the player’s rehabilitation assignment. Jeff liked to be informed about all roster moves, even those in the low minor leagues.


          Fred also liked to talk to his manager in his office before games. He once suggested to Terry Collins, who managed the Mets from 2011 to 2017, and his pitching coach Dan Warthen, that they call pitches from the dugout. Gracious and collegial in public, he sometimes yelled in baseball meetings, and would ask derisively about a struggling player, “Who scouted him?”


          In an era when front-office employees in the majors are screened extensively for their skills with math and advanced statistics, Fred Wilpon, a friend of Chris Christie, the former New Jersey governor, once asked that Christie’s son, Andrew, be hired as an intern. Andrew, a former Princeton University baseball player, is now the Mets’ assistant director of amateur and international scouting.


          A micromanaged team


          In conversation, Jeff Wilpon often drops the names of former baseball greats with whom he speaks and plays golf. He regularly cozied up to star players in the clubhouse, and occasionally spoke to players or coaches about their performance in the tunnel connecting the team’s dugout and the locker room.


          There were other puzzling incidents. One star player recalled how Jeff flipped a new baseball glove toward him one day and instructed him to break it in. (The player ignored the command.) And in July, the Mets traded the pitcher Jason Vargas to the Philadelphia Phillies for cash and a light-hitting minor league catcher with little value named Austin Bossart. Bossart, some in the organization noticed, had played baseball with Jeff Wilpon’s son on the University of Pennsylvania baseball team.


          Former executives said the team changed philosophies from year to year, and sometimes from month to month.


          “We were never given a clear number for the payroll,” one official said. Recalling how Fred Wilpon handled matters, the official said, “In January, he would say, ‘O.K., you’ve got more money to spend.’ Well, we wished we had known that in November when it counts.”


          There were occasional successes. One of Jeff’s initial duties was to oversee construction of the Brooklyn Cyclones’ stadium in Coney Island, and then the much larger project to build Citi Field. The stadium is now considered first-rate, but it hit some early bumps. When it opened, Mets fans complained that the stadium celebrated the team Fred Wilpon had worshiped as a child, the Brooklyn Dodgers, more than the Mets. The fences were initially so far from home plate that Mets batters, who played there most often, struggled and free agents cited it as a reason to stay away from the club. Eventually, the Wilpons added a Mets Hall of Fame and moved the fences in.


          In 2014, Jeff Wilpon was accused of gender discrimination by a former director of ticket sales who said he had chided her for being pregnant while single. There were several witnesses to the incidents, and the Mets ultimately agreed to a financial settlement in March 2015 that resolved the complaint.


          And yet, even as the Mets and the Wilpons fumbled along, fans tended to embrace the team’s identity as the idiosyncratic but more approachable member of New York’s baseball universe. Then, in December 2008, everything changed.


          With the country tumbling through its worst economic crisis since the Great Depression, the world was introduced to Bernard L. Madoff, a New York investor who was revealed to have been running one of the largest Ponzi schemes in American history. Madoff’s investors included dozens of boldfaced names and institutions, many of whom were ruined by his fraud. The investors also included the Wilpon family.


          Wilpon and his brother in law, Saul Katz, had over 500 accounts with Madoff, according to one analysis. They were sued for $1 billion by the trustee for the victims who claimed they knew, or should have known, that Madoff’s returns were fraudulent.


          The collapse of Madoff’s fund changed everything for Wilpon and Katz, depriving them of an automatic source of income that had helped plug the financial holes of their often struggling baseball team. Hundreds of millions of dollars — even some deferred payments owed to Mets players — had been invested with Madoff and his magical guaranteed 15 percent, or better, return.


          As the Madoff scandal unfolded, and the broader Wilpon family empire was forced to pay a multimillion-dollar settlement by the trustee unwinding the fraud, the Wilpons struggled to maintain control of the Mets. The family resorted to taking out at least $65 million in loans just to meet payroll and other obligations, including $25 million from their fellow owners in Major League Baseball. After years of costly litigation, the Wilpons agreed to pay $61 million to the trustee.


          Since the Madoff crisis, and as Fred Wilpon and his siblings and relatives approached their 80th birthdays, the decision for the family to relinquish control of the Mets seemed almost inevitable. Since 2011, the Wilpons have been seeking investors to help carry its financial burdens.
          When the Wilpons first invested in the Mets, baseball was a mostly harmless dalliance for wealthy businessmen. Now it is an $10 billion-a-year business, with huge risks. People familiar with the team’s finances said the Mets have lost more than $60 million during each of the past two seasons, as the team struggled to attract fans, and they are at the limit of debt allowed by Major League Baseball rules.


          In 2012, with the economy rebounding, the Mets sold 12 minority shares in the team, including one to Cohen, raising $240 million. That enabled them to pay back loans that were overdue.


          Their two-thirds ownership of Sportsnet New York, the regional sports network, has helped cover financial shortfalls related to the team, which is now carrying hundreds of millions of dollars in debt, exacerbating tension between Jeff Wilpon and his relatives. In recent months, selling the franchise became the most equitable way to divide up the asset among the Wilpon family members.


          When the deal with Cohen closes, however, the Wilpon family will be reduced to minority investors in the team. According to the deal, Fred and Jeff Wilpon will maintain what figure to be largely ceremonial roles during a transition period. And then the Wilpon clan will once more be just another New York real-estate family with a closely held company that, like all real-estate families, wins some and loses some.




          The losses by the Mets entity, which has perhaps the worst local TV deal in MLB, were more than made up for by revenue from SNY. The Wilpons could have kept running the team indefinitely. Looks like an insurrection by the rest of the Wilpon and Katz families against Jeff.

          Another thing worth noting: There was an article in the post about Willets point. Although Fred was obligated to build a school and 1100 units of housing, the mall was looking less and less likely. I wouldn't be surprised if that was another reason Fred was selling. I always suspected the theft of Willets Point was a main reason he hijacked the team from Doubleday.

          By the way, according to the article, $280M of public money has already been wasted on the project. I wonder if Fred gets to keep the $500M in land he was gifted?
          Last edited by Mongoose; 12-07-2019, 01:41 PM.


          "The Fightin' Met With Two Heads" - Mike Tyson/Ray Knight!

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Mongoose View Post
            That whole article is worth posting: The Wilpon Family Chronicles


            December 7, 2019

            The Wilpon family, a wealthy and well-connected New York clan, should have been everything sports fans would want in the owner of a team. They were local, passionate about their game and desperately wanted to win.


            It didn’t work out that way.


            The legacy of this New York real estate family’s stewardship of its beloved team, the New York Mets, ended up reflecting many aspects of the family itself. There were periods of success, but also dysfunction, intense rivalries among relatives and a financial crisis that, for a time, threatened much of what the family had built.


            At their best, the Wilpons, self-made multimillionaires from the city’s outer boroughs, shined as generous philanthropists who occasionally broke the bank for a star player. At their worst, they were a squabbling, disorganized clan with a baseball team that fans saw as inept and thrifty, and functioning as a vanity play for the family scion, Fred Wilpon, and his eldest son, Jeff, who has overseen a team with mostly disappointing results since 2002.


            After Wednesday, when the Wilpons announced they were negotiating to sell controlling interest in the Mets to the hedge fund billionaire Steve Cohen, a minority investor, in a deal that valued the team at more than $2.5 billion, a narrative that had been roiling the family in recent months emerged into public view.


            With Fred Wilpon, 83, and his siblings aging, their children were increasingly wary of having Jeff Wilpon, their aggressive, short-tempered relative, in charge of the family’s most valuable heirloom. That issue will go away with a deal to sell Cohen 80 percent of the franchise that will give the family a huge profit, considering what the Wilpons paid each time they increased their stake in the Mets.



            Tensions between Jeff Wilpon and his relatives have been brewing for years. Many of them work with Sterling Equities, the family’s closely held umbrella company, but the baseball team, which last won a World Series in 1986 — before the family took full control — was largely Jeff’s domain.


            For years, some family members have questioned his choices behind the scenes.


            In 2003, for example, Jeff and his father called on Jeff’s younger brother, Bruce, who is fluent in Japanese, to help pursue the free-agent infielder Kazuo Matsui.


            Soon after Matsui joined the Mets in 2004 and reported to spring training, he injured his finger. Jeff Wilpon was adamant that Matsui play in televised spring training games to build excitement for the season after a last-place finish a year earlier. Bruce was more protective of Matsui and urged caution.


            The disagreement came to a head when Jeff, seeing a promotional opportunity, wanted Matsui on the field. Bruce pushed back. The argument grew heated and ugly, as Jeff dug in. After that, Bruce rarely, if ever, was involved with the team again.


            Such accounts of the family and its decision to sell are based on interviews with more than a dozen people with direct involvement with the Wilpon family and the Mets, nearly all of whom asked not to be identified so as not to damage their relationship with the family. Through a spokesman, Fred and Jeff Wilpon declined to comment.


            From real estate to baseball


            Before they ventured into baseball, the Wilpons were a blip on the New York real estate scene. Fred Wilpon still rode the train from his home on Long Island to his office in Manhattan. He and his family owned and managed a collection of properties but as empires went, their portfolio was tiny compared with those of New York’s more renowned families — the Lauders, the Tisches, the Newhouses.


            Then, in 1980, Wilpon acquired a 1 percent stake in the Mets when Doubleday, the publishing company, bought the team. Six years later, against the wishes of his partner Nelson Doubleday, he exercised a clause in his contract to wrest control of 50 percent of the team. Practically overnight, Wilpon became a major New York figure. His phone started to ring more often with business proposals. There were invitations to serve on the boards of prestigious charities. And his baseball team began to occupy more of his time and interest.


            During the years he controlled the team, Nelson Doubleday had insisted that neither his children nor Wilpon’s have a role within the team. Insiders at the time said it was well known that the purpose of the rule to was exclude Jeff Wilpon, who had played baseball at Palm Beach State College and was even drafted twice by major league organizations.


            “Doubleday was very hard on Jeff,” one executive said.


            But when Fred Wilpon and his relatives bought the remaining 50 percent of the Mets from Doubleday 2002, for about $135 million, he also cleared the way for Jeff to take a more active role in team affairs. Jeff quickly emerged as a dominant figure. Jeff’s siblings, who attended Brown University, never had much interest in sports. For Jeff, though, running the team was a dream job.


            And few would have complained about the Wilpons’ hands-on management style had the team been successful. But since the Wilpons assumed full control of the team nearly two decades ago, the Mets have made the playoffs only three times. They have not won the World Series since 1986, despite the financial advantages of playing in the country’s largest market. During that same period, the Yankees have been to the postseason 14 times and won the 2009 World Series, their fifth championship in 13 years.


            Both Jeff and his father, who played high school baseball and basketball with Sandy Koufax, the Hall of Fame pitcher, fashioned themselves as baseball experts. Their involvement in the operations of the team often had few limits.


            Fred Wilpon liked to watch pitchers throw their bullpen sessions, and sometimes interacted during the process. “Fred knows just enough to be dangerous,” one former pitching coach said. If a player on the major league roster got injured, Fred and Jeff would weigh in on which minor-league affiliate would host the player’s rehabilitation assignment. Jeff liked to be informed about all roster moves, even those in the low minor leagues.


            Fred also liked to talk to his manager in his office before games. He once suggested to Terry Collins, who managed the Mets from 2011 to 2017, and his pitching coach Dan Warthen, that they call pitches from the dugout. Gracious and collegial in public, he sometimes yelled in baseball meetings, and would ask derisively about a struggling player, “Who scouted him?”


            In an era when front-office employees in the majors are screened extensively for their skills with math and advanced statistics, Fred Wilpon, a friend of Chris Christie, the former New Jersey governor, once asked that Christie’s son, Andrew, be hired as an intern. Andrew, a former Princeton University baseball player, is now the Mets’ assistant director of amateur and international scouting.


            A micromanaged team


            In conversation, Jeff Wilpon often drops the names of former baseball greats with whom he speaks and plays golf. He regularly cozied up to star players in the clubhouse, and occasionally spoke to players or coaches about their performance in the tunnel connecting the team’s dugout and the locker room.


            There were other puzzling incidents. One star player recalled how Jeff flipped a new baseball glove toward him one day and instructed him to break it in. (The player ignored the command.) And in July, the Mets traded the pitcher Jason Vargas to the Philadelphia Phillies for cash and a light-hitting minor league catcher with little value named Austin Bossart. Bossart, some in the organization noticed, had played baseball with Jeff Wilpon’s son on the University of Pennsylvania baseball team.


            Former executives said the team changed philosophies from year to year, and sometimes from month to month.


            “We were never given a clear number for the payroll,” one official said. Recalling how Fred Wilpon handled matters, the official said, “In January, he would say, ‘O.K., you’ve got more money to spend.’ Well, we wished we had known that in November when it counts.”


            There were occasional successes. One of Jeff’s initial duties was to oversee construction of the Brooklyn Cyclones’ stadium in Coney Island, and then the much larger project to build Citi Field. The stadium is now considered first-rate, but it hit some early bumps. When it opened, Mets fans complained that the stadium celebrated the team Fred Wilpon had worshiped as a child, the Brooklyn Dodgers, more than the Mets. The fences were initially so far from home plate that Mets batters, who played there most often, struggled and free agents cited it as a reason to stay away from the club. Eventually, the Wilpons added a Mets Hall of Fame and moved the fences in.


            In 2014, Jeff Wilpon was accused of gender discrimination by a former director of ticket sales who said he had chided her for being pregnant while single. There were several witnesses to the incidents, and the Mets ultimately agreed to a financial settlement in March 2015 that resolved the complaint.


            And yet, even as the Mets and the Wilpons fumbled along, fans tended to embrace the team’s identity as the idiosyncratic but more approachable member of New York’s baseball universe. Then, in December 2008, everything changed.


            With the country tumbling through its worst economic crisis since the Great Depression, the world was introduced to Bernard L. Madoff, a New York investor who was revealed to have been running one of the largest Ponzi schemes in American history. Madoff’s investors included dozens of boldfaced names and institutions, many of whom were ruined by his fraud. The investors also included the Wilpon family.


            Wilpon and his brother in law, Saul Katz, had over 500 accounts with Madoff, according to one analysis. They were sued for $1 billion by the trustee for the victims who claimed they knew, or should have known, that Madoff’s returns were fraudulent.


            The collapse of Madoff’s fund changed everything for Wilpon and Katz, depriving them of an automatic source of income that had helped plug the financial holes of their often struggling baseball team. Hundreds of millions of dollars — even some deferred payments owed to Mets players — had been invested with Madoff and his magical guaranteed 15 percent, or better, return.


            As the Madoff scandal unfolded, and the broader Wilpon family empire was forced to pay a multimillion-dollar settlement by the trustee unwinding the fraud, the Wilpons struggled to maintain control of the Mets. The family resorted to taking out at least $65 million in loans just to meet payroll and other obligations, including $25 million from their fellow owners in Major League Baseball. After years of costly litigation, the Wilpons agreed to pay $61 million to the trustee.


            Since the Madoff crisis, and as Fred Wilpon and his siblings and relatives approached their 80th birthdays, the decision for the family to relinquish control of the Mets seemed almost inevitable. Since 2011, the Wilpons have been seeking investors to help carry its financial burdens.
            When the Wilpons first invested in the Mets, baseball was a mostly harmless dalliance for wealthy businessmen. Now it is an $10 billion-a-year business, with huge risks. People familiar with the team’s finances said the Mets have lost more than $60 million during each of the past two seasons, as the team struggled to attract fans, and they are at the limit of debt allowed by Major League Baseball rules.


            In 2012, with the economy rebounding, the Mets sold 12 minority shares in the team, including one to Cohen, raising $240 million. That enabled them to pay back loans that were overdue.


            Their two-thirds ownership of Sportsnet New York, the regional sports network, has helped cover financial shortfalls related to the team, which is now carrying hundreds of millions of dollars in debt, exacerbating tension between Jeff Wilpon and his relatives. In recent months, selling the franchise became the most equitable way to divide up the asset among the Wilpon family members.


            When the deal with Cohen closes, however, the Wilpon family will be reduced to minority investors in the team. According to the deal, Fred and Jeff Wilpon will maintain what figure to be largely ceremonial roles during a transition period. And then the Wilpon clan will once more be just another New York real-estate family with a closely held company that, like all real-estate families, wins some and loses some.




            The losses by the Mets entity, which has perhaps the worst local TV deal in MLB, were more than made up for by revenue from SNY. The Wilpons could have kept running the team indefinitely. Looks like an insurrection by the rest of the Wilpon and Katz families against Jeff.

            Another thing worth noting: There was an article in the post about Willets point. Although Fred was obligated to build a school and 1100 units of housing, the mall was looking less and less likely. I wouldn't be surprised if that was another reason Fred was selling. I always suspected the theft of Willets Point was a main reason he hijacked the team from Doubleday.

            By the way, according to the article, $280M of public money has already been wasted on the project. I wonder if Fred gets to keep the $500M in land he was gifted?
            Thanks for the article. I appreciate it.

            Truly amazing what kind of low lifes these criminals are.


            Can you imagine that we had posters on this forum over the last 12 years since I have been posting that actually defended these two creeps?

            A couple of things that really stuck out to me:

            1) Jeff flipping a glove to a STAR player instructing him to break it in. WTF? There truly is something wrong with that guy. The player should have decked him. ****** If I had to bet my money without knowing -- I put my money on that star player being Beltran. I don't think he was ever in good favor with Jeff. I doubt it was Wright because Wright who likes to thank Jeff at every turn would have just broken the glove in to Jeff's liking.********
            2) Jeff trading Vargas (who was pitching really well at that time) for a minor leaguer his son went to school with. Jeff runs/ran this team like the good ole boys club. Winning was way on the backburner.

            Is there any wonder why this team has sucked for the most part over 3 decades?

            Thankfully Jeff is just enough of a POS that his own family wants no part of him. This seemingly is the driving force to the Wilpons selling instead of keeping the team until their day touring all 9 Rings of Hell like they own the joint.

            So ----- Jeff......thank you for being a horrible human being with a disgusting evil soul. I guess.
            Last edited by Paulypal; 12-07-2019, 03:01 PM.

            Comment


            • Double post

              Comment


              • I saw in The Athletic about Steve Cohen negotiating to buy the team. Is this still in the discussion stage? Have they reached an agreement yet? I can only imagine how much you guys must be on pins-and-needles hoping for this to go through. Good riddance to bad rubbish. The sooner, the better.
                "It is a simple matter to erect a Hall of Fame, but difficult to select the tenants." -- Ken Smith
                "I am led to suspect that some of the electorate is very dumb." -- Henry P. Edwards
                "You have a Hall of Fame to put people in, not keep people out." -- Brian Kenny
                "There's no such thing as a perfect ballot." -- Jay Jaffe

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Paulypal View Post
                  Is there any wonder why this team has sucked for the most part over 3 decades?

                  Thankfully Jeff is just enough of a POS that his own family wants no part of him. This seemingly is the driving force to the Wilpons selling instead of keeping the team until their day touring all 9 Rings of Hell like they own the joint.
                  And all this publicly reported stuff is just the tip of the iceberg. There has to be weirder and worse things behind the scenes.
                  The Mets have the best, smartest fans in baseball.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Chadwick View Post
                    I saw in The Athletic about Steve Cohen negotiating to buy the team. Is this still in the discussion stage? Have they reached an agreement yet? I can only imagine how much you guys must be on pins-and-needles hoping for this to go through. Good riddance to bad rubbish. The sooner, the better.
                    When you can get rid of the worst thing that has ever happened to a team you root and it has lasted 3+ decades...………….yes we are on pins and needles and the sooner the better.

                    Wilpons - the 33 year old toothache.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Blue387 View Post

                      And all this publicly reported stuff is just the tip of the iceberg. There has to be weirder and worse things behind the scenes.
                      Pedro Martinez told another disgusting Jeff story that someone posted on here last season.

                      Every wonder why Met players don't come back to Citi.

                      If the Mets were owned by someone with the intention of winning. Cohen is actually a disgusted Met fan (from what I have read -- well if you are a Met fan you have to be disgusted, but I digress). The following may have happened:

                      1) They sign ARod in 2000 - Arod was dying to come here. The Mets had one of their negative campaigns - The "24 & 1" campaign.
                      2) They get Vlad Sr. - Remember the back injury? ……...Remember the MVP he won after that?
                      3) They sign Piazza without question - as you know Fred didn't want him. Imagine the late 90's early 00's teams without Piazza. No playoffs, No WS. No post 9/11 homer.

                      Last but not least...…….and most important for me...………..

                      4) Darryl Strawberry remains a Met, and maybe - just maybe he stays in line, hits 500 homers as a Met, and is a HOF'er. That POS Fred didn't want to give a 28 year old a 5th year.


                      I am sure I can make a list of 100 things.

                      The point is under the Wilscum Kidnapping of my fandom is hopefully nearing an end.


                      Does anyone realize (I know most of you do) how the Wilpons have affected our baseball experience in a negative way?

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Paulypal View Post

                        Pedro Martinez told another disgusting Jeff story that someone posted on here last season.

                        Every wonder why Met players don't come back to Citi.

                        If the Mets were owned by someone with the intention of winning. Cohen is actually a disgusted Met fan (from what I have read -- well if you are a Met fan you have to be disgusted, but I digress). The following may have happened:

                        1) They sign ARod in 2000 - Arod was dying to come here. The Mets had one of their negative campaigns - The "24 & 1" campaign.
                        2) They get Vlad Sr. - Remember the back injury? ……...Remember the MVP he won after that?
                        3) They sign Piazza without question - as you know Fred didn't want him. Imagine the late 90's early 00's teams without Piazza. No playoffs, No WS. No post 9/11 homer.

                        Last but not least...…….and most important for me...………..

                        4) Darryl Strawberry remains a Met, and maybe - just maybe he stays in line, hits 500 homers as a Met, and is a HOF'er. That POS Fred didn't want to give a 28 year old a 5th year.


                        I am sure I can make a list of 100 things.

                        The point is under the Wilscum Kidnapping of my fandom is hopefully nearing an end.


                        Does anyone realize (I know most of you do) how the Wilpons have affected our baseball experience in a negative way?
                        34 years! We didn't know it at the time, but he started dismantling the 1986 team the moment he hoodwinked Doubleday out of half the team in November of that year. His influence was felt on the field immediately. That fiery Mets team became sodden and dysfunctional very quickly.

                        Our relationship to the team has changed. For most of our lives, it's been a source of bad feelings, disappointments and outrage. We're no longer kids: our relationship might have changed in certain ways regardless, but we were forced to stop caring. I guess I must care; I bother to pay attention. But I've insulated myself from emotional involvement in the team, and sports in general.

                        The Wilpons ruined being a Mets fan, for decades. Worse than hate, they inspired apathy. I'm not sure I'm capable of my former level of enthusiasm anymore.


                        "The Fightin' Met With Two Heads" - Mike Tyson/Ray Knight!

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Mongoose View Post

                          34 years! We didn't know it at the time, but he started dismantling the 1986 team the moment he hoodwinked Doubleday out of half the team in November of that year. His influence was felt on the field immediately. That fiery Mets team became sodden and dysfunctional very quickly.

                          Our relationship to the team has changed. For most of our lives, it's been a source of bad feelings, disappointments and outrage. We're no longer kids: our relationship might have changed in certain ways regardless, but we were forced to stop caring. I guess I must care; I bother to pay attention. But I've insulated myself from emotional involvement in the team, and sports in general.

                          The Wilpons ruined being a Mets fan, for decades. Worse than hate, they inspired apathy. I'm not sure I'm capable of my former level of enthusiasm anymore.
                          Great post.

                          We may have stopped living and dying with the team due to life taking over, age...etc, but they sure have expedited the process.

                          I never thought I would find myself indifferent to the Mets - which I have become. I follow baseball so I post about the Mets here but mostly it is not complimentary to the team. In fact I have rooted for losses for large chunks of the time in hopes enough embarrassment would force some type of change.

                          That was unimaginable to me back in the day.

                          When I posted during the season that one of my fears is the Mets winning the WS, and watching Jeff hold the trophy I was not kidding. That would dilute the WS championship for me.

                          That also was unimaginable to me back in the day.


                          I hope this Cohen thing happens, happens quick and lets go forward.

                          Like you I am not sure I could muster up the fan intensity that I had. I seriously doubt it. It has been too long of an engrained process feeling otherwise.

                          For me it would take a special player to watch and root for as well as a team that was competitive every season. Like 1984-1990 to even approach where I was.
                          Last edited by Paulypal; 12-08-2019, 01:54 PM.

                          Comment


                          • Succinct little article summarizing the chain of events.

                            https://www.amazinavenue.com/2019/12...cohen-new-york
                            Put it in the books.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Paulypal View Post

                              Great post.

                              We may have stopped living and dying with the team due to life taking over, age...etc, but they sure have expedited the process.

                              I never thought I would find myself indifferent to the Mets - which I have become. I follow baseball so I post about the Mets here but mostly it is not complimentary to the team. In fact I have rooted for losses for large chunks of the time in hopes enough embarrassment would force some type of change.

                              That was unimaginable to me back in the day.
                              As I've gotten older, I don't let the outcomes of baseball games get the better of me. For me, it came to a head one Fireworks night against the Dodgers back in the 90's. Mets were up; Franco blew the game, and I was too angry to stay, so I went for my car. I experienced road rage, as I got stuck behind cars that stopped (slowed to a crawl) on the Van Wyck to watch the fireworks. I laid down on the car horn, and continued my drive home. When I got to my local gin mill, I told the bartender that I was too mad to drink, and went home. Next day, I changed my tune and attitude towards the outcomes of games and events that I really have no control over.

                              I now take everything with a grain of salt, and enjoy the moments, not necessarily the outcomes.

                              When I posted during the season that one of my fears is the Mets winning the WS, and watching Jeff hold the trophy I was not kidding. That would dilute the WS championship for me.

                              That also was unimaginable to me back in the day.
                              I disagree. I would have loved it. I root for the players, not the owners. And the fact that the team I root for could have overcome all the handicaps flowing down from ownership would be a testament to their character and ability. They won in spite of ownership issues.


                              20-Game Saturday Plan, Prom Box 423.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by LI METS FAN View Post

                                The strangest thing I heard on the radio yesterday driving home was when Michael Kay noted the wealth of Cohen and said maybe it’s time for a salary cap in MLB.
                                I wonder if he feels the same way today, with all that Cole in the Yankees stocking...
                                20-Game Saturday Plan, Prom Box 423.

                                Comment

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