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The Sandy Alderson Thread

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  • Paulypal
    replied
    Originally posted by Strawman View Post
    The guy hit .200 in a career that's been in decline since 2007 - he's got a .235 lifetime average. Who cares about BABIP with those numbers? "Hey, with better luck he'd have raked at .220!!"

    Surely, the Mets have a cheap prospect who can provide Young-level "production."

    It's an incredibly stupid signing - hard almost to overstate how overwhelmingly pathetic it is, really.
    Your quite possibly correct. It may pan out to be a disaster.

    So how is the pursuit of Choo & Granderson going?

    Leave a comment:


  • Strawman
    replied
    Originally posted by Paulypal View Post
    I agree let it play out.

    Now I was as critical as anyone when the Mets were even kicking the tires on Young, but after reading some stuff on Fan Graphs I am less critical.

    Also it doesn't seem like its in the cards that the Mets are going to pull off an Ellsbury, Choo, or Granderson. They are just not going to spend that kind of money on one player......it seems. So when you look at the list of FA OF'ers the pickings are slim.
    The guy hit .200 in a career that's been in decline since 2007 - he's got a .235 lifetime average. Who cares about BABIP with those numbers? "Hey, with better luck he'd have raked at .220!!"

    Surely, the Mets have a cheap prospect who can provide Young-level "production."

    It's an incredibly stupid signing - hard almost to overstate how overwhelmingly pathetic it is, really.

    Leave a comment:


  • Paulypal
    replied
    Originally posted by rjsallstars View Post
    You are right, it is a problem nobody has any control over except Wilpon. The GM has control over how it is spent and we can have an opinion on how it is spent also. Earlier this evening so called insiders are saying the 25 mil is not set in stone so who knows what the truth is. I guess we have to let this offseason play out.
    I agree let it play out.

    Now I was as critical as anyone when the Mets were even kicking the tires on Young, but after reading some stuff on Fan Graphs I am less critical.

    Also it doesn't seem like its in the cards that the Mets are going to pull off an Ellsbury, Choo, or Granderson. They are just not going to spend that kind of money on one player......it seems. So when you look at the list of FA OF'ers the pickings are slim.

    Leave a comment:


  • rjsallstars
    replied
    Originally posted by Paulypal View Post
    The fact that signing Chris Young is 1/4 of the available funds is the problem that you should really be focused on, not so much that it was used on Chris Young. 7.25M shouldn't be 25% of the budget....now there is your real issue.
    You are right, it is a problem nobody has any control over except Wilpon. The GM has control over how it is spent and we can have an opinion on how it is spent also. Earlier this evening so called insiders are saying the 25 mil is not set in stone so who knows what the truth is. I guess we have to let this offseason play out.

    Leave a comment:


  • Paulypal
    replied
    Originally posted by rjsallstars View Post
    for all those with the mindset of "I do not care how much they spend, it's not my money", you guys should love the Young signing. When you know a team has a budget (right or wrong) you should be able to figure out using 1/4 of all your available funds on Chris Young is not a good deal. This is why "I do not care, it's not my money" is one of the most foolish things I have read on this site.
    The fact that signing Chris Young is 1/4 of the available funds is the problem that you should really be focused on, not so much that it was used on Chris Young. 7.25M shouldn't be 25% of the budget....now there is your real issue.

    Leave a comment:


  • rjsallstars
    replied
    for all those with the mindset of "I do not care how much they spend, it's not my money", you guys should love the Young signing. When you know a team has a budget (right or wrong) you should be able to figure out using 1/4 of all your available funds on Chris Young is not a good deal. This is why "I do not care, it's not my money" is one of the most foolish things I have read on this site.

    Leave a comment:


  • Paulypal
    replied
    Originally posted by Strawman View Post
    As much as I might want Beltran back, I'd probably go Granderson and Choo in the Great 2014 Sandy Alderson Money Off the Books Hot Stove Bonanza. That would lengthen the lineup and add considerable power on either side of future All Star Juan Lagares.
    Strawman...you see what your doing here. Choo and Granderson on either side of Lagares. That is pretty good stuff right there. I dont even know if Alderson knows who those two guys are. Really?????? Are you kidding me??????

    I figured that you had some mid level / mid priced guys in mind when you were so critical of Alderson pick up of Young, but you dont obviously. You went top shelf. Based on that pipe dream maybe we can pry Cabrera away from the Tigers by dangling Tejada at them. Mike Trout for Ike Davis?

    Ok back to reality and the Mets budget of spending $25M this off season.

    I also noticed that you have Lagares as an All Star. Lets hope so, but then again you had Wilmer Flores as TONY PEREZ after 15 at bats.
    Last edited by Paulypal; 11-22-2013, 01:05 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Paulypal
    replied
    Originally posted by Strawman View Post
    BABIP is a fun little statistical gimmick, but almost entirely invalid in understanding actual value to a living, breathing baseball team. Hits matter - good players get them, invariably. Declining players don't, and it's not because balls aren't falling in.

    He's not a good fielder, let's put it that way. Fair point about the one-year deal. I think think it's hideously overpriced.
    Originally posted by CokeMachineGlow View Post
    The fact that you think it's a statistical gimmick speaks volumes about your actual understanding of the statistic.

    And, no, he isn't "hideously overpriced." You can spit out hyperbole's all you want, but historically, players with similar skill sets as Young and have had a down year get payed roughly around that amount.
    BAPIP is not a gimmick. Like many other stats its useful, but you cant make absolute judgements based upon one stat. As far as BABIP goes its a good indicator if hits are falling or not. Lets face sometimes you can go 3-4 with 3 bloops, and other times you can go 0-4 with three missiles hit right at the defense. I am not going to make believe I know what kind of outs Young was making.

    I do know that I hope he does well. Where as I doubt Strawman will because Alderson signed him, and I really think you rather have that to hang your hat on instead of realizing the reality of the situation.
    Last edited by Paulypal; 11-22-2013, 12:55 PM.

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  • Strawman
    replied
    Originally posted by Paulypal View Post
    I am not excited about the Young signing in case that was a secret, but be fair here. He isnt a lousy fielder, and he is signed to a one year deal...so its not like we are going to live his legs declining.

    Is it a good signing. No - not for a team that needs so much. Now -- is it a good signing for a Wilpon owned team? It an F'n bonanza.

    "Big off season Alderson has been promising". 4 years and you still dont get it.

    Who should Sandy sign? Strawman answer that question please. What free agent OF'ers should Sandy sign. I gave you a headstart and listed all the FA OF'ers available.

    I am waiting for your response with a pad and pen anxiously waiting to jot down the names of the players YOU choose. Please hurry I dont think I take the suspense too long.
    As much as I might want Beltran back, I'd probably go Granderson and Choo in the Great 2014 Sandy Alderson Money Off the Books Hot Stove Bonanza. That would lengthen the lineup and add considerable power on either side of future All Star Juan Lagares.

    Leave a comment:


  • CokeMachineGlow
    replied
    Originally posted by Strawman View Post
    BABIP is a fun little statistical gimmick, but almost entirely invalid in understanding actual value to a living, breathing baseball team. Hits matter - good players get them, invariably. Declining players don't, and it's not because balls aren't falling in.

    He's not a good fielder, let's put it that way. Fair point about the one-year deal. I think think it's hideously overpriced.
    The fact that you think it's a statistical gimmick speaks volumes about your actual understanding of the statistic.

    And, no, he isn't "hideously overpriced." You can spit out hyperbole's all you want, but historically, players with similar skill sets as Young and have had a down year get payed roughly around that amount.

    Leave a comment:


  • Strawman
    replied
    Originally posted by CokeMachineGlow View Post
    1. You have zero understanding of BABIP. That much I can assume from your first sentence.
    2. He can't hit righties. You're right. Last year, Cody Ross, Ryan Ludwick, and Jonny Gomes -- all players terrible against righties and have similar skillsets -- got more than Young. He's not getting paid to match his prime value. $7.25M is worth roughly one WAR -- which Young is very capable of producing and STEAMER predictions has him producing just around that next season
    3. He's hardly a lousy fielder. Let's not act like he has an iron glove.
    4. The point about his legs is irrelevant given that we have him for one year and he's not, like, 34 years old. He's only 30.
    BABIP is a fun little statistical gimmick, but almost entirely invalid in understanding actual value to a living, breathing baseball team. Hits matter - good players get them, invariably. Declining players don't, and it's not because balls aren't falling in.

    He's not a good fielder, let's put it that way. Fair point about the one-year deal. I think think it's hideously overpriced.

    Leave a comment:


  • Paulypal
    replied
    Originally posted by Strawman View Post
    It was low because he didn't hit the ball in fair territory and advance to 1B safely without an error very often.

    He can't hit righties, and is a lousy fielder, and his legs will get slower. It's a classic poor signing.

    This is the big off-season Alderson has been personally promising now for years, this is it??!!
    I am not excited about the Young signing in case that was a secret, but be fair here. He isnt a lousy fielder, and he is signed to a one year deal...so its not like we are going to live his legs declining.

    Is it a good signing. No - not for a team that needs so much. Now -- is it a good signing for a Wilpon owned team? It an F'n bonanza.

    "Big off season Alderson has been promising". 4 years and you still dont get it.

    Who should Sandy sign? Strawman answer that question please. What free agent OF'ers should Sandy sign. I gave you a headstart and listed all the FA OF'ers available.

    I am waiting for your response with a pad and pen anxiously waiting to jot down the names of the players YOU choose. Please hurry I dont think I take the suspense too long.

    Leave a comment:


  • CokeMachineGlow
    replied
    Originally posted by Strawman View Post
    It was low because he didn't hit the ball in fair territory and advance to 1B safely without an error very often.

    He can't hit righties, and is a lousy fielder, and his legs will get slower. It's a classic poor signing.

    This is the big off-season Alderson has been personally promising now for years, this is it??!!
    1. You have zero understanding of BABIP. That much I can assume from your first sentence.
    2. He can't hit righties. You're right. Last year, Cody Ross, Ryan Ludwick, and Jonny Gomes -- all players terrible against righties and have similar skillsets -- got more than Young. He's not getting paid to match his prime value. $7.25M is worth roughly one WAR -- which Young is very capable of producing and STEAMER predictions has him producing just around that next season
    3. He's hardly a lousy fielder. Let's not act like he has an iron glove.
    4. The point about his legs is irrelevant given that we have him for one year and he's not, like, 34 years old. He's only 30.

    Leave a comment:


  • Strawman
    replied
    Originally posted by CokeMachineGlow View Post
    Other than the fact that $7.25M for Young is considered a huge bargain for a guy with his skillset, let's simply ignore everything and focus on his batting average -- which was historically low because of his low BABIP.
    It was low because he didn't hit the ball in fair territory and advance to 1B safely without an error very often.

    He can't hit righties, and is a lousy fielder, and his legs will get slower. It's a classic poor signing.

    This is the big off-season Alderson has been personally promising now for years, this is it??!!

    Leave a comment:


  • CokeMachineGlow
    replied
    Originally posted by Strawman View Post
    I blame him for paying $7.25M for a guy who hit .200, yeah.

    If he'd gotten Young for $2M, then you can't blame him.

    This in the same week, btw, when they let Hawkins go for $1M.

    And Alderson will probably trade Murphy rather than pay him $5-6M.

    So yeah, I blame Sandy Alderson.
    Other than the fact that $7.25M for Young is considered a huge bargain for a guy with his skillset, let's simply ignore everything and focus on his batting average -- which was historically low because of his low BABIP.

    Leave a comment:

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