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  • jjpm74
    replied
    Originally posted by milladrive View Post
    https://www.aol.com/ex-angels-p-matt...211707143.html

    Former Los Angeles Angels pitcher Matt Harvey was suspended 60 games by Major League Baseball on Tuesday for his role in the death of former teammate Tyler Skaggs.

    MLB suspended Harvey, who is currently with the Baltimore Orioles’ Triple-A affiliate, for participating in the distribution of a prohibited drug of abuse. The suspension is retroactive to April 29.

    Harvey admitted in court earlier this year that he received pills from former Angels communications official Eric Kay. Harvey said at Kay’s trial that he received Percocet in 2019 and started using it and sharing it with Skaggs. He said he frequently exchanged pills with Skaggs in the clubhouse, and that he used Percocet in the clubhouse and dugout, and said he saw Skaggs snort oxycodone in the clubhouse bathroom.

    Skaggs died in July 2019 of an opioid overdose. He was 27. A report later determined that he took pills laced with fentanyl and mixed them with alcohol, and that he choked on his own vomit.

    Kay was convicted on two felony counts of distributing pills to players earlier this year. He had worked for the Angels for more than a decade. Harvey was granted immunity during the trial, but was still subject to discipline from the league.

    Harvey, 33, spent one season with the Angels in 2019, where he made 12 starts and went 3-5. The former New York Mets star went 6-14 in 28 starts last season with the Orioles, which marked his fifth team in four seasons.
    Man, what a train wreck Harvey has turned into.

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  • milladrive
    replied
    https://www.aol.com/ex-angels-p-matt...211707143.html

    Former Los Angeles Angels pitcher Matt Harvey was suspended 60 games by Major League Baseball on Tuesday for his role in the death of former teammate Tyler Skaggs.

    MLB suspended Harvey, who is currently with the Baltimore Orioles’ Triple-A affiliate, for participating in the distribution of a prohibited drug of abuse. The suspension is retroactive to April 29.

    Harvey admitted in court earlier this year that he received pills from former Angels communications official Eric Kay. Harvey said at Kay’s trial that he received Percocet in 2019 and started using it and sharing it with Skaggs. He said he frequently exchanged pills with Skaggs in the clubhouse, and that he used Percocet in the clubhouse and dugout, and said he saw Skaggs snort oxycodone in the clubhouse bathroom.

    Skaggs died in July 2019 of an opioid overdose. He was 27. A report later determined that he took pills laced with fentanyl and mixed them with alcohol, and that he choked on his own vomit.

    Kay was convicted on two felony counts of distributing pills to players earlier this year. He had worked for the Angels for more than a decade. Harvey was granted immunity during the trial, but was still subject to discipline from the league.

    Harvey, 33, spent one season with the Angels in 2019, where he made 12 starts and went 3-5. The former New York Mets star went 6-14 in 28 starts last season with the Orioles, which marked his fifth team in four seasons.

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  • Shea Knight
    replied
    Originally posted by Paulypal View Post

    I find it fascinating that anyone is surprised by anything that happens.

    Is anyone really aghast that Matt Harvey was involved with drugs? I mean really?


    "Surprised," no, given his party antics and going AWOL and missing a game that one time (which I remembered all over again reading the NY Post article about this, I'd forgotten that one amongst the general blur of Harvey stunts that marks Harvey's long hard fall at this point) but "aghast"...

    Just sad, really, especially since his addiction was bad enough that he apparently vocalized thoughts of suicide while still with the Mets.

    I don't think illicit drug use is shocking, but the fact he was in that dark of a place mentally for a time is--it would be for anyone.


    Drug addicts do what drug addicts do until they decide to turn the corner.

    It really isn't always as easy as just "deciding to turn the corner," though. Don't get me wrong--he's still responsible for his actions, and if that means getting suspended (and given his awful stat lines for the past year, this might be the end of the road for him career-wise, at least in the short term--people will forgive missteps for an All-Star or quality starter, not so much for a guy with an ERA over 6.00 last year, and that kind of double standard is its OWN level of hypocrisy, people claiming to care so much about "morals" while overlooking them for some and overacting on them for others, but I digress) ANYWAY, if he has to pay for his actions, so be it, that's life--

    BUT that doesn't mean making life changes is as easy as just "deciding" to do it, or otherwise you've just "decided" to be an addict.

    NO ONE wakes up one morning and decides, "Hey, you know what'd be great for me and my life? Being a drug addict, and possibly wrecking my seven-figure career and life overall along with it, yeah, that sounds like a blast."

    None of us are equipped to be Armchair Psychologists, and we may never know the exact facts of what happened with Harvey and when, nor should we necessarily know as it's his business after all...

    *BUT* I wasn't kidding when I said it's honestly scary from a human standpoint scary how far and fast he fell after that 9th inning of Game 5, 2015. Whether his drug issues or suicidal thoughts got worse after that is just speculation...but just from the outside looking in on this, which is where we all are right now, it REALLY sounds like that and the thoracic outlet issue the next year sent him spiraling into a pattern of depression and addiction to deal with that and those two things just compounding on top of one another the last few years.

    That doesn't excuse his actions, you can't just wake up one day and turn to drugs as a solution--BUT addiction's called a disease for a reason, and once you've made that FIRST bad decision to start...well, if the choice is:

    1. Seek help, which might mean withdrawal symptoms, could mean losing your money and job, and will DEFINITELY mean an endless barrage of questions from the media, or
    2. Just keep telling yourself the same thing every athlete tells themselves about injuries, "Tough it out," and suffer in silence the way a lot of men in general do across the board...

    Him taking Option #2 isn't excusable--but it's pretty understandable, and I think we overstate our ability to even make decisions after that first choice to fall into drugs in the first place. Addiction AND depression can seriously alter the way you think, so both together? What's unthinkable for us might literally have been a thought process he couldn't escape after he'd already fallen into that hole.


    I feel bad for anyone caught up in that crap, but am I surprised Matt Harvey fell into that hole? I think you would have had blinders on to be surprised.

    True, but honestly, as you allude to elsewhere, this society already has blinders on about its major addiction issues re: opioids and the socioeconomic issues that lead people to fall into addiction as a coping mechanism in the first place.

    As far as the 15 year old Russian girl.......well if they rid of all drugs (from pain meds to PED's) from Olympians we would be watching a very different level of competition. It is all so widespread that it is ridiculous when one person gets pointed out, but scapegoats are needed.[

    Honestly rumors of Russian cheating is practically an Olympic tradition at this point the same as the torch lighting, lol...would it really feel like the Olympics without it?
    That said, is anyone actually watching these Olympics anyway? Ratings are supposed to be way down, and I thought I'd watch them more now that I live overseas and so the time difference isn't as huge as it would be if I were back in LA, but I haven't watched them at all...it just doesn't FEEL like Olympic Season, especially so soon after the rescheduled 2020 Games that were played in 2021 and THOSE apparently didn't have great ratings either...NHL players aren't playing in the hockey tournament so the big draw for watching that's gone too...

    Then again, now that the Super Bowl has come and gone (much like the Bengals' offensive line, lol) I guess it's either that, hockey, or watching the Knicks, and...lol...

    Leave a comment:


  • Paulypal
    replied
    Originally posted by mandrake View Post
    I find it ironic that the American media is currently obsessing over a 15 year old girl from Russia who may have used , or been forced to use , a non narcotic prescription med , but is relatively silent about American baseball players who were in court admitting they not only used illegal narcotics like cocaine , but they shared prescription opiates ( oxycodone , Percocet , OxyContin) . Very puzzling but not surprising.
    I find it fascinating that anyone is surprised by anything that happens.

    Is anyone really aghast that Matt Harvey was involved with drugs? I mean really?.

    The opiate problem is widespread so what makes anyone think that baseball isnt as much a part of as any other segment of the population? It does make one wonder why opiates in any form are actually considered a medicine when they are so highly addictive. Makes one wonder..................no I mean it really makes you wonder.

    As far as Matt Harvey goes -- well the handwriting was on the wall from the beginning that he was going to fall hard on some level. He had some very tough health issues along the way, but lets not forget that he was equally concerned with being on Page 6 with a model. How many times have we seen a public figure that wants to the live the fast life end up in some rehab center? We really have no idea what Collins did or didnt do or anyone else Met related did or didnt do to help or not help. Drug addicts do what drug addicts do until they decide to turn the corner.

    I feel bad for anyone caught up in that crap, but am I surprised Matt Harvey fell into that hole? I think you would have had blinders on to be surprised.

    As far as the 15 year old Russian girl.......well if they rid of all drugs (from pain meds to PED's) from Olympians we would be watching a very different level of competition. It is all so widespread that it is ridiculous when one person gets pointed out, but scapegoats are needed.
    Last edited by Paulypal; 02-17-2022, 12:30 PM.

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  • jjpm74
    replied
    Originally posted by mandrake View Post
    I find it ironic that the American media is currently obsessing over a 15 year old girl from Russia who may have used , or been forced to use , a non narcotic prescription med , but is relatively silent about American baseball players who were in court admitting they not only used illegal narcotics like cocaine , but they shared prescription opiates ( oxycodone , Percocet , OxyContin) . Very puzzling but not surprising.
    The Russian doping scandal and tampering in figure skating goes back to the 1980s and is a national headline. Outside of New York, no one cares about Matt Harvey. That is the sad truth.

    Leave a comment:


  • mandrake
    replied
    I find it ironic that the American media is currently obsessing over a 15 year old girl from Russia who may have used , or been forced to use , a non narcotic prescription med , but is relatively silent about American baseball players who were in court admitting they not only used illegal narcotics like cocaine , but they shared prescription opiates ( oxycodone , Percocet , OxyContin) . Very puzzling but not surprising.

    Leave a comment:


  • LI METS FAN
    replied
    Originally posted by Shea Knight View Post
    This is way bigger than baseball. This is a guy's life--and another teammate of his wasn't so lucky. And "lucky" is a pretty funny word to use about something like this.

    But all of that said...man...it really is crazy how Harvey's professional and personal life went south after "No Way" and that 9th inning of Game 5.

    Whether his problems began before then or after that or however much they had to do with that is his business--but it and everything that followed on the field and off can't have helped.

    But for a couple different bounces or calls, but for that thoracic outlet surgery, maybe things go differently for him--but for a couple different choices, maybe Tyler Skaggs gets the help he needs and is still alive today. We're responsible for our actions, but we're not always as in control of our circumstances as we or those who judge us would like to believe.

    Hopefully Harvey gets the help he needs...I just feel badly for him. It's hard to have to live with yourself and thoughts like that, and want to verbalize them and get them out and not keep them bottled up--but you can't do that in a city where the media's constant and a society where your every action might wind up recorded for all-time on social media to be endlessly rehashed by Twitter experts who act like they're an expert on things they don't know a clue about and reinvent "you" before your very eyes.

    If he were still "The Dark Knight" this would be dealt with as the tragedy it is--instead, it's sickening to think people will (and they WILL) use this as an opportunity to pile on when the man clearly needs help.

    This is just sad.
    Well said. Like all of us, he’s flawed. His struggles are public. Hoping for a turnaround for him. He’s not young for a baseball player but he is young in a lifespan. Hopefully.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mongoose
    replied
    Originally posted by Shea Knight View Post
    This is way bigger than baseball. This is a guy's life--and another teammate of his wasn't so lucky. And "lucky" is a pretty funny word to use about something like this.

    But all of that said...man...it really is crazy how Harvey's professional and personal life went south after "No Way" and that 9th inning of Game 5.

    Whether his problems began before then or after that or however much they had to do with that is his business--but it and everything that followed on the field and off can't have helped.

    But for a couple different bounces or calls, but for that thoracic outlet surgery, maybe things go differently for him--but for a couple different choices, maybe Tyler Skaggs gets the help he needs and is still alive today. We're responsible for our actions, but we're not always as in control of our circumstances as we or those who judge us would like to believe.

    Hopefully Harvey gets the help he needs...I just feel badly for him. It's hard to have to live with yourself and thoughts like that, and want to verbalize them and get them out and not keep them bottled up--but you can't do that in a city where the media's constant and a society where your every action might wind up recorded for all-time on social media to be endlessly rehashed by Twitter experts who act like they're an expert on things they don't know a clue about and reinvent "you" before your very eyes.

    If he were still "The Dark Knight" this would be dealt with as the tragedy it is--instead, it's sickening to think people will (and they WILL) use this as an opportunity to pile on when the man clearly needs help.

    This is just sad.
    Is it better to have everything and lose it, or to never have experienced having it all?

    Having your dreams in hand, then watching them escape your grasp, and fly irretrievably away is a special kind of devastating. It's something some of us can understand... maybe.

    But few of us have had to experience it in the spotlight.

    Leave a comment:


  • Shea Knight
    replied
    This is way bigger than baseball. This is a guy's life--and another teammate of his wasn't so lucky. And "lucky" is a pretty funny word to use about something like this.

    But all of that said...man...it really is crazy how Harvey's professional and personal life went south after "No Way" and that 9th inning of Game 5.

    Whether his problems began before then or after that or however much they had to do with that is his business--but it and everything that followed on the field and off can't have helped.

    But for a couple different bounces or calls, but for that thoracic outlet surgery, maybe things go differently for him--but for a couple different choices, maybe Tyler Skaggs gets the help he needs and is still alive today. We're responsible for our actions, but we're not always as in control of our circumstances as we or those who judge us would like to believe.

    Hopefully Harvey gets the help he needs...I just feel badly for him. It's hard to have to live with yourself and thoughts like that, and want to verbalize them and get them out and not keep them bottled up--but you can't do that in a city where the media's constant and a society where your every action might wind up recorded for all-time on social media to be endlessly rehashed by Twitter experts who act like they're an expert on things they don't know a clue about and reinvent "you" before your very eyes.

    If he were still "The Dark Knight" this would be dealt with as the tragedy it is--instead, it's sickening to think people will (and they WILL) use this as an opportunity to pile on when the man clearly needs help.

    This is just sad.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mongoose
    replied
    Originally posted by mandrake View Post

    This part of the Terry Collins interview really bugs me .

    “There was a time I addressed an off-the-field issue with one of the other guys on the team and his statement was, ‘Well, I’m not doing what Matt Harvey is doing.’ I said, ‘This isn’t about Matt Harvey, this is about you.’ I tried to get off that subject as fast as I could. Was there knowledge in the clubhouse? Without question.”

    So …. Collins is saying he knew about it , and other players knew about it , and nobody did anything . This is coming from a franchise that really didn’t do anything to help Doc , Straw , Lenny . A franchise who dumped Kevin Mitchell. One would think that the Mets would have tried to help 2015’s biggest star. One wonders if he was coked up when he ran out to the mound in the 9th inning ……
    If the team had known, what were they expected to do? From observation, I've noted people with substance abuse or addiction problems will only quit when they feel it's necessary.

    Leave a comment:


  • mandrake
    replied
    Originally posted by milladrive View Post

    I'm just as curious to know why this is the first we're hearing about it. Someone (Matt Harvey no less) doing blow in a 21st Century Mets clubhouse and no reports of it until 2022? I dunno.
    This part of the Terry Collins interview really bugs me .

    “There was a time I addressed an off-the-field issue with one of the other guys on the team and his statement was, ‘Well, I’m not doing what Matt Harvey is doing.’ I said, ‘This isn’t about Matt Harvey, this is about you.’ I tried to get off that subject as fast as I could. Was there knowledge in the clubhouse? Without question.”

    So …. Collins is saying he knew about it , and other players knew about it , and nobody did anything . This is coming from a franchise that really didn’t do anything to help Doc , Straw , Lenny . A franchise who dumped Kevin Mitchell. One would think that the Mets would have tried to help 2015’s biggest star. One wonders if he was coked up when he ran out to the mound in the 9th inning ……

    Leave a comment:


  • PVNICK
    replied
    There's a players association, people scoff at the "backacne'" story, libel laws, the sort of Omerta within the clubhouse It's the real world out there.

    On edit: I'm surprised no one has interviewed Scott Boras. It was in his interest to have Harvey have a career and he always put himself out there about protecting him regarding the innings limit.
    Last edited by PVNICK; 02-16-2022, 04:12 AM.

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  • milladrive
    replied
    Originally posted by mandrake View Post

    Now stories surface that Harvey was snorting coke in the clubhouse , and he was seen having nosebleeds . If this is true , why wasn’t something done earlier ?
    I'm just as curious to know why this is the first we're hearing about it. Someone (Matt Harvey no less) doing blow in a 21st Century Mets clubhouse and no reports of it until 2022? I dunno.

    Leave a comment:


  • milladrive
    replied
    Originally posted by Mongoose View Post

    It's hard for some people to be great, without mentally envisioning it. Harvey probably envisioned his own greatness, and all the material spoils were part of it: stardom, the most desirable women, adulation, power. It becomes part of one's sense of self. To actually achieve that and lose it is an existential blow. One's self images breaks, and often, there's nothing on hand to replace it.

    One has to rebuild one's sense of self from scratch. I wish him well.
    I too wish Harvey well (of course), but I don't think we nor anyone should pretend to know what draws someone to consider taking their own life. Some can strikeout and never give up, while others can hit the game-winner and curl up in a corner.

    Leave a comment:


  • mandrake
    replied
    Originally posted by Mongoose View Post

    It's hard for some people to be great, without mentally envisioning it. Harvey probably envisioned his own greatness, and all the material spoils were part of it: stardom, the most desirable women, adulation, power. It becomes part of one's sense of self. To actually achieve that and lose it is an existential blow. One's self images breaks, and often, there's nothing on hand to replace it.

    One has to rebuild one's sense of self from scratch. I wish him well.
    Now stories surface that Harvey was snorting coke in the clubhouse , and he was seen having nosebleeds . If this is true , why wasn’t something done earlier ?

    Leave a comment:

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