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  • #31
    Originally posted by PVNICK View Post
    Didn't the 80s Mets outdraw everyone? Ever? Including the Dodgers who I think were the first to 2 million in attendance. There is something to it. I know a fair share of people that were Mets fans as kids (or so I am told) that gravitated towards the Yankees circa mid 90s.
    The biggest differential in the Mets favor ever was in 1970.

    The Mets outdrew the Yankees every season, 1964-1975 under Joan Payson's ownership. The Mets again outdrew the Yankees 1984-1992. It doesn't mean Yankees fan switched...it means many Mets fans came out of the woodwork. The Yankees outdrew the Mets 1993-2013. Does this mean that Mets fans have become Yankee fans 21 straight years? No. it means some fans refuse to spend money on crap. Some bandwagon fans may have switched, but I think the majority of all fans stay loyal.

    They did not always outdraw the NY Giants, nor the Brooklyn Dodgers, and certainly not the NY Mets. However the idea that the NYY fans are fair weather fans, as opposed to the always loyal Mets fans, is a pipe dream.

    Chalk it up to the inferiority complex that Mets fans have towards the Yankees.

    Now back to Bartolo Colon..........

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    • #32
      I think there are more fairweather fans each way than you wish to admit. Be that as it may. Colon will help eat innings (badabum) but I keep thinking Livan Hernandezesque.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by mandrake View Post
        DING DING DING...winner.

        I know older Yankee fans who openly admit that they rooted for the 1969 Mets because they were such a great story. Can you imagine any Mets fans on baseball fever ever rooting for the Yankees even if Mother Theresa was pitching and the Pope was playing centerfield?

        I have gone to Old Yankee, Renovated Yankee, New Yankee, Shea Stadium , and Citi (too young for Polo Grounds sorry) and IMHO most Yankee fans really don't give a rat's tail about the Mets. Mets fans absolutely obsess over hatred of the Yankees.

        In 1979, the Mets loyal fans (you know the real super loyal people) came out to Shea in numbers that gave us : 788,905

        One would have to go back to WWII's darkest days of 1943 to have NY Yankees attendance that low......and the Yankees actually won the WS that year over St Louis (one of only two times they beat the Cardinals). As Mel Allen would say, 'how about that".

        I really don't think Yankee fans are just going to become Mets fans. Even when the NY Giants ruled baseball, the Yankees outdrew them. Even when the Brooklyn Dodgers glorious decade of the Boys of Summer reigned, the Yankees outdrew them.

        But fans up in steerage can dream, can't they?
        Yes we can!! No more from me on this subject. BTW, since you put yourself in charge of declaring winners and losers, can you at least tell me if I was close?

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        • #34
          Originally posted by rjsallstars View Post
          Yes we can!! No more from me on this subject. BTW, since you put yourself in charge of declaring winners and losers, can you at least tell me if I was close?
          No, you weren't close at all. Pauly won.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by rjsallstars View Post
            Yes we can!! No more from me on this subject. BTW, since you put yourself in charge of declaring winners and losers, can you at least tell me if I was close?
            Originally posted by mandrake View Post
            No, you weren't close at all. Pauly won.
            I was a 3 DING winner!!

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            • #36
              Since April 29, Bartolo Colon is 5-6 with a 5.73 ERA. In 66 innings, he has allowed 83 hits and 11 home runs. His opponents' slash line is .302/.324/.491.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by Cowtipper View Post
                Since April 29, Bartolo Colon is 5-6 with a 5.73 ERA. In 66 innings, he has allowed 83 hits and 11 home runs. His opponents' slash line is .302/.324/.491.
                Definately has not pitched well.

                The good thing is the Colon has served his purpose as a Met. He has given them innings and has bridged them to the young pitchers coming up. I will always think this was a good signing.

                It could be worse -- you could be paying Clayton Kershaw $30MM a year for the same 5-6 record for the season or have $65MM tied up in Corey Kluber who is 3-9 with a fairly bad slash line himself. I understand both of the guys are younger and probalby will turn it around, but we are down to the last couple of months of Colon - if he is around here that long.

                Again - I will always think this was a good signing.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Paulypal View Post
                  Definately has not pitched well.

                  The good thing is the Colon has served his purpose as a Met. He has given them innings and has bridged them to the young pitchers coming up. I will always think this was a good signing.

                  It could be worse -- you could be paying Clayton Kershaw $30MM a year for the same 5-6 record for the season or have $65MM tied up in Corey Kluber who is 3-9 with a fairly bad slash line himself. I understand both of the guys are younger and probalby will turn it around, but we are down to the last couple of months of Colon - if he is around here that long.

                  Again - I will always think this was a good signing.
                  Agree it was a good signing - and I'm not exactly pro-Alderson. Just as Pauly said, he ate some competent innings, was a nice veteran presence for the young guys, and sometimes fund to watch. That said, his value is pretty much gone - and I hate - make that despise - the on/off six-man rotation.
                  Cleon Jones catches a deep fly ball in F. Scott Fitzgerald's Valley of the Ashes, and a second-grader smiles in front of the black and white television.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Strawman View Post
                    Agree it was a good signing - and I'm not exactly pro-Alderson. Just as Pauly said, he ate some competent innings, was a nice veteran presence for the young guys, and sometimes fund to watch. That said, his value is pretty much gone - and I hate - make that despise - the on/off six-man rotation.
                    I was 100% against it, and I admitted I was 100% wrong. At least I didn't become a FAN caller suggesting something like Colon for Trout or Stanton.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by mandrake View Post
                      I was 100% against it, and I admitted I was 100% wrong. At least I didn't become a FAN caller suggesting something like Colon for Trout or Stanton.
                      So you dont think the Angels or Marlins would go for it. I was just about to call Francessa with a Colon & Tejada for Stanton & Fernandez trade. Now you have me thinking it may not be a good idea.

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by mandrake View Post
                        I was 100% against it, and I admitted I was 100% wrong. At least I didn't become a FAN caller suggesting something like Colon for Trout or Stanton.
                        So you dont think the Angels or Marlins would go for it. I was just about to call Francessa with a Colon & Tejada for Stanton & Fernandez trade. Now you have me thinking it may not be a good idea.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Based on performance the Mets didn't do horrendously with Colon. The issue was whether it was a good allocation of funds for a stingy franchise.

                          $20 million for 2 years of Colon going into a season where Syndergaard and Montero would be ready, with Matz and Harvey due the next year? With no shortstop and no depth? It never made baseball sense. At the same time they non-tendered Justin Turner over few hundred K? Throw in the Young and Granderson signings and you've got one of the worst off-seasons in recent memory.

                          Taken alone Colon's performance was O.K. for his contract. When looking at the bigger picture there were so many better ways of spending the money. I suspect part of Colon's "utility" to the Wilpons was making it easier to kick Synergaard/Matz/Montero arbitration down the road.


                          "The Fightin' Met With Two Heads" - Mike Tyson/Ray Knight!

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Mongoose View Post
                            Based on performance the Mets didn't do horrendously with Colon. The issue was whether it was a good allocation of funds for a stingy franchise.

                            $20 million for 2 years of Colon going into a season where Syndergaard and Montero would be ready, with Matz and Harvey due the next year? With no shortstop and no depth? It never made baseball sense. At the same time they non-tendered Justin Turner over few hundred K? Throw in the Young and Granderson signings and you've got one of the worst off-seasons in recent memory.

                            Taken alone Colon's performance was O.K. for his contract. When looking at the bigger picture there were so many better ways of spending the money. I suspect part of Colon's "utility" to the Wilpons was making it easier to kick Synergaard/Matz/Montero arbitration down the road.
                            Which makes me think there may have been more to the Justin Turner move. It was a few hunderd K but yet they sign Colon for $10MM a year. For a cheap franchise this is inconsistent behavior.

                            Justin Turner is doing great in LA. I am glad for him, but I think that getting the boot to his ass is partly what helped turn his career around. Should the Mets have kept him here? Probably. Could anyone forsee what he has been the past two seasons? If anyone tells you yes they are lying.

                            I'm sorry I am just not going to go crazy over a guy that had a .689 OPS through his age 28 season. He turned it around and we can say stuff happens.
                            Last edited by Paulypal; 06-30-2015, 12:59 PM.

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Paulypal View Post
                              Which makes me think there may have been more to the Justin Turner move. It was a few hunderd K but yet they sign Colon for $10MM a year. For a cheap franchise this is inconsistent behavior.

                              Justin Turner is doing great in LA. I am glad for him, but I think that getting the boot to his ass is partly what helped turn his career around. Should the Mets have kept him here? Probably. Could anyone forsee what he has been the past two seasons? If anyone tells you yes they are lying.

                              I'm sorry I am just not going to go crazy over a guy that had a .689 OPS through his age 28 season. He turned it around and we can say stuff happens.
                              And who on the Mets is the Adrian Gonzalez for Turner to hit in front of?

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by LI METS FAN View Post
                                And who on the Mets is the Adrian Gonzalez for Turner to hit in front of?
                                Batting order is usually irrelevant. Sometimes protection even hurts.

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